Fading is never 100% successful is it?

nicolaou

Mum phoned last night to see how we all are. After fifteen years away from meetings and my old JW life you'd think my fade could be called 'successful' and for the most part it is. But . .

My resentment at being lied to and having wasted over thirty years of my life has left me like a glass of water full to the brim, it only takes a tap to make a mess. I haven't been 'tapped' since 2008 so I think I'm doing okay but last night was a bit of a warning.

Me and Mum disageed about something trivial (calling our dog 'part of the family') and for a couple of minutes neither of us would back down. I hate upsetting her but I couldn't back down or play 'avoidance' anymore.

It doesn't take a genius to work this out. There are serious issues we've never discussed that are simmering below the surface. Arguments about who's family and who isn't don't need much analysis in our messed up little cult indoctrinated family.

It was an argument by proxy. So here I am after a sleepless night telling you guys about it at 4.30 in the morning.

It's never really over is it?

hoser

Yes you are right. It is never over unless you df or da. Then your mother wouldn't talk to you and you could move on.

Hadriel

@nicalaou things for the bright outlook LOL.

It's been less than a year and I've already realized that's exactly what we're facing. It will never end sadly. I've resorted to carefully pointing out watchtower literature that is just nutso to get my shots in. I figure they can't say much if I say "I wonder why we printed this?".

This accomplishes two things. Allows you to safely force them to accept the nut job stuff they're essentially supporting or have supported. Secondly gives them pause to think badly of you as if they are even remotely reasonable they'll be able to see how it could cause anyone to stumble.

Pete Zahut

You may have been arguing about the dog but it wasn't really the dog your were arguing about.

The fact that she won't allow your to decide for yourself something as basic as how you view your own pet, shows how rigid her thinking is and how accustomed she must be with forcing her rigid ways on others. Wonder where she could have picked up a nasty little habit like that ?

With my family I've found it best to casually and quickly put an end to the conversation as soon as they go anywhere that I don't want to go. Without me having to become the bad guy, they've gotten the hint that they have to stay within certain boundaries if they want me to talk to me.

Mum: You shouldn't call rover a part of the family...Rover isn't part of the family and I'm certainly not related to any Dog!!

You: Ok yeah well anyway Mum....good to hear from you....gotta' run....keep in touch bye bye (click)

bafh

It's over when you are over it. It's not what happens to us, it is how we respond.

Therapy helps a lot.

LongHairGal

NICOLAOU:

You have to weigh the good against the bad when you are a fader!

Even though you had this disagreement with your mother you didn't do so badly. Is it really worth it to upset the whole apple cart just to tell your mother off and tell her A to Z about the JW religion and how you hate it all? You may never see eye-to-eye about these serious issues you mention.

Let's say you did that: you get really upset and yell and say a whole lot of things to her about the religion. You succeed in upsetting her and alienating her (and whoever else...). Is she going to change and see the logic of what's wrong with the religion? I doubt it. She probably won't remember half of what you said.

I wasn't raised a JW, so maybe I'm not qualified to talk but as I get older I appreciate whatever relatives and loved ones I have left. [I am assuming you have some feelings for your parents and don't hate their guts over abuse, etc.]

So, in my opinion you should keep some things to yourself assuming, of course, you are in every other way a free person.

Simon

I know what you mean - there's always stuff bubbling under the surface.

One thing I've realized though is that it's not unique to JW families and upbringing. Sure, there are JW specific elements to it but most families are messed up and dysfunctional in some way it seems but everyone pretends that everything is fine and puts on a good show for public consumption.

I think there are things that are important to us and it's our choices to make. We think of our dog as part of our family and have friends who are the same so know exactly where you are coming from. At some point parents stop having the right to push their viewpoints on us - it's as simple as that.

Perhaps it's a generational thing - right now I can't imagine wanting to interfere in our kids lives. Maybe though I'll end up doing so and imagine I'm being helpful when I'm not. Perhaps that is the point - do we really think their intent is malicious or just intentionally aggravating or are they genuinely trying to help and just communicating badly?

Old people - you can't beat 'em ... (pity).

Diogenesister

Can't sleep either...Simons right 'tho, its there bubbling even with non witness family and the silliest stuff can set it off, and hurt like hell...

Or was it silly stuff? Some won't agree but I think it was an interesting subject to take your ( sort of) stand over.........no, actually any ex witness should see that whether a theist or not ...but for me personally the further along in my journey I go the less " anthropo- centric" I get and the closer I feel to our animal brethren the angrier I get with witness dismissiveness of animal kind, animal history (!)and particularly animal suffering.

I miss my dog who passed over 2 years now, she was closer more loyal and loving than most of my " blood" animal family xxx

Edit: PeteZahut ( Ill carry on)

mum: Rover isn't part of the family and I'm certainly not related to any Dog!!

Nicou: oh yes you are! I'm sending you a little book I know your gonna love called " your inner fish" by Neal Shubin!!

Simon

Anyone who thinks a dog isn't part of your family has never had a dog and loved it. It's hard not to - they love you unconditionally and completely.

We thought we were the only ones who treat it like our kids sibling - "go ask mum / dad!" we'll tell her (when she want's something) ... or "tell dad you want belly rubs" LOL

Our friends do the same though - they got their dog before they had kids but really it's their first child and he's "big brother" to the kids (so protective / patient / playful).

Back to the main topic though ...

Families have a habit of being able to say things that normal people wouldn't and overstepping the normal boundaries ... but knowing how to do it in such a way that it's hard to challenge or call them on it without risking like you becoming the dick.

The Rebel

nicolaou:- " Fading is never 100% successful is it?

The Rebel ( A) Agreed there is never a 100% successful fade, but life doesn't have to be perfect to be wonderful, and there is nothing to feel guilty about, so there should be no personal cries of shame, even it a fade does create some sensational gossip in the congregation.

Personally I wish I could convince those I love still in, that the W.T is a sneaky, unprincipled organization, therefore my hope is someday in the not to distant future, I get to share some of that fascinating information.

The Rebel.

p.s faders can however be 100% certain the G.B is guilty of all charges.

Fading is never 100% successful is it?

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