Scriptures That Don’t Fit WT Theology

by Sea Breeze 76 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  Sea Breeze

  @VH7 - You'll never be allowed the privledge of leading out a field service group quoting scriptures like that !

  Hebrews 1
  
  God, who at various times and in diverse ways spoke long ago to the fathers through the prophets, 2 has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, [not the WT or GB) whom He has appointed heir of all things, and through whom He made the world. 3 He is the brightness of His glory, the express image of Himself, and upholds all things by the word of His power. When He had by Himself purged our sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high. 4 He was made so much better than the angels as He has inherited a more excellent name than they.

  
  
  
• 

  Beth Sarim

  Sea Breeze,,😭
• 

  enoughisenough

  1 Thes 5:21 make sure of all things; hold fast to that which is fine. (BUT the only way to make sure is to do your research in JW publications Don't dare look elsewhere.. In fact, you can't even use the Bible as sure if you read in it something that disagrees with the JWs)
• 

  Blotty

  Sea breeze:
  
  the posts I linked cover some of that (admittedly, not all) I AM NOT saying W&H are infallible, however you would be surprised which text it is based on.
  What does "spiritism" have to do with anything? that says nothing. Gods own nation practised idolatry on multiple occasions (While claiming to worship him).. Paul was known to kill christians - the point: people have bad stuff in their past and are still doing bad things even when doing bible translation work, nobody is clean - your claim is irrelevant and proves nothing
  
  
  TTYSF:
  I do not wish to debate trinity - I'm only saying, you have missed critical information that other readers should know
  
  including but not limited to
  - the natural antecedent to "he" (masculine) is "Helper" (masculine) NOT holy spirit (neuter) - see Daniel Wallace's study, I have made a post about it
  Greek antecedents must match the thing they refer back to in number and gender (case is conditional as far as I know)
  + Jesus also said in John 16:25 he had been speaking in comparisons (or parables)

  Why is the holy spirit exempt from this - naturally everything said above is taken as a parable

  If you can find me one scripture where the holy spirit is defined as a "He" and/ or takes a masculine antecedent then you'll have more weight - however I know this isn't possible (The holy spirit may well be a person, but its NEVER called a "He")
  
  - see Moffat and Goodspeeds translations (and other trinitarians) on the "in him" subject - in both these texts Goodspeed translates "in union" same as the NWT
• 

  TTWSYF

  Can we change the opening topic from 'Scriptures that don't fit WT theology' to 'Scriptures that don't fit WT and Blotty's theology"? lol

  Blotty, I think you need to check out what the scriptures actually say opposed to what you have learned through questionable sources. Please see below the passages of John 14;17 that I got from biblehub. This is a listing of numerous bible translations from scholarly sources. They do not list the NWT nor does any other scholarly sources because that translation is not 'the most accurate translation' by any means.

  John 14:17 ►

  CLA LIT CAT ARA STR Modern Translations New International Version the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. New Living Translation He is the Holy Spirit, who leads into all truth. The world cannot receive him, because it isn’t looking for him and doesn’t recognize him. But you know him, because he lives with you now and later will be in you. English Standard Version even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him, for he dwells with you and will be in you. Berean Study Bible the Spirit of truth. The world cannot receive Him, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him. But you do know Him, for He abides with you and will be in you. New American Standard Bible the Helper is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him; but you know Him because He remains with you and will be in you. NASB 1995 that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you. NASB 1977 that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not behold Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you, and will be in you. Amplified Bible the Spirit of Truth, whom the world cannot receive [and take to its heart] because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He (the Holy Spirit) remains with you continually and will be in you. Christian Standard Bible He is the Spirit of truth. The world is unable to receive him because it doesn’t see him or know him. But you do know him, because he remains with you and will be in you. Holman Christian Standard Bible He is the Spirit of truth. The world is unable to receive Him because it doesn't see Him or know Him. But you do know Him, because He remains with you and will be in you. Contemporary English Version The Spirit will show you what is true. The people of this world cannot accept the Spirit, because they don't see or know him. But you know the Spirit, who is with you and will keep on living in you. Good News Translation He is the Spirit, who reveals the truth about God. The world cannot receive him, because it cannot see him or know him. But you know him, because he remains with you and is in you. GOD'S WORD® Translation That helper is the Spirit of Truth. The world cannot accept him, because it doesn't see or know him. You know him, because he lives with you and will be in you. International Standard Version He is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor recognizes him. But you recognize him, because he lives with you and will be in you. NET Bible the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot accept, because it does not see him or know him. But you know him, because he resides with you and will be in you. Classic Translations King James Bible Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. New King James Version the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. King James 2000 Bible Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it sees him not, neither knows him: but you know him; for he dwells with you, and shall be in you. New Heart English Bible the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive; because it neither sees him nor knows him; but you know him, for he lives with you, and will be in you. World English Bible the Spirit of truth, whom the world can't receive; for it doesn't see him, neither knows him. You know him, for he lives with you, and will be in you. American King James Version Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it sees him not, neither knows him: but you know him; for he dwells with you, and shall be in you. American Standard Version even the Spirit of truth: whom the world cannot receive; for it beholdeth him not, neither knoweth him: ye know him; for he abideth with you, and shall be in you. A Faithful Version Even the Spirit of the truth, which the world cannot receive because it perceives it not, nor knows it; but you know it because it dwells with you, and shall be within you. Darby Bible Translation the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see him nor know him; but ye know him, for he abides with you, and shall be in you. English Revised Version even the Spirit of truth: whom the world cannot receive; for it beholdeth him not, neither knoweth him: ye know him; for he abideth with you, and shall be in you. Webster's Bible Translation Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and will be in you. Early Modern Geneva Bible of 1587 Euen the Spirit of trueth, whome the world can not receiue, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye knowe him: for he dwelleth with you, and shalbe in you. Bishops' Bible of 1568 Euen the spirite of trueth, whom the worlde can not receaue, because the worlde seeth hym not, neither knoweth hym. But ye knowe hym: For he dwelleth with you, and shalbe in you. Coverdale Bible of 1535 euen ye sprete of trueth, whom ye worlde can not receaue, for it seyth him not, nether doth it knowe him: but ye knowe him, for he abydeth wt you, & shalbe in you Tyndale Bible of 1526 which is the sprete of truthe whome the worlde canot receave because the worlde seyth him not nether knoweth him. But ye knowe him. For he dwelleth with you and shalbe in you. Literal Translations Literal Standard Version the Spirit of truth, whom the world is not able to receive, because it does not see nor know [this] One, and you know [this] One, because [this] One remains with you, and will be in you. Berean Literal Bible the Spirit of truth, whom the world is not able to receive, because it does not see Him nor know. But you know Him, for He abides with you and He will be in you. Young's Literal Translation the Spirit of truth, whom the world is not able to receive, because it doth not behold him, nor know him, and ye know him, because he doth remain with you, and shall be in you. Smith's Literal Translation The Spirit of truth; which the world cannot receive, for it sees it not, neither knows: and ye know it; for it shall remain with you, and shall be in you. Literal Emphasis Translation The Spirit of truth, whom the world is not able to receive because it does not behold nor know Him. You know Him because He abides with you, and will be in you. Catholic Translations Douay-Rheims Bible The spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, nor knoweth him: but you shall know him; because he shall abide with you, and shall be in you. Catholic Public Domain Version the Spirit of Truth, whom the world is not able to accept, because it neither perceives him nor knows him. But you shall know him. For he will remain with you, and he will be in you. Translations from Aramaic Aramaic Bible in Plain English “He is The Spirit of Truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it has neither seen him nor known him; but you know him, for he dwells with you and he is in you.” Lamsa Bible Even the Spirit of the truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it has not seen him, and does not know him; but you know him because he abides with you, and is in you. NT Translations Anderson New Testament the Spirit of the truth, whom the world can not receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, because he dwells with you, and shall be in you. Godbey New Testament the Spirit of truth: which the world is not able to receive, because it does not see Him, nor know Him: you know Him: because He abideth with you, and shall be in you. Haweis New Testament the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; because he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. Mace New Testament even the spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees nor knows him: but ye shall know him, for he shall dwell with you, and shall be in you. Weymouth New Testament That Spirit the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him. You know Him, because He remains by your side and is in you. Worrell New Testament the Spirit of truth, Whom the world cannot receive, because it beholds Him not, neither knows Him: ye know Him, because He abideth with you, and will be in you. Worsley New Testament even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth Him not, neither knoweth Him: but ye know Him, because He abideth with you, and shall be in you.
• 

  TTWSYF

  That said, more scriptures that don't fit WT [and some peoples'] theology include

  Jeremiah 17;10 New International Version

  "I the LORD search the heart and examine the mind, to reward each person according to their conduct, according to what their deeds deserve."

  This passage says that the Father searches hearts and minds.

  1 Corinthians 2;10 New International Version

  these are the things God has revealed to us by his Spirit. The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God.

  This passage seems to indicate that the Holy Ghost searches the heart and minds.

  Revelation 2;23 New International Version

  I will strike her children dead. Then all the churches will know that I am he who searches hearts and minds, and I will repay each of you according to your deeds.

  This passage says that Jesus searches the heart and minds

  TTWSYF the truth will set you free
• 

  LV101

  Sea Breeze -- question: A textus receptus Bible refers to the new testament? I googled (didn't spend time) but Amazon has section appearing to be only the Christian Greek scriptures.

  One would need a Bible library and endless hrs.
• 

  Sea Breeze

  @LV101 - Yes it is a master Greek Text of the NT. It was the only one in use for centuries until the spiritists Wescott and Hort created another one based on Vaticanus and Sinaiticus.

  One would need a Bible library and endless hrs.

  Not really, just use a well respected translation. But if you want to drill down a litttle deeper use a TR based bible like one of these:

  ​

  1. King James Version - KJV

  2. King James Version ER (Easy Reader) - KJV - ER

  3. New King James Version - NKJV

  4. Modern English Version - MEV

  5. Green's Literal Translation - GLT

  6. Third Millennium Bible - TMB

  7. New Cambridge Paragraph Bible - 2005 edition of the KJV (paragraph format with modernized spelling)

  8. 21st Century King James Bible
• 

  Sea Breeze

  John 10: 18 No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again.

  Jesus resurrected himself from the dead.
  
  John 2: 19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

  20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days? 21 But he spake of the temple of his body.
  
  So, did Jehovah raise Jesus from the dead, or was it the Holy Spirit, or was it Jesus? The answer is YES!
• 

  Vanderhoven7

  Revelation 1:5

  "... Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth. to him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood"