I saw these at a museum a while back - communion tokens. The minister would visit each home in the parish to ascertain whether they were in good standing and if they were they could receive a communion token which entitled them to receive communion.
NO SUPPORT FOR EXJWS DRAFTED IN UKRAINE
by raymond frantz 37 Replies latest watchtower bible
-
-
raymond frantz
As for me personally? I'd pick up a gun and fight. You invade my country, my home, threaten my family. What else am I supposed to do?
They aren't exactly fighting for their country more like Blackrock and the big corporates that want Ukraine in a perpetual war with Russia. At this point I history the last thing I'd do is send my child to fight a dirty war that started from the West
-
slimboyfat
There’s another aspect worth considering too: that, in past wars, states that have allowed exemptions on religious grounds have insisted on high standards for being included in that exempt category. Any suggestion that non-JWs were attempting to gain exemption from combat on the basis of weak links to the community might undermine ability of the whole community to claim exemption. In past situations, “minister” status has been required as proof of exemption on religious grounds, which JWs have sometimes successfully argued should apply to all JWs because they all preach. If this person was not currently participating in the ministry, for whatever reason, that may have been a significant barrier to him claiming exemption under the banner of JWs. If this is a factor, then the local elders might not wish to get involved in the case, not out of malice, but because of a real danger of putting others at risk if the authorities perceive the category of JWs is being interpreted too liberally for purposes of avoiding combat.
There as so many things we don’t know about the case, or the reasons for the actions, I don’t think there are good grounds for rushing to judgment.
-
slimboyfat
They aren't exactly fighting for their country more like Blackrock and the big corporates that want Ukraine in a perpetual war with Russia. At this point I history the last thing I'd do is send my child to fight a dirty war that started from the West
100% agree. You would not catch me putting my life on the line, or encouraging anyone else to put their life on the line to support US hegemony in a part of the world that should be none of their business. I think a substantial proportion of Ukrainians feel the same about this tragic war that didn’t need to be fought, but this will never be reported in the West. Check out interviews with Jeffrey Sachs and John Mearsheimer for the real deal on this awful, unnecessary war.
-
Riley
They aren't exactly fighting for their country more like Blackrock and the big corporates that want Ukraine in a perpetual war with Russia. At this point I history the last thing I'd do is send my child to fight a dirty war that started from the West
I am of Ukrainian heritage. I am assure you that is absolute and total bullshit.
-
Riley
When the war started there were a number of Ukrainians who didn't really see the harm in becoming part of the Russia, especially in the Eastern part of the country where there was a large Russian speaking minority. This attitude has unequivocally changed as the war drags on. The Russian armies brutality has been most felt in the areas of the country where they may of had some initial support.
The Ukrainian people have been put on " Deaths Ground " . In WW2 the German army was just shocked how hard these people fought for Stalin, considering how brutal he was. You can't liberate people by bombing them. Putin is find out the same thing right now.
-
raymond frantz
am of Ukrainian heritage. I am assure you that is absolute and total bullshit.
Please explain. Didn't Russia made it absolutely clear that NATO should not expand to the Ukraine? What would the USA do if Russia installed nuclear missiles in Canada? We saw what happened when they did in Cuba. I think it sounded a pretty logical request that fell into deaf ears. As regards Ukraine why are they chasing around Europe their citizens to draft them in a war that can't be won? Are you happy with the fact that Ukraine has now become a massive cemetery.Who is the one who is benefiting here? I doubt it's the Ukranian people ..
-
raymond frantz
100% agree. You would not catch me putting my life on the line, or encouraging anyone else to put their life on the line to support US hegemony in a part of the world that should be none of their business. I think a substantial proportion of Ukrainians feel the same about this tragic war that didn’t need to be fought, but this will never be reported in the West. Check out interviews with Jeffrey Sachs and John Mearsheimer for the real deal on this awful, unnecessary war.
Me too
-
Anony Mous
The situation in Ukraine is a bit more complicated, as the Russians were merely interested in annexing pieces that Lenin and Stalin destroyed and turned into Russia by eradication and systematic replacement of the population. Those same places were forced away into Moldova, Ukraine, Georgia etc by the Clinton administration in the wake of the Soviet Union collapsing despite the fact they had no cultural ties to their ‘home country’. Had the people had a true election on the matters, we would’ve seen a bufferzone of places like Transnistria, Donbas etc.
Ukraine’s leadership is interested in the gas and oil and will (as it has recently shown) use western firepower it receives to even invade Russia proper, the response to the Donbas becoming ‘less dependent’ as people may not remember was bombing civil targets (terrorism) in Moscow, likewise with the other regions, you have (often Islamic) factions bombing Russian targets whenever they feel slighted, similar to Hamas attacking Israel whenever they want something.
This is then complicated by the fact that Biden allowed Putin to not only evade Ukraine security (Nordstream 2 in particular) but then also said that if they just invaded a little bit, he wouldn’t have a problem with it. That and the fact that Biden’s family has ties to corrupt Ukraine and Russian oligarchs that are currently profiteering from the European energy crises.
As far as the topic, Ukraine doesn’t recognize JWs or most religious groups or freedoms. Not sure if the WTBTS would have intervened, they likely would have been banned completely which would be an optics problem to the far left media. Should they have, potentially if they are true to their claimed standards, but the current iteration of leadership seems more worried about their ESG score with their Blackrock investment partners (see also COVID) than their followers.
-
Riley
The story of the Ukraine is after gaining independence in 1991, the country remained a Russian puppet state and the poorest country in Europe. In 2014 the people elected a more pro western government wanting some of the prosperously of some Baltic states and former communist countries of Eastern Europe. Putin has a very small penis and has been fucking with the country either since.
To say Russia didn’t want NATO on its borders is total bullshit because Russia already has the Baltic states and now Finland on it border.
Russian propagandists have found Right Wing Pundits in the west to be useful idiots because all they sell it devil's advocate narcissists and rage baiting. A phenomenon they discovered with Covid. Everyone thinks they have peaked behind the curtain and thinks they know more than they do.
There is no reasonable justification for this war. Putin is an asshole and needs to be stop.
As for the unwinnable part, Ukrainians have been killing Russians at a much higher ratio than the difference in populations. Perhaps at a ratio of 7 to 1. Although a terrible lost of life , the fact the line has held for nearly 2 ½ years makes you realize that Ukrainian victory is not totally out of the question.