Fisherman - Note: I meant to add that I see your point about how someone despicable as a child abuser who is repentant is entitled to spiritual confidentiality. However, right now, sadly I am much more suspicious toward other witnesses at my KH (for good reason btw) knowing that the possibility there just might be a person in the hall who has a history of allegations made against them, such as was highlighted at the ARC. Supposing a brother molested a number of children spanning 20 years, yet it was all kept 'inhouse', and that individual had never been reported to the police, because he denied it and because of the 2 witness rule policy. Yet he could be sitting feet away from my family at the KH, or he could be invited into our home or indeed out in the ministry with our child etc etc. Not knowing the danger that a prolific abuser is within your midst is too high risk in my mind. Watchtower needs a better safeguarding policy to deal with such issues effectively.
News Flash: New Reveal Article
by Sugar Shane 116 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse
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DATA-DOG
As usual, Fisherman doesn't understand what is going on, but I don't feel like starting a 50 page debate where everyone, except Fisherman, understands what the WTBTS is actually up to.
DD
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Fisherman
But let's say hypothetically a young teenage girl discloses to the elders that a well respected brother in the hall has raped her lets say several months earlier. She asks them not to tell anyone...to keep it confidential. Yet clearly, they can tell she is telling the truth.
Church ministers do not have the authority to adjudicate crimes. That is the subject matter of a Court of law having competent jurisdiction. Rape is a crime and if a person is found guilty of rape, he is guilty of criminal conduct, but in the US, a person is only guilty of a crime after a conviction and church ministers do not have the authority to determine guilt or innocence of a crime - but they can convict someone of sin
What should the elders do?
They should obey Caesar but by the same token the church enjoys confidentiality.
That is why an effective safeguarding policy needs to be implemented by Watchtower
Safe according to who's liking?
Physical protection of children is not the legal duty of the church but of the secular authorities. Government regulating church based activities is unconstitutional (but that is not for me to decide) and each case relating to church liability can be decided by the Court on a case by case basis. In the US, access to the Court system is easy as pie and lawyers will fight tooth and nail just to represent someone on contingency just as money is involved as it mostly always is when suing the church.
The 2 witness rule works for many types of sins. Circumstantial evidence and other forms of evidence is required in many cases where child abuse has taken place.
The role of the church is not to prosecute crimes. Church confidentiality is rooted in the 1s amendment. Governing how the church handles sinners establishes religion which violates a principle of the 1st Amendment which separates church and state.
I watch my kids. It is the responsibility of parents to protect their children and not to delegate that to the WT, elders or fellow congregants and to blame them when parents fail to do so. If you failed to protect your child in the first place resulting in him being harmed by another person or if you suspect a child is being harmed, why don't you go to the authorities and report it? -and also go to your minister for spiritual help. YoU should not trust anyone with your kids.
The church exist under us constitutional provisions. It does not exist to help prosecute crimes or to provide physical protection for children. That is the duty of Caesar.
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Fisherman
As usual, Fisherman doesn't understand what is going on, but I don't feel like starting a 50 page debate where everyone, except Fisherman, understands what the WTBTS is actually up to.
As usual DD does not understand what is going on. All he is able to do is make remarks about my post. (Oh that is so stupid, he does not understand, etc.) but he is not able to invalidate what I say.
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OUTLAW
As usual, Fisherman doesn't understand what is going on.....DD
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Fisherman
Note: I meant to add that I see your point about how someone despicable as a child abuser who is repentant is entitled to spiritual confidentiality.
The 1st Amendment does not depend on whether the sinner is, or claims to be, or is judged to be, repentant. It provides confidentiality regardless (You better repent or we will report you to the police). And whether or not it turns out that he is repentant or not (which is not the business of the gov to adjudicate sins) he is still entitled to confidentiality under the 1st and so is the church.
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Fisherman
How do you feel about this outlaw and why? -
James Mixon
If a young JW girl or boy (8 years old) come to the elders about a rape, why would you doubt them?
Why even have a committee of elders to determine if a rape took place.
Jehovah organization is a haven in this terrible world, not. They are creating a haven for child abusers.
Their are a lot of single moms in the organization with children, and they trust the brothers
with their life. Child abuse is not high on JW radar but celebrating Xmas can get you kick out before
you can say Oh sh--t I forgot.
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elderINewton
I thank the writer for adding more fuel to the fire. Scary to see such proof.
I am so grateful that my family and I could leave. Articles like this made my family question why I was part of such an evil organization. They were right. -
OUTLAW
How do you feel about this outlaw and why?.....Fisherman
Watchtower Protects JW Pedophiles..
Jehovah`s Witness Elders protect JW Pedophiles under Watchtower`s Direction..
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..WATCHTOWER AND JEHOVAH`S WITNESS ELDERS..
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