Simple Question Re 1914 (page 3)

NonCoinCollector

Why do you think Jesus couldn't predict 1914 based on Daniel 4?

Jesus would have known that Jerusalem wasn't destroyed by Babylon in 607 BCE. Having witnessed the events as an angel, he would have known the exact day.

scholar

Vanderhoven

I see no evidence let alone proof that Daniel 4 has a secondary fulfillment. I see only speculation. If it is not stated, it is merely assumed.

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The evidence is as summarized:

1. The fact that in Daniel 4 there several references about God's Kingdom

2. The fact that the book of Daniel has 'God's Kingdom as its main theme

3. The fact that the Aramaic word iddan and iddanim meaning 'times' and 'times' has both a lieral and figurative meaning according to Hebrew Lexicons

4. The fact that Jesus in Luke 21:24 made a direct reference to 'times' in connection with the city of Jerusalem which is consistently iswed in the Bible as a antitype representing again God' s Kingdom

5. The fact that the Old Greek version of Daniel 4 makes a direct refeence to the Fall of the Judean Monarchy as faound in the commentary on Daniel in the Heremeneia commentary series by Danielic scholar John Collins.

6. The fact that Daniel 4 could not have just had a literal meaning of 'seven years' because such supporters do not believe that this was an historical event and is not found in NB Chronology that Nebuchadnezzer was vacant from the throne for those seven years.

7. The fact that schlars observe the relevance of Lukan Eschatology in both Luke and Acts

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Can you quote a nonJW "scholar" who supports this WTS claim?

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No

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Why do you think Jesus couldn't predict 1914 based on Daniel 4?

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The year 191`4 is tabulated in a very different calendrical system to that used in Jesus day but a clue to His thinking in relation to His Kingdom is given in the book of Revelation wherein He makes refence to the 'Lord's Day' which we believe to have begun in 1914 CE

scholar JW

scholar

NonCoinCollector

esus would have known that Jerusalem wasn't destroyed by Babylon in 607 BCE. Having witnessed the events as an angel, he would have known the exact day.

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Nonsense. Jesus would have known the exact year that Jerusalem fell in King Zedekiah's 11th year and King Nebuchadnezzer's 18th year which in our modern calendar not used in Jesus' day is properly calculated as 607 BCE

scholar JW

scholar

ozziepost

Perhaps we need that “clarified

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No problem. The simple fact is that 1914 vCE saw a confluence of events that arose and soon developed consequentially in 1914 and immediately thereafter:

Beginnings of the Great War in 1914

October, 1914 saw the birth of God's Kingdom

Consequentially, Satan cast out of Heaven to the Earth evidenced by the beginning of the Sign of the Lord's presence which was clearly identified by the Great War in its full flourish

scholar JW

Vanderhoven7

@Scholar,

Sorry, as I see it, none of the so-called evidence you present lifts the secondary fulfilment theory above speculation or indicates that Daniel 4 is about 1914.

Are you suggesting that Jesus really knew the timing of his parousia based on Daniel 4 but just did not know how to express it because the year 1914 is "tabulated in a very different calendrical system"?

Let me suggest that your inability to find a NonJW scholar that sees a dual fulfillment to Daniel 4 .... is because it is simply not supported by the text. It's just another example of WTS eisegesis

Besides, as I see it, Jesus was enthroned in the first century CE.

Fisherman

WT claims that Satan was thrown out of heaven in October 1914

Don’t think WT now teaches that. “circa 1914” not 1914 as discussed in another thread,

Fisherman

Besides, as I see it, Jesus was enthroned in the first century CE.

That is not true.Compare hebrews 10:12 with Psalms 110:1.

Also, 1914 is not a made up date. It is based on Bible interpretation of the 7X. Cant be debunked. And Babylon fell in 539-70 is circa 607. 1914 is a solid date. I think that Oct 1914 is the end of the Gentile Times. Everything is arguable and that is why Jesus’s proof of being the Messiah was rejected in the 1 century . But not without consequences.

scholar

Vanderhoven

Sorry, as I see it, none of the so-called evidence you present lifts the secondary fulfilment theory above speculation or indicates that Daniel 4 is about 1914.

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The evidence that I

set out is based not on eisegesis but sound exegesis so I cannot understand why you are not convinced by the facts that I listed.

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Are you suggesting that Jesus really knew the timing of his parousia based on Daniel 4 but just did not know how to express it because the year 1914 is "tabulated in a very different calendrical system"?

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The fact that Jesus described the Gentile Times or the appointed times of the nations is an immediate connection to Daniel 4 and He could express it as to a year in our modern calendar for that would have been meaningless.

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Let me suggest that your inability to find a NonJW scholar that sees a dual fulfillment to Daniel 4 .... is because it is simply not supported by the text. It's just another example of WTS eisegesis

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No, it is because WT scholars are too smart.

scholar JW

NonCoinCollector

Nonsense. Jesus would have known the exact year that Jerusalem fell in King Zedekiah's 11th year and King Nebuchadnezzer's 18th year which in our modern calendar not used in Jesus' day is properly calculated as 607 BCE

There isn't a single scholar that would suggest 607 as the date of Jerusalem's destruction. My guess is your screen name is meant to be ironic.

Fisherman

There isn't a single scholar that would suggest 607 as the date of Jerusalem's destruction.

They are wrong in their interpretation of archeology. But let’s assume the circa 586 interpretation (because that is all it is a belief) that would still put us a few years after1914 ( circa 1935) which is very close to 1914 as the end of the Gentile Times. But compared to the events of 1914 the first world war that seems to fulfill Bible prophecy so one would have to go back and re evaluate 586 premise. Based on God’s word using Bible chronology the year is 607. There is zero empirical evidence that 586 is the destruction of Jerusalem -only an interpretation of the Stele which Scholar refuted in previous thread years ago. 1914 has not been debunked.

Simple Question Re 1914

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