Belching Gun on Fitzwater Case

by AlanF 33 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

AlanF

Hi IW,
: If this is true then why did they disfellowship Dunlap? He was not just an elder but a member of the Brooklyn elite ( lots of holy spirit there), in addition Ray Franz was of the anointed! can't get much more holy spirit appointed than that!
You're missing my point. I wrote: "Since Fitzwater was a molester of long standing when he was appointed a pioneer, Ministerial Servant and most importantly an elder, it would seem that "holy spirit" managed to appoint a serial molester to positions of respect and authority within the JW organization."
The point is that JW leaders try to cause the JW community to believe that elders are directly appointed by holy spirit. If that were true, then "holy spirit" would not have appointed an undiscovered molester like Dan Fitzwater to a position of authority within "God's organization". The fact that Fitzwater was so appointed is positive proof that "holy spirit" has nothing to do with the appointment of elders. The Governing Body cannot afford to admit to the JW community that this is so, even though they themselves are well aware of it. This is what makes their responsibility so grave -- they knowingly deceive the JW community in order to hold onto their position of authority, and the perks that go along with it.
Dunlap and Franz were never guilty of "secret sins" like Fitzwater was. When they were appointed to their position as elder, or in Franz's case as a GB member, they were "free of accusation". Thus it's easy for the Society to claim that they became turncoats against Jehovah. It's like with Jesus: He appointed apostles, including Judas who later "went bad" and betrayed Jesus. That wasn't Jesus' fault; it was Judas' fault. But if Jesus had appointed as an apostle a man who was guilty of some serious and continuing sin, then it would prove that Jesus had no supernatural knowledge, and was a charlatan.
It's the same thing with the child molesting former GB member Leo Greenlees, who the GB convicted of molesting a ten year old boy in late 1984. They decided he was repentant, and let him go out into the JW community as a special pioneer. Now, Greenlees was about 70 years old at the time. It is not possible that a man of that age just up and started molesting a young boy, and then got caught on his first foray. That's not how molesters work. Thus it is certain (and this has been confirmed by various people who have commented in online forums over the years) that Greenlees had a history of molesting young boys, and almost certainly had homosexual relations with adults. If Greenlees had a long history of this, then his appointment as an elder and a GB member were not done by "holy spirit" according to the Society's own doctrines. Thus it seems that the GB's leniency towards Greenlees was entirely self-serving, since if they had to admit to the Bethel community -- and these things get around Bethel -- that Greenlees' appointment were not by "holy spirit", then neither was theirs. They realized that they had to keep everything under wraps as much as possible, or their authority would be terribly undermined.
: There must be something more going on here on their part than just a defense of the "holy spirit" appointment of Fitzwater.
I recently learned that Dan Fitzwater threatened to sue the Society if they DF'd him, because he thought that they didn't have two witnesses to any of the molestation accusations. So he denied the charges, and the Society's hands were tied. If this is true, then it proves a major point: The Society's claim that two witnesses to separate molestation events are sufficient to establish guilt is false in practice in molestation cases, because in the words of the CO who wrote the letter I posted, he knew of 17 accusations. And that is precisely what the experience of many molestation victims has been -- the Society fails to follow the policy stated in the Flock book. This of course is grossly hypocritical, because we all know that it only takes two witnesses to two instances of a JW smoking to get the smoker DF'd. Where are the priorities of these men, when they selectively apply a rule like this? What is worse? Smoking cigarettes or molesting a dozen or two children? Obviously Watchtower leaders have not considered molestation to be a serious crime, but a minor indulgence by some of their male members.
AlanF
Nathan Natas

Well said, Alan!
Micah 6:11 - "Shall I count them pure with the wicked balances, and with the bag of deceitful weights?"
Big Tex

This is exactly the type of case that can, and will, cost WTS a lot of money and bad publicity. It seems that the only way to force change is to hit them in the pocketbook. Much like the Catholic Church. And like the Catholics, this is concrete evidence of the higher ups knowing of a pedophile problem and actively covering it over. How many other situations identical to this one are scattered around the country. There are few truly evil things in the world. This is one of them.
On a gut level, I have a hard time understanding how someone could hear of a child being in such distress as attempting suicide from repeated rapes and then do nothing. Actually, they aren't guilty of just inaction they went to the other extreme and actively helped this "thing" that was hurting children. Intellectually I understand the motivation and the various machinations involved, but emotionally this is hard for me to understand. How do you look at yourself in the morning? How do you justify this to yourself and twist logic around to such a degree so that you can live with yourself? There has to come a time when you can't sleep and it's the middle of night, and this event (and all the others like it) has to come crashing down on your conscience. Doesn't it? Maybe it's better that I don't understand people who protect pedophiles.
Who is worse, the pedophile who rapes a child or the man who helps the pedophile stay free and continue his rampage? The older I get the more I begin to appreciate why the concept of hell was invented. Sometimes death is just not enough of a punishment.
DannyBear

Alan,
I know they made a big deal of the 'spirit appointed' claim back in the 60's, actually pulling Cong Servants at the time, back to Giliead School for a special indoctrination of these claims.
My brother-in-law came back from that school with graphs and charts, they depicted in graphic form just how the 'holy spirit' flowed and from whom to whom. I remember listening to him recount the experience, even as a neophyte 'servant', and saying to myself 'this is really hard to swallow'. But as any good jw is inclined to do, just accepted it as 'the truth'. I could tell my brother-in-law had some unstated reservations himself.
Damning evidence indeed.
Do you suppose, that guilty child molester's or any other serious law offender, who finds himself up for appointment as an elder or ms, uses this doctrine of 'spirit appointment' as an indication that Jehovah has forgiven him for his malfeasance? I bet it happens daily.
What better way to obsolve your conscience for any misconduct........even better than the Catholic confessional.
Danny
IslandWoman

Hi Alan,
You're missing my point. I wrote: "Since Fitzwater was a molester of long standing when he was appointed a pioneer, Ministerial Servant and most importantly an elder, it would seem that "holy spirit" managed to appoint a serial molester to positions of respect and authority within the JW organization."
Alan, I believe most publishers would not even think to ask why the holy spirit appointed an evil elder even in a case as obvious as this one. The Watchtower's claim of holy spirit appointment is kept murky enough to allow for all sorts of exceptions and even human error.
They used to claim direct appointment by holy spirit through the GB, now it's claimed to be by holy spirit because the qualifications for an "older man" are written in the scriptures and the prayerful use of that holy spirit inspired guide by the elder body to qualify a brother then becomes the basis for referring to his appointment as an appointment made by holy spirit. If the elder body makes a mistake, it is not because the spirit made a mistake but because the elder body did not carefully and prayerfully follow the directions of the holy spirit. This gets the HS off the hook!!
This is how it was when my husband served as an elder, it's possible they have changed that though.
IW
Edited by - IslandWoman on 12 January 2003 14:54:38
AlanF

: Do you suppose, that guilty child molester's or any other serious law offender, who finds himself up for appointment as an elder or ms, uses this doctrine of 'spirit appointment' as an indication that Jehovah has forgiven him for his malfeasance? I bet it happens daily.
: What better way to obsolve your conscience for any misconduct........even better than the Catholic confessional.
Astute observations, DannyBear.
IW, your explanation of how the JW organization explains the operation of "holy spirit" is correct in principle, but not in practice. That principle is exactly what a careful reading of various Watchtower articles on the subject say. However, those same articles also bury this technical explanation under a pile of bullpucky that convinces the average JW that under normal circumstances the "holy spirit" directly influences the appointments and decisions of elders. I've argued with several JW elders about this very thing. It amazed me that they could read the WT's technical explanation, but then immediately point to the bullpucky and say, "See? Elders are directly appointed by holy spirit!" Only when you point out a glaring example proving that this appointment doctrine is nonsense will the average JW start fishing around for excuses. Then they'll hit upon the excuse that the Society really teaches that the appointment is by "holy spirit" only in the sense that it's based on the spirit-inspired Bible. But once again, after the crisis has passed, this same JW will forget about this and go back to thinking that the "holy spirit" makes direct appointments. Again, I know how this works because this is how it has happened with several elders I've discussed this with over a period of years. This is the power of Watchtower doublespeak which produces JW doublethink. This power to deceive is what needs to be broken.
AlanF
Axelspeed

You are correct. It is kept pretty murky, enough to mislead as to what is really being said. Many JWs confuse the words "annointed" as opposed to "appointed" as used by the WT. When the WT says that elders are appointed by HS, most incorrectly make a leap from "annointed" to "appointed" in thier own minds and assume they mean the same thing ( maybe because of the similarity in spelling), and conclude that elders are somehow "annointed" directly by HS, which is not at all what is technically being stated. Whether this flawed and misleading conclusion being reached is by design or not is what is up for debate. Even when the word is understood to be appointed, the meaning is kept murky enough to be misuderstood by most(by design or not?). If you read carefully what is being said is that elders are appointed ONLY to the extent they meet the qualifications as set out in the Bible, as determined by the BOE. There are no mystical signs or portents involving HS laying hands on any elder. The body, fallible men, and how they see a prospective elder measuring up to those "inspired" qualifications, make the determination.
DannyBear

Alan & Axel,
Doublespeak comes so natural to the average jw, they hardly recognize it when imbibing. If the body of elder's are in fact using the Bible as an 'inspired' director of thier choices, then why the need for a rubber stamp from the wtbs?
This 'rubber stamping' by the Service Desk, is in fact what provides the muscel backing up the appointment.
***JW will forget about this and go back to thinking that the "holy spirit" makes direct appointments. Again, I know how this works because this is how it has happened with several elders I've discussed this with over a period of years***
This is oh so true. One sure fire way to test the validity of this common assumption, is for any active jw male or female (not 'appointed' as an elder) to challenge, question, or otherwise show disrespect for the opinions, statements, or assertions of ANYONE so 'appointed'!
No question about it, they argue semantics, but in practice they hold to the firm conviction, that all elder's are directly appointed by 'spirit'.
Danny
IslandWoman

Alan,
This power to deceive is what needs to be broken.
This I can agree with! Anyone's power to deceive should and must be broken.
IW
waiting

Just saw this thread - and read it with such sorrow & anger. Shame also that I used to willingly belong to such a blood-sucking company.
As to the topic......so much damage done to so many families. 17 children KNOWN to be molested/raped. Many victims won't come forward, now or ever, if normal percentages of police statistics are followed. But the damage done to those children & their families is sometimes beyond repair.
May he rot in prison for the rest of his life. And may the WTBTS and local elders lose thousands, if not millions, of dollars for their viewpoint that molestation & rape of children is not really a crime. Perhaps "loose conduct" like masturbation? Btw, there are people & nations who believe the same way - even by today's standards.
waiting

Belching Gun on Fitzwater Case

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