The abuse of JW org

by wozza 22 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

• 

  StephaneLaliberte

  the deliberate weaponization of the rule. - Vidiot

  But, they DO NOT WANT THE AUTHORITIES INVOLVED. - Biahi

  The weaponization happens when they don't get the police involved and Biahi is 100% right! Before, the elders could literally disfellowship someone who reported the abuse to the authorities.

  Since 2019, however, they've updated their policy to instruct elders not to prevent anyone from reporting abuse. Clearly, they wrote this because, before, they actually did prevent victims from reporting!

  Since 2019, they changed the rules instructing elders not to prevent anyone from reporting abuse. This change shows they used to actually prevent victims, through disciplinary actions, from going to the police!

  Also, that change doesn't go far enough. Elders can still talk victims out of reporting. One elder might not say anything, but another might pressure the victim to safeguard Jehovah's reputation and see their experience as some holy martyrdom!

  The elders aren't capable, either physically, legally or competently to collect the necessary evidence. - Anonymous

  They should alert the police and let them investigate, then base their actions on what that investigation reveals. - TonusOH

  Absolutely right!

  Way I see it, the problem at its core is not the two-witness rule, but how JWs do involve the police or, for the very least, advise the sexual abuse victims to do so.
• 

  Anony Mous

  The elders still don't report unless there is a 2-witness rule satisfied, from what I know that is still the case. If there is only 1 witness, they have to report to the branch and await instructions, which are nearly always to do nothing unless legal requirements which then must be done through an anonymous report that does not mention the JWs (basically the elder must report as a private citizen).

  In many cases the police can find multiple witnesses, despite the elders not having 2 witnesses that voluntarily and at the same time come forward about the same event (which is the standard for the 2-witness rule).

  I do believe the two-witness rule is to blame for the above, the elders should be mandatory reporters like every single other organization has learned in the past few decades, Catholic Church, Scouts, private and public healthcare workers, childcare, most Judeo-Christian denomination etc, all of them are now mandatory reporting even where jurisdictional it is not required - the only ones that are largely consistent in not reporting are Muslims, JWs, Mormons and various other sects or cults.
  
• 

  KerryKing

  It is nearly always men who insist that women can only receive justice when she provides a witness.

  It is men who seem to be so convinced that women often bring false charges, statistically this is actually very rare.

  Women who report a rape, are usually dismissed by the police, with or without evidence from DNA etc.

  The system is wired against women and is getting worse, specifically in Europe, where rape victims are often accused of being racist, and hence dismissal.

  I am afraid for my young daughter seeing how the patriarchy is gaining force worldwide, women's rights look good on paper but are not enforced whatsoever, from the very top down.

  WT is just another organisation, like thousands more, who are happy with the status quo, because it is led by men exclusively.
• 

  Anony Mous

  @Kerry: we were talking about children but since you brought it up - 80% of contested family court cases include the allegation of abuse through a request for protection on the side of the female, only 5% of those prove to be substantiated sufficiently that it is further investigated.

  These allegations are ‘standard language’ as they predispose the court towards the female when it comes to custody - basically, they are often used to exclude the father for months or years while the case is ongoing, and then the best interest of the child is often to maintain the status quo because it has been too long (9-24 months is typical) and the relationship is broken despite the fact that all this was legal footwork.

  I agree with your statement about the EU becoming even more of a hellhole third world country because of mass immigration.

  But third wave feminism and easy birth control has caused a lot of the problems women face today. If you accuse someone over a bad one night stand, then all other accusations become less believable as well. The problem starts with the choice to have serial one night stands with random strangers, it is not empowerment, you are objectifying yourself and men.
• 

  jhine

  I'm British and l can categorically say that Britain for one has not become a hellhole 3rd world country .

  Have you been here recently? Where do you get this information from ?

  Back to the topic. I'm ruddy positive that the two witness rule doesn't and shouldn't apply to this situation. Who on earth is going to sexually assault or rape a child in front of someone else who isn't a fellow paedophile.

  DNA and other evidence obviously helps but very often children need to work up the courage to tell someone about abuse. It maybe that an abused child waits until they are an adult to report an abuser . By then any physical evidence will be gone .

  Jan from Tam
• 

  blondie

  There are many ways the legal entities can use other than 2 eye witnesses to a crime; do it all the time for many types of crimes. The WTS does have access or authority to use this. But the the WTS thinks child sexual abuse is a sin not a crime. Watchtower May 2019 p. 12. "As Jehovah’s Witnesses, we view child sexual abuse as a gross sin and a wicked deed. "
• 

  LongHairGal

  STEPHANE LALIBERTE:

  You say you accept DNA evidence as a witness. But, what if a child was molested maybe more than once but there is No DNA evidence?.. Maybe they didn’t know any better to speak up quickly about it. Where does this leave this poor victim??

  Nah, the Witness religion’s 2-Witness rule with regard to child molestation or rape is just a tactic to keep guilty perpetrators from being prosecuted and punished. That is what I think.
• 

  Vidiot

  Not quite.

  It’s a tactic to keep secular authorities from investigating and scrutinizing the inner workings of the Org, and exposing not just human rights violations, but just how widespread, institutionalized, and endemic their CSA problem is, which would…

  a) …potentially place their charity status and tax-exemption at risk, and…

  b) …too deeply undermine the Org’s claim of being “God’s Exclusive Earthly Organization” amongst the rank-and-file.
• 

  kenmayo1

  GO TO THE POLICE AND REPORT IT!
• 

  wozza

  Hi all ,just after I started this topic a personal family event came up and took up my time ,I checked in to see others had commented thanks for that and sorry for not getting back on here.

  StephaneLaliberte - you seem to have taken liberty to impute to me that I " If you respect the Mosaic law so much, then you would agree with the idea of marrying a rape victim to her rapist, as stated in Deuteronomy 22:28-29".

  How wrong can you be? but you seem to think so much of your opinion when it was not called for in this way.

  You have missed the point entirely of this topic ,for instance I am talking about how the JW org has handled things in the past with regard to the 2 witness rule. You are deflecting away from this by somehow suggesting I would condone rape and selling a woman to the father of that woman then? I could assume that you maybe a ex member of JW org who has hidden their own molestation of children and are spitefully justifying your own filthy life ,but that would be a wrong thing to do would'nt it ,you know to, impute such a thing to a person you don't know?

  My original post was meant to alert anyone having doubts about JW org to think about how they handle such a thing as sexual predators in their midst and point out that they handle things badly and choose to ignore the bibles own words in one part and yet they use a scripture in another part of the bible to make rulings on a serious problem in society and in their society.

  Thanks to everyone else for their comments ,I and others I have known have suffered at the hands of perpetrators and JWorg has been of no help ,instead making peoples lives worse ,this is what I have for years been trying to make this known. But instead JWorg will use the whole bible in one case ("All scripture is inspired and for teaching reproving etc") ,yet on another occasion will say that the Hebrew scriptures have no application in certain matters.

  I for one am glad that the point of my topic was actually raised at the Australian Royal Commission into child sex abuse and the JWorg was exposed as hypocrites in more than one way!

  If someone thinks that JWorg has fixed their problems in this matter ,just remember it only changed when governments have tried fix it firstly by making organisations change their policies and become accountable.