Uhh, those watchtowers in Cuba have snipers in them.
So no, it's not just as true.
Jehovah's Witnesses Are Under Mind Control
by minimus 207 Replies latest jw friends
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minimus
Hey, when are you going to go on that vacation, already?.....ahhh, death in this system or everlasting death in the next....Which is supposed to be worse?
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Pork Chop
It's amazing how hung up some of you guys are on this myth. Mind control and brain washing are both myths, garybuss is exactly right. The real reason you lick this stuff up is because you want to deny responsibility for your own actionions when you were Witnesses. This is very, very common among the "hostile leaver" groups of all religions. They all sing the same mind control song, which is really the "it wasn't my fault" song even if they don't want to admit it.
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hksb
I also agree with GaryBuss on this one. The definition previously given for 'mind control' could apply to a multitude of different situations (i.e., changing a person's opinion without their being aware of it). For example, this is precisely what advertizing does. But I don't think anyone can seriously argue that advertizing exerts mind control.
I think that JW teaching is equivalent to a very deceitful 'education'. Those (adults) who fall for it should take responsibility for their own actions. It is not really mind control since so many JWs leave and do not experience great obstacles to leaving (except shunning).
Actually I think there are parallels with current political events. Al-Qaeda is a JW-type Islamic organization which has strong influence over its members, but again I don't think this is 'mind control'. Similarly most (fundamentalist) Americans still think they were justified in attacking Iraq (WMDs?) due to the propaganda coming out of the White House/CNN/Fox News. This is deceitful 'education' not mind control.
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minimus
So give me some good examples of mind control.
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garybuss
There are several myths about former members and lots of opinions written with part understanding of the past members of high control religious groups such as the Jehovah's Witnesses.
There are three big myths taught to former members of religious groups and these myths detour their recoveries, sometimes for years.
1. The victim needs a substitute religious belief system to replace the one she just left.
2. Deeds were done in the group under mind control. Witnesses are victims of victims.
3. The group installed a pseudopersonality unknown to the member.
I wrote an article on the pseudo-personality subject back in 2001 called, Establishing and maintaining the Pseudopersonality. It's on Freemeinds page at: http://www.freeminds.org/buss/pseudopersonality.htm
It's much harder to help a former Witness recover from these myths than it is to help them see the error of the Watch Tower Publishing Corporation. Some become much more devoted to these myths than they ever were to the Jehovah's Witness teachings. The sad part to me is many of their counselors and therapists spend wasted years and thousands of dollars of their client's money on these fallacies.
The best modern example of mind control I can relate is the Patricia Hurst story. She tells the story in her book. It's a must read for any serious student of the subject.
Also an interesting read is Margaret Singer's humorous explanation of why the Military should not be considered a high control group in her book Cults In Our Midst. GaryB -
minimus
I believe that there are differences between mind control and brain washing. Patty Hearst was brainwashed, pardon that term. There seems to be an opinion that those believing in JW mind control are using this thought as a crutch. All I'm saying is that I believe mind control is more prevelant than one example (like Patty Hearst). I think, Gary, that you don't personally believe in "mind control". Can you give any other groups or religions or cults thjat use mind control?
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Mr Lebowski
I didn't think I would be logging on before I left on Sunday AM, m, so that's why I thought I would be offline.
Minimus, since you're advancing the proposition, perhaps you could tell us what mind control means to you - define it, and give an example of MC and an example of something tht is not MC. I am interested in Gary's thoughts, of course, but since you are making the assertion, minimus, share with us what you mean, please.
"'In God We Trust.' I don't believe it would sound any better if it were true." Mark Twain
El Duderino
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minimus
No...You guys first. One of the first comments on this thread was that the statement ---"Jehovah's Witnesses Are under Mind Control" sounded so obvious. Since you disagree, you give examples, if you can.
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Mr Lebowski
but dood...it's your thread.
You're the one saying it's so obvious, and you're the one saying you're a bit surprised that I don't see it.
Time for the old Socratic approach... I am very ignorant, illuminate me.
"Well, art is art, isn't it? Still, on the other hand, water is water! And east is east and west is west and if you take cranberries and stew them like applesauce they taste much more like prunes than rhubarb does. Now, uhhh... Now you tell me what you know." Groucho Marx
Chew your food,
El Duderino