Number of Muslims protesting London terrorist attack = ZERO. Number of Muslims protesting forced Mosque closure in France = HUNDREDS

by kpop 233 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  Simon

  Can we agree that to say someone is a "good Muslim" only if he follows the rules laid out by ISIS (or something very similar), we are making a claim about how that person "ought" to behave and that "ought" must necessarily be derived from some "is"'s about facts of the world (such as the things Muhammed is supposed to have said)

  In other words, this is what you claim to be able to do?

  Well they have this book ... called the Quran ... and then other books that chronicle Mohammed's life that it's adherents are meant to imitate.

  It's not *me* who's defining the rules, I would make better ones that everyone could agree on: like no-fat-chicks.

  Alternatively, is your notion of "a good muslim" unrelated to how a muslim ought to behave?

  I don't understand, that makes little sense to me.

  I think you are taking "a good ..." to mean someone being a good person which is different to "a good ..." being a loyal adherent.

  Being "a good Muslim" by that definition is being a psychopathic killer. You can't be a good Muslim and a good person.

  I'm all for people being lying pretend fake Muslims, we need more of those. Ideally they realize that they are actually ex-Muslims and part of the human race at that point.
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  Simon

  I think ISIS/the Saudis, etc. are wrong on this issue as well and I think it is important to point that out.

  Good for you. Wrong and naive, but good for you.

  The idea that women can't be Muslim unless they cover their hair or wear garments that cover all of their bodies is IMO helping hardline Islamists. Jews and Christians solved that problem (of hardcore literalism) and I think the solution is worth advertising.

  Which doesn't address the issue at all. Christianity and Judaism and most other religions are pliable and can be reformed. Islam cannot. It's basic teaching is that it is complete and perfect. How do you change that while keeping some semblance of validity?

  This is not my argument, other reformers of Islam (both current and former Muslims) are pointing this out.

  They are naive fools, doomed to fail just as people have failed for the last 1,000 years. Islam is irredeemable and cannot be reformed. It needs to be destroyed and made irrelevant in the same way that Nazism was.

  Or do you think you can re-write the Sunnah of Mohammed without anyone noticing?
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  fukitol

  Islam is currently in a phase that Christianity was in about two/three centuries ago.

  It will soon undergo an 'Enlightenment', like Christianity did.
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  smiddy

  Any Muslim found committing an act of terrorism should be sent back to the land of his origin and his family should be sent back also..

  If he or she is born in the country that they have committed an offence of terroism then they and their family should be returned to the country of the parents,

  This is the only way to get through to parents and offspring that their are consequences for acts of terrorism committed in democratic lands. And that the parents need to control their children and make plain to them the cosequences of their actions.That they will ALL be evicted.
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  Landy

  The arguments that say Islam is stuck in the past, 500 years behind Christianity, and fundamentally violent and misogynist do have a lot of merit.

  Where I can’t make the jump is to say that the vast majority of muslims who are normal peace loving people are ‘pretend’ muslims or ex-muslims.

  We need the vast majority of musiims to lead the change and marginalise the extremists, which hopefully they will do given time.

  The main problem we have with that is the west’s foreign policy towards the oil rich countries. The more we bomb them the more we will create martyrs and Angry Young Men. Leaders who have political motivations can manipulate the weak minded more easily using the name of religion, even though it’s a lot more about political aims and psychology.

  The day before yesterday, although it didn’t make the news the US bombed a school in Syria. Although it wasn’t being used a school, it was being used as a shelter for families who’d lost their homes through other bombing raids. 33 men, women and children died. Didn’t even make the fucking news.

  What do you think the young men looking at this going on who lose family are going to think? How ripe for the political picking are they going to be? If it was my family killed by a US bombing raid I’d be in the hills with an AK47. Yes, a lot of these terrorists are home grown, but they still see what’s going on. To them it’s going to be a noble cause. They may still have family in a war zone. Or, as in the cases of Wednesday’s attack he may just be a violent nut job. It appears he was a violent Christian nut job before he became a violent muslim nut job.

  AYM aren’t a religious issue, they’re a political consequence of policy. You only have to look at history to see that.
• 

  Bungi Bill

  The more we bomb them the more we will create martyrs and Angry Young Men.

  This was certainly what happened in South Vietnam; each air raid that caused "Collateral Damage" only created more ready recruits for the Viet Cong. Before that, the French encountered a similar situation in Algeria.

  Who was it that said "Those who forget the lessons of the past are doomed to repeat them"?
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  Ruby456

  Yup bungi Bill -

  and indeed where are the protestors over the number of civilians bombed in Mosul at the recent coalition strike?

  the assumption in the thread title is that there are no Muslims protesting against terrorism alongside the ones who are - perhaps they would need to wear badges or carry banners saying "btw I am Muslim and I am protesting with the others please don't assume we are not protesting against jihadi terrorists who are all muslim"
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  Ruby456

  https://twitter.com/MayorofLondon?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor
  
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  scotsman

  Similar story in Glasgow last year. A Muslim shopkeeper was murdered by another Muslim man for saying things that were not Islamic enough. The local MP organised a vigil for all religious communities to come together in solidarity. Guess how many Muslims turned up?
  Go on have a guess?
  Yep you got it. Not one!

  That's a blatant lie.
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  cofty

  I reported on it here with a link to the article when it happened. Not one single person from the Glasgow mosque turned up. It is possible a few individuals not connected to the mosque did attend .