Talking with a young elder

by biblexaminer 41 Replies latest jw experiences

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  biblexaminer

  I had a discussion with an elder recently. It was interesting in a macabre sense.

  We were outside the kingdom hall on a nice sunny day recently. He told me that neither he nor his wife had the desire to pioneer. He works full-time so he has an excuse anyway, his wife doesn't need to work (really) but does. So, even though they are 'good dubs' so-to-speak, they practice their religion 'their own way'. But one has to remember that they are still borg, thru & thru. I bet there's a thousand like them.
  

  In any case, the conversation took some turns and I ended up saying that there were things that one never hears from 'inside there' (referring to the kingdom hall). For example, I gave the first century exploits of Paul within the congregation. There he was in Antioch, and there were men who were shoving circumcision down the throats of the Gentile converts.

  I then asked him "Who were these men?... Where did they come from?" (blank stare) Interesting how little elders know about Christianity.

  I began again, "Paul told us exactly who they were and where they came from" (still no response) "It's right there in the Bible" I said... (nothing)

  I said "Paul explained that these men were sent down there by JAMES, from Jerusalem... and it's no wonder then that Jesus sent Paul to Jerusalem to straighten them out... which is why Paul expressed concern saying he didn't want o be 'striking the air' or in other words wasting his time." (quiet elder with eyes wide)
  

  Then I went on to say that "the Watchtower a few years ago said that James was, at the time, the foremen of the governing body... so now we see why Acts records that there was such a big argument when Paul began to talk with them"

  One stunned elder. He had nothing to say. Obviously it was all new to him.
  

  I finished by again mentioning that "it's right there in the Bible, but you won't hear it in there".

  I saw this elder again recently. Seems he has said nothing to anyone about that conversation. Seems we are 'still good'. No semi-shun.

  I hope it eats his insides. Maybe, just maybe, Jesus will get one more.
  
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  wannaexit

  perhaps you have planted a seed an done day he will wake up to it.
  
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  stuckinarut2

  His brain would have been doing backflips trying to compute what was taking place....
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  _Morpheus

  I enjoyed that train of thought! I may look into that as well as something to keep in my back pocket.....
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  Oubliette

  What exactly was the point you were trying to make. It's not very clear.
  
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  wannaexit

  The way I see it there are two kinds of witnesses--the ones that are really dedicated and take everything to heart and then there are those that do whatever the hell they want and being a witness is ritual that is done without any thought.

  It would depend of what kind of witness your young elder is.
  
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  DesirousOfChange

  Once I had been disillusioned, though still an elder, that kind of comment would have had me running home to read the dialog in the Bible, and yes, I would have seen the obvious parallel to the GB today. Seeds planted. Seeds watered. It wouldn't take "God" to make it grow.

  Doc
  
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  _Morpheus

  The point was A) the gb was wrong in the first century and B) paul was not beholden to some imaginary central authority. Neither should dubs today.

  *stating the obvious- im not bible believer but if that pans out then i want to have that in my pocket
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  Oubliette

  Morpheus, that makes sense and was what I got out of it, but the OP isn't clear about the point he wanted to make.

  That being said, a moment's reflection will reveal that the Bible is merely a prop for the WT leadership. They make up their own rules. These are not to be questioned. Questioning them only gets a person in trouble.
  

  It doesn't matter if you can show them they are wrong and use the Bible or even their own publications to prove it. Doing so will only result in the individual being labelled a troublemaker "causing dissent" and possibly end up being disfellowshipped for their trouble.

  There is only one thing a JW needs to do: Listen, obey and be blessed.

  Let's review: It's a cult!

  
  
  
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  _Morpheus

  and you and I totally agree on that ob, no question. Unfortunately I still have some inside that I care about and such a line of reasoning may prompt them to think just enough to see the obviousness of the truth...

  The truth..?

  That you are a slave.. Like everyone else in the organization, you were born into bondage. Into a prison that you cannot taste or see or touch. A prison for your mind.....

  It only takes one chink in the armor. I like to have little things like that to take a chink out if possible