This thread is for proof that God exists

by juandefiero 375 Replies latest jw friends

  • slimboyfat
    slimboyfat

    That you say the views are reconcilable just tells me you've not actually read Tallis.

    Neuroprattle that locates our experiences, propensities and character in the activity of parts of our brain stops us taking this hazardous leap and gets in the way of the humanist project of truly understanding ourselves.
    Next time you see a prettily coloured brain scan next to an article burbling on about breakthroughs in understanding our humanity, reach for the salt.

    http://www.amazon.co.uk/Aping-Mankind-Neuromania-Darwinitis-Misrepresentation/dp/1844652734/

  • Coded Logic
    Coded Logic

    As you wish Fisherman, I didn't want to have to cut and paste a response to every single claim you threw my way but if that's the only way you can possibly answer a very simple question then so be it.

    You are confused about reality if you assume that reality = physical universe

    No, I do not assume this. My position is that the physical universe is all we're currently justified believing. Until evidence for the non-physical arises we can't make any claims about it.

    and nothing else is real unless it is a scientific fact which means that something should not and does not exists unless or until it is known.

    This is not my position either. Things are real or not real independent of belief. I believe that there is a objective reality and there are truths to be learned about that reality.

    You only word things differently and you keep saying the same thing: 'Reality is subject to proof'

    I have never once stated this. You're just making things up.

    I did not attack your position that you do not hold stating: "that we know that scientist understand "physical" reality."

    More than a bit confused by what you're trying to say here. Are you saying you're not convinced scientist understand physical reality? If you're agnostic on this point, I'd be more than happy to submit ample evidence to support the proposition.

  • Coded Logic
    Coded Logic

    SBF,

    If Tallis has a peer reviewed scientific paper on this exact topic, the neuroimaging of emotional brain states, then I'd be more than happy to read it. However, if you're just going to continue to strawman "Next time you see a prettily coloured brain scan next to an article burbling on about breakthroughs in understanding our humanity, reach for the salt." then please don't waste my time.

    My position is not based on "prettily coloured brain scans". It's based on the academic research of neuroscientist and the conclusions they have reached. Once again, if you think evidence is invalid or the conclusions are not justified then you're more than welcome to reach out to the scientists to explain to them why you're the authority on the topic. And you can provide them with YOUR research and YOUR conclusion that you have gotten through the peer review process.

    But what you DON'T get to do is try and badger me over the head with some science pop article that was written before the research was done. Nor do I care about the quote mining you've done on Tallis. If we are having a conversation about epilepsy or neurological rehabilitation - the areas where Tallis has done research - then yes I'd defer to him in a heartbeat as he's one of the leading authorities on the topic. But when it comes to areas where he hasn't done the research - then I'm going to trust the scientists who HAVE done the research and HAVE gotten their work published.

    You consistently do this SBF. You demand evidence up the nose from everyone else to support everything they say and then you try to counter them with flimsy little blogs and quotes from people who are not experts on the topic - who have not done research on the issues - and who have not passed peer review.

  • slimboyfat
    slimboyfat

    Raymond Tallis's book on the subject "Aping Mankind" linked above was published by academic publisher Routledge and peer reviewed and is less than 2 years old.

    I saw him give a talk on the subject last year. His arguments are not only based on the limits of technology, although he does discuss those. As a philosopher of the mind he argues that mapping human attributes in the brain is not simply difficult but totally misconceived. Like analysing the material composition of a board game to locate the "fun".

  • Mephis
    Mephis
    Tallis is fun. He took a tutorial on lit crit I was in a long time back. He's good mates with one of my old tutors. He doesn't half like tilting at strawmen arguments though. He was on his 'post-structuralism is bunk' phase back then. He does have a point with the brain, but I'd question whether that is the correct understanding to take from the work establishing the processes anyway. Like his work on post-structuralism, it's all kind of truism based and seems to miss the real point.
  • The Rebel
    The Rebel

    In my humble opinion these threads asking for proof of Gods existence cause more trouble than they are worth. Personally I could neither proove Gods existence / non existence anymore than I can proove I exist.

    So in conclusion thank you for all the sincere points of view, but whilst I am at it I think my time would be better spent trying to sell ice to Eskimos, or if I am really ambitious trying to negotiate an oil deal with the Arabs. And if by some chance I could have negotiated an oil deal with an Arab, I would be extremely cross if I had instead chosen to spend my time trying to work out if God existed or not on an ex- Jehovers witness debating forum.

    Anyway if by any chance it can be proven God exists, I would also like a photo to support the evidence. ( Now that's not to much to ask is it?)

    The Rebel.

  • The Rebel
    The Rebel

    The famous " blade runner" Oscor Pistorius, is to serve a long prison term for murdering his girlfriend. So my question is who " HERE" would waste time debating this comment?

    " I had the biggest crush on him he must be innocent"

    Yet who would deny the person who made that comment is entitled to their opinion?

    So In my opinin the sensible thing to do, is not waste time with that person debating that opinion?

    Now I am not saying people who want to believe in God or not believe in God are wrong, but in my opinion if you want to sincerely debate the existence/non existence of God then do so on a site that really challenges your thinking.

    The Rebel.

  • punkofnice
    punkofnice

    I know grvity exists. I see demonstrablle proof. I know Leamington Spa exists. I have the proof. Yet I need faith to believe in god? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

    Sorry, just stirring the pot

  • The Rebel
    The Rebel

    Pooh, I have received my first red dislike in a month.

    May I ask the poster why?

    Actually let me guess, I challenged a posters ego, and dared suggest that a posters opinion may be just that an opinion. Anyway with out clarification of what I said wrong, in my opinion each posters opinion is valid in their interpretation of life.

    The Rebel.

  • slimboyfat
    slimboyfat

    If it was my dislike you'd know about it because my dislikes alone are public.

    Memphis that's so cool you got a class with Tallis. He seems a very thoughtful guy. I knew he was against post structuralism too but you can't win them all. I think he very much has got "a point with the brain" and he's not the only one pointing out that brain reductionism is nonsense when you really examine it.

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