by Brummie 29 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
Nathan,
I have seen pics of the Christmas Tree at Bethel and I have read Daily Manna's with Christmas lists and the suggestion that it would make a nice Christmas gift...so that has not been consistently rejected.
Raven, have you seen this recently? Or a long time ago?
not sure what you are what you asking Blackout ...
I was a JW from 1962-1997, I saw the pics probably in the 70's, 80's, 90's at different times. I believe I last read a Daily Manna about 1987 or so....
of course the pics were from the late-Russell /early-Rutherford eras...but the Q was about consistancy in doctrine and Christmas was mentioned...which of course could not have been consistantly rejected if it was once allowed in Bethel and encouraged in the publications....
hope that answers you.... let me know if it didn't.
Ravyn(of the 'just-got-my-hair-cut-and-it-is-cute' class)
Avoid fornication as it may lead to dancing?
ft
Is "the light gets brighter and brighter" consistent?
Maybe they will discover knew light that tells them the light doesn't get brighter.
Brummie:
The WTS has always stood against the Trinity. This is the earliest quote I could find:
Many have preached right along from the interpolation of 1 John 5: 7, 8, and never informed their hearers that the strange statement that-t was witnessed in heaven, that Jesus was really the Son of God-was not a part of the Word of God; but was introduced by Papacy during the tenth century. Who there needed such witness-did not all in heaven know it? And why did they thus keep the people in ignorance? Because they feared that if people knew this, the only text which gives even a shadow of support to the doctrine of the TRINITY, to be an interpolation to support a papal error, they might renounce the error and believe Jesus’ words. (John 5:20; 8:28; 10:29; 14:28. Rev. 2:27.)--Watch Tower April 1881 (reprints p. 207)
This position was also reiterated in Food for Thinking Christians (1881). I didn't find any comments on the Trinity in Three Worlds (Russell and Barbour co-authored in 1877). Russell's biography (published in the 1916 Watch Tower) indicates that he personally rejected the Trinity before he started the WTS.
Also, Russell did not establish the WTS, or start printing the Watch Tower, until after his split with Barbour.
Craig
Although they no longer advertise it, I don't think they ever actually condemned Miracle Wheat.
Tammy
Craig, thanks for that, I couldnt find the documentation. I remember now that when Russell broke with Barbour he stole the mailing address list for the magazine that Barbour founded (the original 1914 prophecy mag) and used all of Barbours contacts in order to get the WT off the ground. So while Russell worked on a magazine that was Trinitarian it wasnt until he founded the WT that he personally rejected the Trinity (Russell was a trinitarian congregationalist wasnt he?). I dont know how to edit my post? or I could go and edit where I made the mistake.
In saying that, the "Trinity" is not a JW doctrine for them to be consistent in teaching it. However they have been totally inconsistent in their representation of it..i.e. "A 3 headed god"..."3 gods in one".."How can someone be with the father and at the same time be the father"...etc, no consistency there even though it isnt one of their doctrines.
Lol @ Swan + starScream.
Kenneson, YES, as far as I know the "New Light" that changes "present truth" has been consistent from the beginning, certainly emphasised by Russell. It is this "doctrine" of new light that has made them able to be totally inconsistent with every other doctrine! They blame new light for it all.
Francios, yes, thats another one to add to the list thanks! Thats about 3 or 4 things they have been consistent with in the last 100 years, hmmm...not very encouraging is it LOL
Brummie
Brumm:
it wasnt until he founded the WT that he personally rejected the Trinity (Russell was a trinitarian congregationalist wasnt he?).
That's an interesting question. Russell was born in 1852, so the following excerpt from his biography may suggest that he started to question the Trinity as early as 1869:
Reared under the influence of Christian parents, at an early age he became interested in theology, uniting himself with the Congregational church, and became active in local mission work. The doctrine of eternal torment of all mankind except the few elect became so abhorrent to him that at the age of seventeen he was a skeptic. He said, "A God that would use his power to create human beings whom He foreknew and predestinated should be eternally tormented, could be neither wise, just nor loving; his standard would be lower than that of many men." He continued to believe, however, in the existence of God, but was not willing to accept the commonly understood teachings as God’s revelation of himself to man. He turned his attention to the investigation of heathen religions, only to find all of these unsatisfactory.
RR, and others, probably have more better info, but it seems likely that Russell had rejected the Trinity sometime between 1869 and when he started publishing the Watch Tower in 1879.
I remember now that when Russell broke with Barbour he stole the mailing address list for the magazine that Barbour founded (the original 1914 prophecy mag) and used all of Barbours contacts in order to get the WT off the ground.
That's news to me. Perhaps Russell felt he co-owned that list? Do you have a ref? Interesting.
In saying that, the "Trinity" is not a JW doctrine for them to be consistent in teaching it. However they have been totally inconsistent in their representation of it..i.e. "A 3 headed god"..."3 gods in one".."How can someone be with the father and at the same time be the father"...etc, no consistency there even though it isnt one of their doctrines.
Yes. Quite frankly, I now think that the Trinity, mystery and all, is the most "sensible" Biblical interpretation.
btw, to correct my implied chronology--Russell started printing the WT in 1879, established the WTS in 1881, and incorporated the WTS in 1884:
*** w50 7/15 214 Organized Testimony to the New World *** To keep pace with Jehovah’s blessing upon the work Brother Russell organized the Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society, at Pittsburgh, Pa., in 1881 (The Watchtower, April, 1881), and three years later, in 1884, this was incorporated under the laws of the State of Pennsylvania.
Craig
Name just ONE doctrine the Society has been consistent with?
It's been years since I've really thought about this stuff, but what about the absolute authority/autocracy of the Society? The Sin Against the Holy Spirit? Hasn't that always been the worst thing a Witness could do, is apostasy? Turn against God's spirit directed organization?
