by LittleToe 79 Replies latest watchtower bible
Shel:
Sorry to hear that you've not been well
Two questions for you:
I just wanted to say that I find Yeru's posts boring.
Except, I found this one interesting:
Stinky,
Picking on me makes you happy? Easy to please ain't ya...I'm an easy target...but me thinks you might be in need of a spanking.
Thank you kindly for the lovely flowers... and peace to you! I am feeling MUCH better today, thank you very much! I hate colds/flus, etc., as I am a diabetic and sometimes it's hard to tell just what's going on, you know? Some other folks I work with, etc., had to come down ill too for me to finally put it to rest that it was not my blood sugar (unfortunately, just "testing" my blood doesn't always resolve it for me).
Anyway... you asked:
Is it your understanding that those wearing white robes will eventually take on physical bodies, or is it that they already possess bodies that will enable them to inhabit the "new earth"?
Such "white robes" ARE the bodies that will inhabit the new earth. The spirit can be "housed" in one of two bodies... the physical/earthly/terrestrial... or the spiritual/heavenly/celestial. Since these "cover" the spirit... they are called "outer garments"... or "robes."
The "outer garment" that is flesh with it blood is "corrupt"... in that it has sickness, aging and death IN it (not the spirit it covers but it itself, the flesh). It is "befouled"... unclean... blemished.
However, the "outer garment" that is a SPIRIT body is INcorruptible... as it has NO sickness, aging or death in it. It is "white". It is "white"... clean... UNblemished.
The first... comes from the physical realm, earth... "Hagar"... as it was "inherited"... from our Father, God, through His Son... Adam... who came from the earth. The second... comes from the spirit realm, Jerusalem Above... "Sarah"... as it is "inherited")... from our Father, God, through His Son... Christ... who came from the spirit realm.
The first... is a slave: it must eat physical food, drink physical water, sleep, pass waste, suffer, be sick, age... and die. In addition, the first... is restricted: it cannot go where it pleases... either in this realm... or the other. There is only so far into space that it can... and even less under water. True, there are apparatus that assist us, but we can only go so far. We are limited.
The second... however... is FREE: all it needs is "the food of powerful ones" and "living water"... represented right NOW by the flesh and blood of Christ... which in TRUTH is the leaves of the Tree of Life... and holy spirit ("waters of life"). And it can go in and out... come and go... in THIS realm... and that one... as it pleases (with the exception of when it is "bound" by God, as were the angels that sinned... and Satan and his angels.) But otherwise, the spirit body is FREE... in that it is NOT limited.
The first... the physical body... in which the "seed" of the woman now exists... is "sown"... or buried... in the earth (that's why passing their children through the fire was prohibited and bones were even returned so as to be BURIED). Why? So that once sown... once the clay pot has dissolved... it can be replaced by another "house"... the SPIRIT body... which is raised up!
Note, however, that those raised up at the "end" are indeed raised up in physical bodies. Afterward, some are given "white robes"... spirit bodies... and granted entry into the kingdom. Others, however, are thrown... body AND spirit... into the Lake of Fire... where they are destroyed... body AND spirit.
The first of these are those seen by Ezekiel... where the bones came together and sinews were put on them and JAH breathed life back into them. Why is this? Because THESE... must stand judgment. Since their sins were committed in the flesh... they must be JUDGED... according to the law of the flesh. I will not go into the process of that judging, for I have elsewhere, but it involves the opening of scrolls containing deeds, good and bad, and the Book of the Lamb.
This is the second resurrection. Those who participate in the FIRST resurrection, however, are resurrected straight into spirit bodies. How do we know this? For those who lack faith, they can read Paul. But more importantly, it is because those who die in union with Christ... HAVE NO CONDEMNATION! So, they can receive their white robes right off! They don't have to stand before the throne at Judgment Day. They have already BEEN judged... and found without error... by means of belonging to Christ.
God... is a planter... a cultivator... of life. It is the seed of His "free" wife that was sown in the earth... and it is HIS 'seed' or sperm... or "water"... holy spirit... that fertilizes such seed... while in the earth... so that it grows to "fruition"... and can be BORN... AGAIN.
CHRIST... is the FIRSTFRUIT... the FIRST one to be "born" as a SPIRIT. He is the TRUE vine... the TREE OF LIFE... which the Father planted. He is the "root" of Jesse... which the Father planted. He is SPROUT! And from HIM... from THAT seed... Christ... come all OTHER "plants" sown by God. For we... are the BRANCHES in that Tree... of Life.
(There are also other "plants"... sown by the Adversary!)
Every tree, dear one... starts... with a seed. We, the seed of the woman... have been "sown"... in the earth... treasure hidden in earthen vessels.
Regarding what you have supplied about the "world of the dead", how do these ones differ from those under the altar? Why are they in one place or the other?
The ones under the altar are those whose spirits returned to God. Thus, they are living, as He is God OF the living. They are simply resting, awaiting resurrection... in WHITE ROBES. The others... are those who have no spirit (at least, not enough to call it living)... and so are of the dead. They are in two different places... just as my Lord stated when mentioning the Rich Man and Lazarus.
I hope this answers your questions, dear LT. It is all there... in "the Bible"... for all to see. All one need do is let the SPIRIT teach one and it becomes quite clear. If one only goes to the One who speaks FROM the heavens... the One about whom the "scriptures" are written, one would SEE... what such are saying about him... and about us. If, however, one wishes to lean upon one's OWN understanding... then one becomes hostage to "every wind of teaching," brought on by earthling man.
I know that there are those who think I am here to teach them... or that I think I am. I am NOT. I am not a teacher. I am merely a messenger, a SERVANT. If you ask of me, as your servant, I must provide a response if one is given me by my Lord. And if my Lord and Master tells me to SPEAK... as his slave, I am obligated to do so. Whether some hear... or refrain.
And I am not his slave because he made me one. To HIM... I am a friend... and brother. I am his slave because I CHOSE to be. When he asked me if I would go... I told him that I would... no matter the cost... or the ridicule. He prepared me for it... out of HIS love. He did not send me without a... ummmm... staff, a purse... or a sword.
I bid you the greatest of peace, dear LT!
Your servant and a slave of Christ,
SJ
Hi Shel, I'm glad you're feeling a little better. Take it easy until you get your reserves up to par, ya hear?
Just a couple of further questions, if I may:
1. Regarding those under the altar you wrote:
They are simply resting, awaiting resurrection... in WHITE ROBES.
Are you saying that they are already in white robes, or are awaiting a resurrection into white robes?
2. Further, what of those who existed before our Lord walked the earth? Do they rest under the altar, too?
I may have misunderstood those aspects of your comments, hence the appeal for clarification.
Btw, I don't recall your comments on the judging. Do you have the link handy?
I didn't even see this, Teej! Peace to you!
seems like every bearded and robed Jew from 2000/3000 B.C. looks pretty much like every other bearded and robed Jew, yes?
Uh, Teej... you do know that they're not all Jews, right? I mean, Abel wasn't a Jew, was he? Neither was Enoch, Noah, Job, Melchizedek, Abraham, Isaac, Moses, Aaron, Joshua...
And I'm a-thinkin' your comment might sound a tad offensive... you know, coming from someone whose "peoples" resent the saying, "They all look alike,"...
But then, you were trying to be funny, weren't you? Weren't you?
How'd you recognize one from the other? Name tags? Color-coded halos?
Again, you're trying to be funny, right?
And could you please remind me what function they serve?
Truly, dear one... I don't know. That has not been revealed to me. I will, of course, share it here if it ever is. In the meantime, I will tell you that they are all quite extraordinary... I don't know how to explain it... "good" men. Inside. For it was the "man" they are on the "inside" that I was became acquainted with. And I don't know how I can tell you that, either. It is something you would have to experience for yourself. In truth, I spent only the briefest amount of time with the spirits of these... mere seconds, really. But... a lot was learned in that time. A LOT. Particularly the understanding as to why it is these who were chosen for the position. Truly extraordinary spirits.
I "studied" the Revelation book a couple of times, but it's been a while.
Oh, you want to know what the WTBTS says their function is? Heck, I don't know! And now I KNOW you're trying to be funny!!
It bothers me that Joseph is in there. All he did was serve as Jesus' step-dad. How does he rate such a position?
Wrong "Joseph".
Or are we talking about the other Joseph?
We are... the second youngest son of Israel (Jacob), the eldest son of Rachel.
Peace, my brother!
A slave of Christ,
SJ
The greatest of love and peace to you... and my apology for not responding sooner!
Actually, I HAD responded, but my fingers hit some stoopid key and I wiped it all out. I was SO exasperated... that I just moved on to another thread Had to "cool down" and get my mind back on the questions you raised. (And can you tell that my emoticons now "work" and that I like them VERY much? Okay, enough - LOLOL!)'
Now, then... (yeah, I had to use one more - LOLOLOLOL!)
First, I am feeling MUCH better, thank you! The "flu" I think. I am taking it easy. Took Friday off to "take care of myself." Boss thought it a good idea... Moving on to your questions:
1. Regarding those under the altar you wrote: "They are simply resting, awaiting resurrection... in WHITE ROBES."
Are you saying that they are already in white robes, or are awaiting a resurrection into white robes?
I am saying what Revelation 6:11 says, that they have already been "made perfect"... given their white robes... but told to rest awhile longer. So, they are not dead... but simply asleep.
Hebrews 12:23; 1 Corinthians 15:46, 47, 51, 53, 54
What I saw was not men in the flesh... but the spirits of such ones. Contrastly, in the world of the dead I did NOT see spirits... but merely bones (ga-zillions of them!)... with just a minute amount of "spirit" in them. Not even enough to call them "living."
2. Further, what of those who existed before our Lord walked the earth? Do they rest under the altar, too?
If they "belonged" to our Lord... and thus are of the "living"... then yes, as it is the "spiritual LIVES" of such ones that is there. This would include Abraham, Isaac and Jacob...
Matthew 22:32; Hebrews 12:23
I may have misunderstood those aspects of your comments, hence the appeal for clarification.
No problem!
Btw, I don't recall your comments on the judging. Do you have the link handy?
Oh, Lordy, no, dear LT! Truly, I don't keep track of this stuff. I post it... and move on. I can tell you here again, briefly, if you wish (well, maybe not briefly - you know me - LOLOLOL!).
To explain the Judgment, I will have to explain the resurrections:
First Resurrection -
Includes those who belong to the Christ, who are to rule with him 1,000 years. These are judged by means of the blood, and thus, have no condemnation, so there really isn't a "judgment" for them. They are raised up as SPIRITS... at the return of our Lord... at the very same time that those who did not die... are changed. Transfigured. Thus, they are all taken home, to the House of our Father... to be wed to the Groom, our Lord, at the same time.
John 11:25, 26; 1 Corinthians 15:20, 23; 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17; Revelation 20:4-6
At one time, based on what I had READ... I was of the thinking that it would only be those who "belonged" to the Christ "during his presence" (meaning from the time he walked on the earth and afterward, including during his invisible presence) that would be resurrected at this time and that the others (those before his flesh and subsequent invisible presence) had to wait until the second resurrection. Thankfully, I have learned to listen to my Lord and NOT put my faith in what is written, so that I NOW know that when it says "during his presence" the TRUE word that should have been rendered there is "during... or at... "his return/arrival."
These include everyone from Abel... on... who belong to our Lord by means of being IN UNION with him... meaning ONE spirit.
2nd Resurrection -
1. Occurs at "the end"... AFTER the 1,000 years have ended... and AFTER my Lord turns the kingdom over to the Father FOR the Judgment.
1 Corinthians 15:23, 24; Revelation 20:6, 7, 11
2. At that time, JAH... sits down on His throne... and scrolls (books) are given Him.
Daniel 7:9, 10; Revelation 20:11
3. There are two (2) sets of scrolls (books)... one containing the deeds... good and bad... of those dead... and the other... the Lamb's Book (the Book of Life - John 14:6)
4. The dead then are called... IN THE FLESH... from the "memorial" tombs... death, Hades and the sea... and brought before the throne to be judged. They are resurrected in the flesh... because they have to be judged in the flesh... as their deeds were committed... in the flesh. This is what Ezekiel saw... the resurrection... of the "dead".
(Please note, these would also include Adam and Eve (who did not commit their sin in the flesh, but in the SPIRIT, for such flesh was not yet given them... but they DIED in such flesh - however, they have not yet been judged and condemned, if indeed they are), and Judas... who also must be resurrected... in the flesh... to be judged... and condemned... if indeed he is. For JAH shows mercy to whomever HE wishes to show it... and we do not know the hearts of these...
Ezekiel 37:1-14
(Also note that it was the resurrection of the "dead" from among Israel that Ezekiel saw - I, however, saw the "dead" from among EVERY nation, tribe and tongue, insofar as they had bones to be seen. Also, Ezekiel was taken to a "valley plain". What I saw, although vast and going on and on and on... seemed to be in the earth. I do not know if Ezekiel's valley plain was "in" the earth, or more like, well, you know, the places where elephants go to die, etc.).
Thus, STARTING WITH ISRAEL, the Household of God...
5. IF their names are written in the Lamb's Book... then their sins are "blotted" out of the other Book (containing their deeds)... by means of the Lamb's blood... and they are able to be counted as worthy of receiving a white robe (spirit body) and granted entry into the kingdom. They come out... to receive life!
John 5:28; Malachi 3:16; Acts 3:19; Revelation 3:5; Exodus 33:32; Psalm 51:1; Psalm 69:28; Jeremiah 18:23
Some of these will be those who died during the flood of Noah's day, who did not put faith in the Son of God at that time, but to whom he (my Lord) preached when he went to the world of the dead (Hades). At that time, the spirits of some of those he preached to DID put faith in him... and so will be granted life. Along with Israel, whom Ezekiel saw, by means of the blood of Christ, these are "the righteous"...
Acts 24:15; Romans 11:26; 1 Peter 3:19, 20; Isaiah 23:25-27
6. If their names are NOT written in the Lamb's Book... then their sins (bad deeds) remain written in the first scroll... and it is on the basis of these that they are judged. They come out, then... to judgment! These... are the unrighteous...
John 5:28; Acts 24:15; Revelation 20:15
Because they have sinned... and the "wage"... or payment... FOR sin... is death... and they have no "covering" for their sins... they are judged. True, ALL have sinned... but not all have a "covering" (a blotting out) FOR their sins. If no covering... the sin(s) then stand(s)... and the sinner must be paid the "wage"... what it is that he/she RECEIVES... for such sin... death.
Romans 6:23; Psalm 51:1
Thus, such ones are:
1. First, judged. They are found "guilty" of their sin... for God Himself is the witness to the truth thereof (Christ is the "witness" for the "righteous"; God is the witness for the "unrighteous"... and thus are judged as sinners, transgressors of law.
Micah 1:2; Psalm 50:7; Malachi 3:5; Micah 6:1, 2
2. Condemned and sentenced. As sinners, they must receive the "wage" of such sin... death. And so, they are condemned... and sentenced... to death... of the body AND the spirit.
Matthew 23:33; Mark 12:40
3. Executed. Such death... of the body AND the spirit... is carried out in only one way, for there is only one way to kill the spirit entirely... and that is to destroy it. Thus, these are cast into the Lake of Fire... Gehenna... wherein is killed... destroyed... the body AND the spirit. That is why Gog and Magog are killed with fire from heaven... why the wild beast, the false prophet... and Satan...are all cast into the Lake of Fire. It is the only place where the SPIRIT... can be destroyed.
Luke 12:5; Matthew 10:28; Revelation 20:15
Even Death... is thus destroyed... so that he... the opposite of Life... is "no more."
I hope this helps your understanding, dear LT... and again, I apologize for the delay in responding.
As always, I bid you the greatest of love and peace, and I am...
YOUR servant... and a slave of Christ... to time indefinite.
SJ
Shel:
Thanks for that.
Let me simplify what you have written, and please correct me if I stray from what you meant:
Since the world began, if someone dies without Christ their spirits go to the world of the dead, to rest in their bones.
Christ witnessed there, and those that accept him may have an opportunity to attain enrollment in the book of life (kinda like a "limbo" second chance, or for some first chance).
All here will be subject to the second resurrection, resulting in life or death.
Since the world began, if someone dies with Christ their spirits immediately go to heaven to reside under the altar, to sleep in white robes.
All here will be subject to the first resurrection along with those raptured, at the time of Christ's return. This is the bride of Christ.
Some further points:
peace to you, dear one... and praise JAH!
Let me simplify what you have written, and please correct me if I stray from what you meant:
Since the world began, if someone dies without Christ their spirits go to the world of the dead, to rest in their bones. Christ witnessed there, and those that accept him may have an opportunity to attain enrollment in the book of life (kinda like a "limbo" second chance, or for some first chance). All here will be subject to the second resurrection, resulting in life or death.
Yes!
Since the world began, if someone dies with Christ their spirits immediately go to heaven to reside under the altar, to sleep in white robes. All here will be subject to the first resurrection along with those raptured, at the time of Christ's return. This is the bride of Christ.
Yes!
Some further points:
If my Lord permits, sure!
1. So what's the role of the 24 Elders?
Truly, I do not know. I don't believe that truth has yet been given me... at least, not completely and concretely. My understanding at this time (which I do NOT advise you to "lean" on) is that they are in a "special" position of having nothing more to do than "glorify" the Father... and the Lamb. But that could be an error - they could actually have more... much more... to do. I just do not know of it.
I am basing my current understanding on the fact that when I have seen them, glorifying the Father and the Lamb is all that I have ever observed them doing. Now, some in THIS world might say, "Oh, how boring!!" But I don't believe it is. I believe it is like the four living creatures around the throne who have as THEIR "position"... to constantly call out "Holy, holy, holy" regarding JAH - these are among the HIGHEST ranking "stations" in the spirit realm, a privilege to those who receive such places.
Since, as I have said, my Lord has NOT given me such truth in full... thus, this is NOT an "inspired expression"... from Christ or anyone else... I can only tell you that if it is of great concern to you... ask. And then, put faith in the answer you receive.
2. The "rest", of those under the altar, I understand as rest and not sleep. Hence they are able to cry out "When will we be avenged?".
You may be correct; however, I understand "rest" to be "sleep," in that they wake up and cry out... and are then told to rest a little while longer. I believe, then, that they went BACK to sleep... and sleep still. Perhaps one of us will be given greater insight and discernment on the literal truth of this.
3. The world of the dead is alienated from the face of God and is an opportunity to wail, weep and gnash teeth, yes? The very definition of hell.
Actually, no, dear one. There is no weeping or wailing or gnashing of teeth in the world of the dead. There is... well, nothing. They don't even remember their deeds... good or bad... which is WHY a book of deeds is written. As a testimony, a record. And God is the witness as to the accuracy of what is IN the book.
Ecclesiastes 9:5, 6, 10
I mean, initially, when a spirit first arrives, it may be quite shocked and want to change the destination... or that of loved ones who've yet to arrive. But that is only during a very brief period, a twinkling of a moment perhaps, before they become "dead"... before that spirit is... well... reduced, per se, to almost nothing. Since it has no "means" to stay alive... it dissipates until there is almost nothing... and certainly no life. Not enough spirit to constitute life, anyway.
We do have the account of the Rich Man and Lazarus to give us some insight: although the Rich Man did state that he was in torment and in "blazing fire", I did not see fire in the world of the dead. I do not recall Ezekiel seeing fire, either. What I DID see... is that there is NO WATER... or holy spirit... there. None. Dry as a BONE... and full of dry... VERY dry... bones. Thus, if it was here that the Rich Man went... then he would, of course, be THIRSTY because there is NO ONE there... to give him a drink. And only a DROP of water... holy spirit... could have "cooled" his tongue.
John 4:10; 7:37, 38
However, there IS fire... in Gehenna. And at the "end"... Hades IS thrown INTO Gehenna. So, I the time period of this account may be after the "end". I do not know.
I do know that those who "weep, wail and gnash their teeth"... are those who are OUTSIDE the kingdom... by means of being cut off from entry... or being thrown out. They... are in the "darkness" OUTSIDE. For INSIDE the City... where these are not allowed to go... it is always LIGHT... by means of the glory of God and the lamp that is the Lamb.
These... the weeper/wailer/gnashers/... are those who wish to get IN and thus, are misled by Satan to come against the Holy City... and as a result are destroyed... and perhaps eternally tormented... by fire from heaven.
Hades... the world of the dead... is not the same as Gehenna... the place of fiery torment... where the body AND the spirit are destroyed. Spirits wait in Hades... but are tormented and/or completely destroyed in Gehenna (Lake of Fire).
Matthew 10:28; Revelation 19:20; 20:9, 10, 15
"Hell"... literally... is Sheol/Hades. However, "Hell"... technically... can be Hades, Sheol, Gehenna... even this realm... depending on what "torments" you... causes you anguish. There are some of us who go through moments where we think death is BETTER than continuing here, as they feel they are in torment/anguish here. So that this realm... is Hell... to them. Then, there are some who never wish to leave here... who are having their "reward" in full... here... now... and so this is "paradise"... and death at ALL is "Hell" to them. And there are some... who are looking forward to neither death in Hades... nor eternity (in the flesh)... but toward a greater reward... the real life. But neither Hades nor this world is "Hell" for them... but everlasting destruction is.
Hades... in and of itself... is not a place of torment... but one of holding/waiting... for the spirits who do not belong to Christ... as under the altar is for the spirits of those who do. Gehenna, on the other hand... may also not be a place of torment... for some... but rather, simply complete and utter destruction. For others, however, (i.e., Satan, the Wild Beast, the False Prophet, etc.)... it is indeed a place of everlasting torment.
As for the world of the dead being completely alienated from the face of God... the reply is "no." There is NO place... that is such, per se... for God can and does show mercy to whomever He wishes. HE... is not restricted so that He cannot see... or be seen... by whomever HE wishes. We are just as "alienated" from the face of God HERE... as they are there. For it is only by means of the Christ that we can see His face... due to the purity of heart that we have... and further prepare according to the discipline (as disciples) of Christ.
Thus, complete alienation from God's face is not really a "geographical thing"... or really even a "group" thing, per se. Truly, it is much more an individual thing. Although Israel, as a group seemed to have been alienated from God's face, any INDIVIDUAL of Israel can have that changed. And if it were true that the world of the dead was completely alienated from the face of JAH... then our Lord's going there to preach... would have been moot. Yes? Who, then, can try to contain... the mercy of JAH?
I bid you peace, dear LT.
YOUR servant and fellow slave of Christ,
SJ
And so hell can be experienced on earth, neh?
Interestingly you express your observations of the valley of the dead but it would be true to say that, although you saw little life, you didn't actually experience their existence.
With regards to fire in bones, I'd refer to Jeremiah's comments (Jer.20:9; Lam.1:13).
How do you understand the explanation of the parable of the "Wheat and the Weeds", where weeping and gnashing in fire, is expressed?
I would also separate out hell from Gehena.
I return to my original posit, that the 24 are set aside as something special and distinct from those under the altar. My current tendancy is towards them having received glorified bodies, as our Lord, that require some "physical" support. I suggest that those under the altar would receive theirs during the resurrection, and this will usher in the necessity for the "New Earth" as something "physical" to stand upon, when Jerusalem comes down.
may you have peace!
Please forgive my delay in responding to this post... but I could not answer of my own initiative... and therefore, had to wait on my Lord. With that said:
And so hell can be experienced on earth, neh?
Technically, yes. Literally... no.
Interestingly you express your observations of the valley of the dead but it would be true to say that, although you saw little life, you didn't actually experience their existence. With regards to fire in bones, I'd refer to Jeremiah's comments (Jer.20:9; Lam.1:13).
I am to share with you that I have experienced this same "fire". It occurs, for instance, when I have grown "weary"... for instance, here on jw.com... trying to tell the message I have been given... one that results in GREAT joy... only to have it ridiculed and to become an object of ridicule and maliciousness... so that I say, "I WON'T speak of it any more"... but... well, I cannot be silent. The... spirit... actually "burns... in a place deep within me... in my bones... literally. For the spirit... is IN the bones... and it feels as if holding it in... will consume me. Burn me up. Like the fire... "burned"... the bush.
Romans 8:9, 10; Hebrews 12:29
How do you understand the explanation of the parable of the "Wheat and the Weeds", where weeping and gnashing in fire, is expressed?
The "wheat"... gain entry. The weeds... are "cut off" so that they remain outside... in the darkness. Also... the "wheat"... are those who remain in union with Christ, whereas the "weeds"... are gathered up by "men"... and pitched into the fire.
John 15:6; Matthew 3:10
What does this mean? Well, prior to literal pitching into the Lake of Fire... it means that rather than finding refreshment for their souls... rather than being "quenched"... they find anguish. Dry... burning... anguish. Rather than being a "well-watered region"... they are a dry... VERY dry (so as to be combustible)... "land."
Matthew 11:28, 29; John 4:14; John 7:37, 38; Psalm 1:3; Isaiah 44:3, 4; Isaiah 41:17; Isaiah 55:1; Revelation 21:6; Revelation 22:17
I would also separate out hell from Gehena.
Cool!
I return to my original posit, that the 24 are set aside as something special and distinct from those under the altar. My current tendancy is towards them having received glorified bodies, as our Lord, that require some "physical" support.
Have you asked regarding this "tendency", dear one?
I suggest that those under the altar would receive theirs during the resurrection
Perhaps. But what I saw was not during the resurrection, but after it... as borne witness to by Revelation 6:11.
and this will usher in the necessity for the "New Earth" as something "physical" to stand upon, when Jerusalem comes down.
May I explain the "new" earth? It is simply that which remains... along with the "new" heavens... when Gog (that which is wicked and physical)... and Magog (that which is wicked and spiritual)... has been destroyed. Thus, there is no wickedness/influence by means of those who are phyiscal by nature... for Gog is gone... or by those who are spiritual by nature... for Magog is also gone... because the heavens and earth... that are NOW... but are stored up for FIRE... have been cleansed.
Matthew 25:41-46; Revelation 20:8, 9; 2 Peter 3:7, 10; 13
Thus... sans these... there is a NEW heavens... and a NEW earth. That WITHOUT wicked humans... AND wicked spirits... both of which existed at LEAST... from the throwing down of the seed.
Genesis 3:14-24
But, you know, of course... that you need not take MY word for it!
So, let me know what you "hear"... and PEACE to you!
Your servant and fellow slave of Christ,
SJ
