Former Elders, a Question (page 2)

LittleToe

Going out with a "worldy person", or even marrying one was never grounds for DF'ing. They might have Publically Reproved you, but they had no sanction to DF you.

Proof positive that some bodies are a law unto themselves. A common tale, sadly...

yxl1

Yeah they told my mom it was because of my attitude; but I told them that I still wanted to "serve Jehovah" and be a JW, so how could they justify their decision?

Unless you dumped your boyfriend, got down on all fours, wept, begged forgiveness AND said that you wanted to "serve Jehovah and be a JW" they dont need to justify their decision. You have gone against an unwritten rule and they must prevent others from following.

Before I had my JC, I was sure I wouldnt be disfellowshipped. One eyewitness stated she saw me smoking. Then she retracted her statement and said that she didnt see me smoking, but there was a lit cigerette on the table I was sitting (along with 3 other people). I was then disfellowshipped for my attitude. When I asked "What attitude? I said all along I wasnt smoking." Their answer? "Thats exactly the attitude we're talking about"!!

No matter how long and hard you dwell on this subject, it's a complete waste of time. The rules will always change to suit their own general feeling about you PERSONALLY. I was told that the only way I could be reinstated, was if I admitted to smoking even though by their own admission I wasnt disfellowshipped for smoking.

StinkyPantz

Gopher-

I was never charged with anything. It was only a couple of weeks ago that I learned that that was part of the protocol.

Teej-

I don't have money for an attorney, but I might eventually go that route, to satisfy my curiosity. I want to know the reason they changed my whole life. I think I have that right.

Mav-

I said that I still wanted to be a JW and that I had made a mistake in keeping my relationship hidden. I said I was sorry, but that I wouldn't end the relationship. I was very, very respectful at all times.

Smack-

Rocketman-

I don't want to reverse anything, I just want some answers. As far as suing, no way! I believe these guys thought they were doing god's will, I can't fault them for that. . I mean, I could, but I won't. I still have love for the one that cried.

Little Toe-

So I was screwed, huh? Would an appeal have worked?

freein89

Perhaps your pantz were too stinky. And we all know what causes stinky pantz don't we? But seriously though, I am gratified to hear you don't want anything reversed, because if you did we would all kick your stinky pantz around the block. I would be interested in knowing what the actual charge was. What are the chances you will get a straight answer? Is there a rule about showing the actual paperwork to the accused? They have so many rules so as to cover their backsides, I'm sure there must be one. Either they will show the papers or they won't, if there is a rule that says you can see the paperwork (which I personally doubt) then you should be able to.

Deb

teejay

>>>> I want to know the reason they changed my whole life. I think I have that right.

Yeah, you do.

Fwiw, I was df'd without proper cause, too. But the way I look at it now, they did me a huge favor. If they hadn't wronged me by violating their own rules the way they did, I'd still be the hardcore witness I grew up to become. But by going through that whole ordeal, they forced me to begin to think. The rest is history.

>>>> I said I was sorry, but that I wouldn't end the relationship.

There's where you fuc.... uh... I mean messed up. Bucking their authority meant that you were refusing to follow Jehovah's. You know... like an apostate would. The good shepherds saw you as a potentially bad influence on the flock. Let you get away with your crass rebellion and there would have been an upsurge of intra-religious marriages in your hall. There was not much they could do after you tied their hands that way.

>>>> So I was screwed, huh?

Pretty much. Welcome to the club.

>>>> Would an appeal have worked?

I have to say, in your case, it probably would've. Wanna go back?

LittleToe

SP:

So I was screwed, huh? Would an appeal have worked?

Possibly. It would depend who was on the appeal committee and whether or not they were buddies with the original committee.

The appeal has to be during the seven days after the decision, which shouldn't be announced until after these have elapsed.

Too late...

Besides, even if you'd won, they be gunning for you from that point onwards.
Seen it done...

stillajwexelder

gopher says

And HAVE NO DOUBT -- dating outside "the truth", while seriously discouraged by JW's, is not in itself a DF'ing offense. Perhaps they "assumed" you were fornicating with your then-boyfriend.

It seems like elders on committees ASSUME a lot. It is a time-saving shortcut, so that they can get back to their wives, family and TV-watching.

HE IS ABSOLUTELY CORRECT -- your disfellowshipping sounds like a disgrace to me

JT

The catch all is showing or not showing a repentant attitude. This is often determined by how reverently you treat the jc. They feel, by extension your fear of them proves your fear, or lack of it, of Jehovah and His organization. You didn't grovel and plead, or cry. This shows your hard-heartedness!

EXCELLENT POINT AND this is why i keep telling folks to stay out of those committee rooms you are dealing with Straight Cheese and Cracker Men- bpottom line

rarely does the society or appeal committees reverse decisions RARELY and as for a reason to DF for the most part the Service Dept leaves that call to the elders on the committee

that is a hellva lot of power to leave in the hands of a man who hands out cheddar cheese on crackers

yes by wt own rules you were shafted but remember their rules are very flexible, recall this is from the same group that gave us THE MILLIONS NOW LIVING, THE GENERATION never dies , AND YES YOU WILL NEVER HAVE A CARREER IN THIS SYSTEM SO WHY GO TO COLLEGE ie 1969

gumby

I want to know the reason they changed my whole life. I think I have that right.

Yes you do. Some have implied a "who gives a crap........your out....forget about it" attitude,

which is good for them but not good for you. I myself would have argued their decision had it been me, however I was an Elder and knew the rules for the most part. As many have mentioned.....dating a worldly person IS NOT.....in itself grounds for DFing. Many......date worldly people and marry them and are not disfellowshipped.

One thing to remember is that YOU CAN be disfellowshipped for just about anything......if your attitude is bad enough in that particular JC's eyes. What was your attitude like SP?

I would suggest that when you try and find out WHY you were DFed.......you first try it as a concerned, dumb acting individual who......really wants to know. Leave any intimidating attitude behind while you do this. Asking for a copy will probably lead to a dead end. All files are private as far as judicial reports.

Gumby

RunningMan

As I understand it, there is no sin for which you are automatically disfellowshipped. If you are repentent, the committee can avoid dfing you at their discretion. On the other hand, I also understand that you can be dfed for any minor infraction, if you have a bad attitude. It is your repentence and submission that are the determining factors, not the infraction itself.

As for the idea of an appeal, forget it. My wife's uncle is an elder who has served on appeal committees. Every now and then, he tells us about them. He has never overturned an appeal. In one case, he told us that the girl who was dfed was not repentent in any way, she simply wanted to argue the details of her case. In all likelihood, she was railroaded and wanted justice. What she got was a bunch of cronies who saw that her spirit had not been broken and that she was willing to stand up for herself. Appeal denied.

Former Elders, a Question

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