Hailstone message AND everyone will be saved? Questions

by slimboyfat 144 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Mikejw

  Vidiot that can’t be true because they are openly contradicting themselves.

  Either Jehovah is fair and just or he will slaughter many many good people who Would have had a chance if they died before
  

  We all know good people who just want to live a good life but don’t want anything to do with JWs.
  

  They would be better off dying beforehand? They are so set in their ways they are not going to change or ‘respond favourably’ upto and during Armageddon? Going by this they would be better off dying beforehand.

  But the contradiction is they told us we don’t have to wish these ones would die beforehand but the same time they indicated it would be better for them to die before?

  Either Jehovah is fair and just or he will slaughter many many good people who for whatever reason did not respond favourably as they put it.
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  notsurewheretogo

  You seem to ignore the whole "Jehovah judges" piece and the whole point of Armageddon hasn't changed. Don't get why you think it means what you think when there is zero change to that.

  The article literally is clear Jehovah judges at Armageddon and 99% of the population will be deemed unrighteous. JW's and now those that react during the Great Tribulation may get through.
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  Vidiot

  Mikejw - “…that can’t be true because they are openly contradicting themselves…”

  Bitch, please.

  When’s that ever stopped ‘em?

  😏
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  slimboyfat

  "JW's used to believe you had to be a baptised JW to be saved at Armageddon, now JW's believe baptised JW's and some who react favourably during the Great Tribulation may get saved meaning exJW's, or family members of JW' etc no longer HAVE to die prior to Armageddon to ensure they are in paradise as they now can react to the events of the Great Tribulation favourably and be saved".

  So non believing relatives will have a better chance of surviving because they can still repent after the Great Tribulation has started but they would still need to repent before Armageddon in order to survive? That doesn’t sound like as good a chance as somebody who is resurrected in the new system and has 1000 years to mend their ways. If I was a believing JW I would be disappointed because it sounded like the GB were saying that non believing relatives would have the same chance whenever they died. But if it’s as you describe then wouldn’t many JWs still not wonder if non believing relatives would be better off dying and getting resurrected?
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  notsurewheretogo

  then wouldn’t many JWs still not wonder if non believing relatives would be better off dying and getting resurrected?

  Indeed but the point the GB are making is unbelieving family members do NOT HAVE to die to get saved, there is another route no matter which one is easier or not etc.
  
  
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  Scully

  Vidiot:

  Maybe they phrased it the way they did on purpose to leave enough wiggle room for either possibility.

  😏

  O M G Vidiot! You know they would *never*, *ever* do that! PUH-Lease!!

  
  
  
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  slimboyfat

  Is it worth pointing out that when Rutherford wrote his booklet Millions Now Living Will Never Die there were fever than 100,000 Bible Students worldwide and they expected to go to heaven, not live forever on earth. The “millions” who were expected to survive Armageddon were currently unbelievers who would accept the truth in the new world in large numbers and never die.

  Have I got that right?

  Could Watchtower be working its way back to that “understanding” of millions of non believers surviving Armageddon?
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  Earnest

  slimboyfat : The “millions” who were expected to survive Armageddon were currently unbelievers who would accept the truth in the new world in large numbers and never die.

  Yes, slim, you've got that right. In the convention at Los Angeles in August 1923 Rutherford gave a talk on the parable of the Sheep and the Goats. This was reported on in the October 15, 1923 Watchtower (pp.307-314), the sheep were identified as those in Christendom who were sympathetic towards the Bible Students and their message. It says, on p.313 :

  There is a large number of people in the denominational churches and outside of them who do not claim consecration, but who now see enough of the truth to convince them that the kingdom is at hand and who rejoice in the fact that the King is here. It is not at all unreasonable to conclude that there are millions now hearing about God’s plan of salvation who will pass through the time of trouble and never die, being amongst the first that will have opportunity for a trial for life everlasting.

  An additional thought has occurred to me of the importance that it is no longer necessary for unconverted relatives and friends to die before the Great Tribulation in order to live in paradise. There have been a number of cases where a JW has murdered close relatives. There seems little doubt that the perpetrator was mentally unstable, but even so the thought that he was saving them from eternal destruction (as they would get a resurrection) apparently played a part in some such cases.
  
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  Vidiot

  Wow, Boozerford actually said that?

  Must’ve been one of his better days.
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  Listener

  It’s so interesting reading through this thread.

  The GB/Watchtower/Society come out with some new ideas which contradict what they taught in the past and explain in detail what they once knew but no longer know. At the same time, all of this is from the Bible and Jehovah is revealing it to them.

  How they have the audacity to write, create or approve such things all in the name of God is shameful.