Israel??

by l3gi0n 29 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  mizpah

  Coffee:

  I read somewhere that one speaker suggested that it could be the fundamentalist Moslems who are determined to obliterate Israel and the U.S. But I don't think he was speaking officially for the Watchtower Society and probably just giving other possibilities. But for anyone in the organization any length of time, one will remember how positive the Society was that the Communist forces as lead by the Soviet Union constituted "the king of the north." According to the publications of that time, it was going to "flood over" the territories of "the king of the south" before culminating in Armageddon. Everyone in the organization felt that these events were imminent.

  But look what has happen in just a few years. The Soviet Union has disintegrated. It no longer fits the role as "king of the north." So, the Society ignores the question as if they never played a role in identifying it.

  It's only one more example of many where the Society vascillates when its predictions fail. Members will probably be blamed again for reading in too much on what the Society actually said. But in this case, there can be no doubt at all what the Society said about this prophecy and its fulfillment.
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  coffee_black

  Yep, and all the faithful jws will say..."The society never said that!" No matter what's in print they will deny deny deny, and anyone who questions the denial will be labelled an apostate.

  And so it goes...

  Coffee
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  mizpah

  Madmary1:

  I would suggest that you read Romans, chapter 11. The writer makes a clear distinction between "natural" Israel and "grafted" Israel. The "hardening" of natural Israel will only occur up to time that the "full number of Gentiles has come in." This is so all Israel...natural and grafted..."will be saved."

  It would make no sense if all the prophecies in the Old Testament about natural Israel's restoration were all invalidated by the formation of "spiritual Israel." Both have a part in God's promises. The eventual restoration of natural Israel will validate the promises of God to that nation.
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  JCanon

  It would make no sense if all the prophecies in the Old Testament about natural Israel's restoration were all invalidated by the formation of "spiritual Israel." Both have a part in God's promises. The eventual restoration of natural Israel will validate the promises of God to that nation.

  There are two Israels; one spiritual and one natural. The NT distinguishes the two by calling the natural Jews the "greater number". Obviously, if there is a greater number there is a lesser number. The lesser number would be JWs. The prophecies in Matthew 24 thus are about aspects of both Israels.

  Interesting points are that the "great tribulation" is suffered by both but moreso the natural Israel. That "great tribulation" was the HOLOCAUST. Thus JWs were a focus of the Holocaust specifically as was the Jews to fulfill this.

  When the Bible says "the love of the greater number will cool off" its a reference to public feelings toward the natural Jews in general during this time after 1914 and leading up to the Holocaust, that is, an increase in anti-Semitism.

  Please note also that the Bible describes the great tribulation as occurring in "Judea" and says to flee to the mountains, etc. and that pregnant women would have a harder time. This was about the Holocaust and how you could flee to the mountains, but if you were a young mother it would be harder. But it also says "IMMEDIATELY AFTER the tribulation of those days.....darkness...then the sign of the son of man would appear...."; meaning this tribulation happens before the Messiah arrives and thus could not be Armageddon. If you follow Daniel, you'll see this "dashing of the holy ones to pieces" which is a reference to "Daniel's people", the Jews, going through the great tribulation/Holocaust, ends with the symbolic 1335 days. Then one was to keep in expectation of the 1335 days, which is 45 years after that. So when the exile of the Jews end, the trampling of Jerusalem by the nations, which was in 1947 when the Jews regained control, there would be at least 45 years during a "darkness"(spiritual) interval before the Messiah would arrive. Thus not only does the "great tribulation" occur before the Messiah arrives, but at least 45 years before he would arrive. The Holocaust ended in 1945, the Jewish state was set up in 1948. You do the math......

  Canon
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  City Fan

  Pleasuredome said:

  what a load of rubbish

  I could not agree more. I've never seen so much speculative bullshit in a single thread since my time on this board. This board seems to be becoming a breading ground for religious nutters to come on and rant about their own particular doctrines.

  Jesus is God because this scripture says blah blah. No he's Michael because this scripture says blah blah. No he's 'a god' because blah blah blah. No he's a teletubby because blah blah blah blah.....

  I can't believe people put so much time and faith in words that can be twisted to mean so many things.

  Oh well, rant over!
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  mizpah

  City Fan:

  Why do you spend so much time reading and considering this material...and then feel a need to comment? I think if I was looking,handling and examining b.s. I would be quick to wash my hands and forget it.
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  City Fan

  mizpah,

  It only really took a couple of minutes to read through this thread. I have a lot of time spare at work so I brouse this board a lot, especially the bible and research threads. I don't usually rant like I did. Sorry! I actually didn't include your comments in the b.s. category!

  I still stand by my words that you can waste a lot of time trying to fit vague prophecies into modern events. If the bible could be so specific about say the Greek Empire in prophecy why could it not be as specific about modern times?
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  l3gi0n

  WOW, Romans 11 really clears things up.. So the Nation of Israel is still god’s chosen people, and they will return to him, Also the gentiles can get in on gods new convent. I still don’t know if 1948 has any real significance, but I guess it doesn’t matter much.. One thing is for sure, the two Isaiah’s prophecies books are really off when compared to Romans 11.
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  searchfothetruth

  The Zionists were given Palastine by the British (even tho' it wasn't their's to give) as a reward for getting America involved in the war against Germany.

  Fact.
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  Guest 77

  May I suggest you go into your search engine and type in Khazar/s. Do you remember the Caananite tribes being a pest/menace to the Israelites?

  Guest 77