Judge Bans Shunning (page 6)

Focus

Heaven wrote:

Im thinking the WTS would probably add an "its up to your own conscience" shunning practice so as not to be as direct, avoid responsibility but still continue to make the witnessess feel guilty as hell if they associate with nonbelievers.

That is far more probable than actually dropping shunning entirely in the forseeable future.

For the fear of everlasting shunning, expecially by loved ones:
a\ Keeps many who have begun to see the light within the Tower, afraid that they will lose all they love if they speak out, and
b\ Prevents many who saw the light and left or were thrown out from educating those they still trapped, who will not even hear them.

Shunning is the most powerful weapon in the wicked Borg's armory.

Which is why even a chink here is excellent news.

--
Focus
(Education of the Judiciary Class)

Solace

Focus,

Unfortionatly, I have to agree.

Hey, we can still dream though, cant we?

Focus

Heaven:

Focus,
Unfortionatly, I have to agree.
Hey, we can still dream though, cant we?

And dreams may become reality, through the one tool that works against the Borg - legal action.

In my opinion, judicial opinion tends to cycle, to swing like a very slow pendulum. Absolute "rights to religious belief" as espoused by the judiciary have been interpreted repeatedly by courts as, in effect, allowing the leaders of religions to swindle, manipulate, control and spoil the lives of individuals, free from any consequences of their deceit and callousness.

But.... times they are a changing.

Here - especially for those spawn of Satan who run and manage the WTS:

Come gather round people wherever you roam
And admit that the waters around you have grown
And accept it that soon you'll be drenched to the bone
If your time to you is worth saving
Then you'd better start swimming or you'll sink like a stone
For the times, they are a changing

Come writers and critics who prophesize with your pens
And keep your eyes open, the chance won't come again
And don't speak too soon, the wheel's still in spin
And there's no telling who that it's naming
Oh the loser will be later to win
For the times, they are a changing

Come senators, congressmen, please head the call
Don't stand in the doorway, don't block up the hall
For he that gets hurt will be her that has stalled
The battle outside raging will soon shake your windows
And rattle your hall
For the times, they are a changing

Come mothers and fathers all over this land
And don't criticize what you can't understand
Your sons and your daughter are beyond your command
Your old role is rapidly aging
Please get out of the new one if you can't lend a hand
For the times they are a changing

The line, it is drawn, the curse, it is cast
The slow one will later be fast
And the present now will soon be the past
The order is rapidly fading
The first one now will later be last
For the times, they are a changing

With thanks to Bob Dylan (and Warner Bros.,Inc.). By coincidence this user of the Bible also penned All Along the Watchtower:

"There must be some way out of here," said the joker to the thief
"There's too much confusion, I can't get no relief.
Businessmen, they drink my wine, plowmen dig my earth,
None of them along the line know what any of it is worth."

"No reason to get excited," the thief, he kindly spoke,
"There are many here among us who feel that life is but a joke.
But you and I, we've been through that, and this is not our fate,
So let us not talk falsely now, the hour is getting late."

All along the Watchtower, princes kept the view
While all the women came and went, barefoot servants, too.
Outside in the distance, a wildcat did growl,
Two riders were approaching, the wind began to howl.

While I have no reason to believe Dylan had the WTS specifically in mind, the applicability of much of this is obvious to many. And may the wicked ones reap the coming whirlwind.

--
Focus
(Approaching Strider... Class)

justhuman

Good news

Bad the Dubs will still follow what the Org is saying

hawkaw

This is not a big case and it is nothing new.

When it comes to children, may it be the blood doctrine or the shunning issue, the "state" looks out to determine what is best for the child. Because the child's health and welfare are on the line, the state can use it as a "trump card" over religious freedoms in the constitution.

Note the judge's words ..

......"In summary, shunning must cease immediately because these children have already been harmed by the practice. Though the Jehovah's Witness Church has the right to shun certain individuals, in this case, the practice has damaged small children. .....

So the Judge is saying keep on "shunning" those ADULT JW's because they (supposedly) voluntarily joined this religion that allows for shunning if the adult leaves. But when children are involved in a divorce case, the Judge will look out for what is in the best interest of the children and thus, can order the shunning be stopped against the mother to protect the welfare of the children.

It is just like those blood doctrine cases where the state intervenes, the court must look after the "child's interests" and thus, the court can side step the religious issues to protect the child.

I don't think it's nothing new.

hawk

144thousand_and_one

Farkel,

I think it's important to note that the jurisdiction of the court that issued this opinion is limited to the parties that were before it (i.e. the divorced/ing husband and wife). Therefore, even though the court was quoted as saying the "shunning must cease immediately," and "this Court hereby issues an order prohibitting 'shunning,'" it was putting the duty of compliance upon the father, not the Jehovah's Witnesses. The court has no legal jurisdiction over the Watchtower corporations in this matter whatsoever as they were not a party to the case. However, as it relates to the specific parties in this case, it appears to be a powerful victory that may be challenged by the father (possibly with WT legal support, but it's doubtful such a challenge would succeed). I believe that the mother could make a strong argument that even bringing the child to the meetings would violate the court's order, since bringing the child to the meeting would expose the child to the harmful effects of shunning. It is encouraging to see that at least one family law judge is wise enough to recognize that exposing children to the WT can be harmful to them . I'm looking forward to reading the entire opinion - please post it if you can.

LDH

Now, if we could get some raw, unedited footage showing Daddy engaging the children in shunning Mommy.....

wouldn't that be priceless?

Lisa

Sneaky as Hell when I need to be Class

Lin

I would love to think that court decisions like this one would have a big impact on jw's, but I just don't think so. Even if there was a new law, with stiff punishments, requiring no shunning, I don't see it doing much. Just think about all the jw's who have already given their lives for things the G.B. required. I think the jw's would simply quote that scripture about obeying God's law vs. man's, and things will go on as usual even if it means going to jail for it. Heck, my dad went to jail for not going into the army years ago. I don't see much happening as far as real changes. I'd like to think so, but I just can't see it.

Farkel

I will not be able to post any more relevant documents, except perhaps some excerpts from affidavits until an upcoming hearing is held and decided. It's coming soon, though.

I will say this, though: one of the children involved was or is in counseling and the therapist has told the mother the child is suicidal as a result of the shunning and hate spewed against the mother in front of that child.

Hawkaw,

I disagree that this is "no big deal." Religions do not have unlimited freedoms when it comes to practicing their religion in the US. No matter how strongly they feel it should part of their religion, they can't have ritual murders, cannibalism or virgin sacrifices, for example.

There ARE limits; it's just a matter of degree where they begin and where they end.

The amount of harm done to a child who has become "suicidal" over an inhuman religious practice could lead to other rulings on shunning that would perhaps even be broader.

The 4/15/88 Awake pp 26-31 all-but-bragged about how the WTS has its LEGAL RIGHT to shun, and discussed a case where a women won in a lower court, but that it was overturned in all the higher courts. If you read the article, you might sense (as I did) the WTS rubbing their RIGHT to shun in anyway they please right in the noses of their terrified membership.

But that was before it became public knowledge that they are more-than-willing to do the same thing to children who are raped and who state they are going to take their rapist to the authorities.

Times-are-changing. Whether it happens soon or in the distant future, shunning as it is now practiced will HAVE to stop, or the society is doomed to become an even more irrelevant little cult than they are now, IMO.

Farkel

jasnowidz

Jehovah's Witnesses Exposed - http://www.bible.ca/jw.htm
Exposes the history of the organization, the prophecy blunders, deceptive quotive, doctrinal flip flops, and corruption within the Jehovah's Witness organization.

Judge Bans Shunning

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