For those who don't believe in God

by freedom96 45 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Jesika

  Being raised a JW I was always told their was a god. I had no reason to think otherwise. It was accepted just like I accepted the sun would rise the next day.

  As I got older (about 12) I started to doubt their was a god. I never "felt" his presence when I would pray. I felt like I was talking to myself and in doing that I would figure things out on my own. Almost like I was giving myself therapy but didn't have the education or knowledge to know all the right answers. I think as humans we have a distiction we learn when we are young to know the difference in right and wrong. If we are struggling with a decision, does praying about it influence our choices? or is it like writing it in a journal and taking a step back and then making that decision. I honestly don't feel that praying about something sways our choices, I think with enough pondering over decisions, we would have made that choice whether you pray or evalute it closely to come to a decision you are comfortable with or think is the best one.

  The god I was taught about as a child isn't a loving god. Which is not something I will devote my life to.

  I commonly use this as an example of why I don't believe in "god".

  Greek mythology, was not called mythology back then. It was a religion or belief system. People honestly thought these gods where watching over them. Some were evil and some had tempers and some very kind and merciful. Later this belief system was thrown out or evolved into something else. So, now we look back and think it is "funny" that people actually believed this. So, now it is mythology.

  The Egyptians also had "gods". Things they couldn't explain or understand had a "god" behind it. But this was their belief system. You couldn't go back in time and convice them this was false.

  As time goes on and belief systems are "proven wrong", how can you convince me in another 1000-5000yrs Christianity won't become mythology??????

  The bible was written by people who couldn't explain things and so, they gave explainations to things they didn't understand.

  If I were to go back in time and tell people that we could watch a leader of another country across the world giving a speech as he was giving the speech-- watching it inside a little box, this would have been called a miricle. Today we call it TV.

  Since we can't go back in time and see what these people "saw" and why they wrote the stories down, how do we honestly know these "miricles" don't have a perfectly good explaination?

  All I know is I think the bible is nothing more than stories or fables. I don't think it is inspired by anything but imagination.

  That is why I don't believe in god.

  One last example...............................If a woman thinks she is pregnant, and has talked herself into being pregnant (without a test first) then her body starts showing physical signs of being pregnant(I know, it has happened to me). So, if you talk yourself into believing there is a god, then you can talk yourself into "feeling his presence".

  I for one would have to pretty much be slapped in the face to believe in god, by god.

  I am a good person and if judgement day comes and I am not spared, I don't want to worship this god anyway.

  Jesika----of the ---I think I am agnostic class
• 

  Mackin

  Freedom96:

  When we were witnesses, we certainly believed in God.

  You are making an assumption here.

  I was born & raised a JW but I never really believed in God. Even when I was giving public talks from the platform I knew in my heart of hearts that I didn't believe in god. I was just going thru the motions. I was locked into a system of religious belief that I couldn't get out of.

  As has already been stated in this thread, there is no substantial evidence of the existence of some kind of superior creator god. God is something humans have invented to fill a need. We've invented him to provide an answer to hard questions we can't yet answer. I say, "can't yet answer" because in times past god has been given the credit for a lot of things we now can explain with science. In time we will be able to answer all the hard questions with factual evidence. What will we do with god then?

  Mackin.
• 

  acsot

  Gedanken & StinkyPantz: Thanks. I've got more to read now (other things I'm interested in also) than all the dub stuff combined!
• 

  AlanF

  For me, it was first a realization that a lot of JW claims about science, evolution and so on were nonsense. I believed in God for a long time, even after realizing how messed up the Watchtower is. After awhile, and after attempting to defend my beliefs on the old talk.origins Usenet forum, I realized how badly I had been duped by the cult, and how little I really knew about science. Then I got mad at God for deceiving me. Finally I realized that the God of the JWs is entirely imaginary.

  I'm thoroughly agnostic now. I do not know if there is a Creator, but I know that there is no Biblical God.

  AlanF
• 

  Abaddon

  I no longer believe in any god because I can find no proof for god. I am not saying I can prove that gods do not exist, but then again, you cannot prove the invisable giant purple kangaroo that is always with me does not exist either.

  If there is no proof that any god exists, and there IS a god, or gods, then they have really gone out of their way to make it impossible to prove they exist. Having gone to this trouble, if they then want something of me, I think I can safely say that they're an asshole. I do not accept Pascal's Wager, that if we cannot know whether a god exists or not, then it's better to believe in a god, just in case. That way lies insanity.

  So, either there are no gods, or they are assholes.

  I have a thing about worshiping assholes...

  So, as it's rather illogical and silly that there are any forms of god who have made it impossible to prove they exist and then expect something of us, I'm quite happy to say I don't believe in god.

  My belief in god was presuppositional. God existed, therefore. Of course, not only was I supposing that there was a god, I was supposing that I knew the God, which is a supposition upon a supposition. There's no more proof for one god or gods than there is for another, so who's to say, if there is a god, who's got the right one, if there IS a RIGHT one.

  I lost this belief because I learn about the shallowness and ignorance behind many of what I thought were 'proofs' of god's existance. I realised there is not one shred of proof from the dawn of time that the Universe is teleological, that is, has a purpose, design, plan, whatever. Everything that is measurable is explainable by science, bar the most esoteric things (FTL communication of entagled particles, e.g.). The development and future of the Universe, the Milky Way, the Sol System, our planet, its environment, the organisms on it, its elemental constitution, is all a concequence of natural law.

  There are things that cannot be explained. Just like cavemen thought lightning was supernatural, and how a mobile phone would get you burnt as a witch less then three hundred years ago. But in all of this inexpicability, is there anything cohesive enough to label god? Or or we just not seeing how it actually works yet, how we don't see that this is so because that is such and this is that?

  Mistakes are made, theories are refined, but in all of this, is there ONE trace of anything callable by the name 'god', let alone 'God'?

  I know that whilst there is no proof for god or gods or any divine plan, there is a lot of belief. Which is fine, for some of you maybe, but not for me. "Do wot yea will, but do yea no harm". I'd no sooner force you to think what I think than I would have you do the same to me, and would no sooner constrain your activities unless they were harmful, than expect you to constrain mine unless my actions were harmful.

  So speaks the cheerful Nihilist. Just because existance is meaningless doesn't mean you can't GIVE it meaning. THAT is what being human is about. If god gives your life meaning, I'm very happy you have that as a belief and a guide, and hope you will be happy for me in my life.
• 

  IslandWoman
• 

  crownboy

  ascot, an excellent site for explaining evolution to the layman is:

  http://www.talkorigins.org/

  Hell, that's the site I first went to.

  This is a general overview of evolution, but there is much more in the archives to read besides it, of course:

  http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-intro-to-biology.html

  My path to non-belief was gradual; from strong JW, to liberal JW, to liberal christain "who does not believe in religion, only the bible", to deist, to agnostic, and now to weak atheist (or as I call it "agnostic atheist". But I am a darn strong atheist when it comes to biblegod). Most of the stuff other posters have said also applies to me; as I educated myself more about other religions, past cultures, about science, and about the bible itself (its pagan connections, unscientific claims, etc.), I began to realize just how human and non supernatural the whole "religion thing" is. When people could not explain something, they posited "god" as the answer, but god disappeared as soon as someone who challenged the dogma showed how natural processes explained a phenomena. If rulers wanted to keep "the people" in check, there was(/is) no better way to do this than to threaten them with the wrath of god.

  Of course, having doubts about the JW's is what started the ball rolling. Once I knew that the JW's were wrong, I began to allow the questions that I always had at the back of my mind about god to come to the surface. If I could be analytical about the JW's, why not the bible? I realized the answers I had been taught were unsatisfactory, and that the answers that mainstream Christanity had were equally as bad. I read apologetic books like the popular Josh McDowell book(The Evidence that Demands a Verdict), and the Lee Stroubel (TheCase for Faith) book as well, but I knew I was in trouble when I was able to so easily refute many of the arguments they presented with little difficulty and nary any research. Thus I stopped believing in the bible's god. My journey from deist to where I am now was alot less defined. As I started to parse out my philosophy more, I just sort of realized I didn't really believe anything anymore. Even after I stopped believing the bible, I would still occasionally pray to some non descript entity, but then one night I as I was about to do this, I asked myself "why am I doing this? I don't really think anyone is hearing me." And then the epithany of non belief totally hit me. So, here am today .
• 

  Valis

  I don't believe in Dog at all. I'm not sure that I ever have, except to have the fears that all JWs walk around with like thinking the end is near...I don't think though that is really believing in an almighty. I also find that people often require a reason to belieive many times they actually do believe....this doesn't prove there is one either....People who don't normally pray have some crisis and suddenly find themselves praying...and things might get better and POOF! evidence Jehovah exisits! Simply not enough for me...I think I'll stick to non belief till me and Dog have a one on one... If there were a creator I think I like Bertrand Russell's take on it..

  I observe that a very large portion of the human race does not believe in God and suffers no visible punishment in consequence. And if there were a God, I think it very unlikely that he would have such an uneasy vanity as to be offended by those who doubt his existence. (W.A.)

  More Bertrand Russell quotes on Religion here..

  http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=31885&site=3

  I also agree with T_H about learning how to make humans live longer and have better lives. Until we can significantly improve the human condition, mankind will never have the time to really examine what\who Dog might be, much less comprehend something that would explain not only our origin, but that of all living things.

  edited cuz I'm stooopid sometimes...

  Sincerely,

  District Overbeer

  Edited by - Valis on 9 January 2003 19:11:29
• 

  Siddhashunyata

  Belief, the process itself , was invalidated by the irony of the WTBTS EXPERIENCE. So I was left with the question, is belief all there is ? The answer is no. There is another way to find out what is going on. However, it requires that one investigate ones own mind. This is not easy but the results are profound. Each must do this for himself. It is a way of "knowing" not a way of "believing ".
• 

  William Penwell

  I believe that we have made God in our image. It is not that I don't believe in God but a religious experience is something that is personal. I don't need some religion telling me how to believe in God. We have been separated at birth from that divine source and it takes us a life time to understand that we are all creations of God but we are all part of that divinity.

  Will