My JW Friends reaction to the Vicki Boer press release

shiloh

I forwarded the press release to my JW friend yesterday afternoon and we talked about later that evening when I saw her.

I could see that she was confused and somewhat bewildered. She first wanted to know more details about the case itself and when I supplied them, she became even more confused. Her first comment was that it didn't sound right and that Elders would never do something like that to a little girl. She said that they (meaning her congregation) have always been instructed to report anything of the sort to authorities and that she doesn't believe that this could happen. I redirected the conversation a bit and asked her, irrespective of the actions by the Elders, what she thought about the WT going after Vicki for the court costs. Again she said that something didn't seem right about what I was telling her and that the GB wouldn't do something like that because JW's are not "that way", meaning not vindictive and hypocritical. When I told her that this was a matter of court record and not just some story floating around the internet, she said some things about how there are alot of people who are trying to hurt the WT by saying bad things about them that aren't true and that you can't believe what ex-witnesses say because they just want to hurt the Org. After she finished I asked her if she believed the stories about the abuse in the Catholic church and she said "Oh yeah, I figured those guys were sickos". After she said that she got this look of realization on her face Like she understood my point. I then asked her, who would she rather talk to in order to find out what really goes on the in the Catholic church, an active priest or and ex-cardinal? Her answer was immediately...."Oh an ex-cardinal, of course!" I asked her why and she said that an active priest would never tell you the real story. Again, I didn't say anything but just looked at her with a look like "Uh huh..so..." and she seemed to realize the hypocrisy of her statements.

She expressed doubt, several more times about the validity of the story on the judges ruling. Again, she didn't seem defensive at all, just confused and reluctant to believe it. Finally I asked her, that, assuming it was true, what were her thoughts about it. She replied that if it IS true, then the WT is wrong and it isn't right that Vicki should have to pay the money. I asked her if she agreed that it was hypocritical of the GB to go after Vicki like this, in light of the things they teach in the literature and she said that it was wrong. The last question I asked was this: "Assuming the abuse claims are true, as the judge ruled, and assuming that the policy of not reporting such things to the authorities is true, what would that say about the GB?" She instantly responded with "That would mean that the Devil is in the Watchtower and God will take care of them." She followed that up by saying again, that she just couldn't see how this could be true because they (meaning the GB) aren't "like that".

It's a bit frustrating not being able to convice her of the truth of the court ruling on the money when it's right there in black and white. I can see some difficulty in convincing her of the abuse itself but what do you do when you've shown them something and they just say, "I can't believe that's what happened"?

In any case, I hope that this has possibly planted the first seed of doubt. I'm going to let it sit for a little while before I water it again.

sens

In any case, I hope that this has possibly planted the first seed of doubt.

Yer Possibly...lets hope so.

It amazes me that they are the first ones to jump on any other religion rather than their own.

Lady Lee

For your next "watering" try printing out some stories (with permission) and offer them to her based on the idea that we have no reason to lie just like the ex-cardinal would have no reason to lie.

She could swallow one case but dozens?

She might be able to excuse one congregation or one group of elders but hundreds from all over the world?

Keep her thinking the way you have. It is excellent. You lead her down the path and she is forced to come up with the conclusion herself.

Don't distract yourself with other issues like the UN or RandCam. Stick with the one.

Good luck

kj

Where can I see a copy of the press release? I might want to share it with my mom.

kj

shiloh

kj, Goto to the News section on silentlambs. It's in there, I believe.

Nathan Natas

Here yo go, KJ, I added the quote from Mr. Brumley to set the tone:

"Our top priority is to protect the victims." -- Philip Brumley, General Counsel for Jehovah's Witnesses.

PRESS RELEASE - For Immediate Release

Canadian abuse victim forced to pay $142,000 to Jehovah's Witnesses

Toronto, Ontario -- A judge's ruling regarding costs in the Vicki Boer trial has been handed down today. Victoria Boer is a former Jehovah's Witness that sued three church elders and the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of Canada, the religion's governing body, for the injurious manner they handled her claims of abuse that she suffered when she was as young as 11 years old

In her original decision, Her Honour Justice Molloy ruled that the Watch Tower Society was negligent in the manner in which they treated Ms. Boer. She awarded Ms. Boer $5,000 as a result of the Watch Tower?s callous treatment when she brought forward her claims of abuse. Of primary focus in the negligence was the forced confrontation between Ms. Boer and her abuser, in front of 3 elders of the Church. None of these elders have any secular training in dealing with victims of sexual abuse.

In the surprise decision released today on costs, despite her ruling of negligence against the Watch Tower Society, Her Honour Justice Anne Molloy found Ms. Boer liable for all court costs incurred after 2001. In 2001, the Watchtower Society offered Ms. Boer $20,000 to settle this matter out of court. They later made a substantially higher offer to settle in the range of $50,000 but it included a strictly worded gag order.

Vicki Boer commented regarding these offers, "It has never been about money. If it were, I would have taken the offers. It is about a victim?s right to tell their story and to let people know how the Jehovah?s Witnesses treat victims of sexual abuse. The refusal of the offers was also based on the advice of legal counsel."

Ms. Boer further comments on today's decision awarding costs to the Jehovah's Witnesses, "It's sad when the legal system finds an organization guilty of negligence and then punishes the victim. This legalistic decision will now effect my whole family. Physically and emotionally I paid for the abuse, and now they want me to actually pay the Society that helped protect an abuser. Paying them is akin to justifying their sick policy..."

Between the costs incurred by her own lawyer and now the award of costs in favour of the Watch Tower Society, Ms. Boer will owe in excess of $220,000; $140,000 of which is to be paid to the Watch Tower Society for their costs.

The Watch Tower?s in-house legal department, W. Glen How & Associates, is run and operated as part of the Church?s Religious Order. All the lawyers and secretaries that are part of the religious order (Religious Order of Special Full Time Servants and Bethelites) have signed a vow of poverty and volunteer their time. In return they are provided room and board within the church?s headquarters in Georgetown, Ontario just north west of Toronto.

John Saunders, a researcher for W. Glen How & Associates in the early 90's, gave testimony during the trial last October. Ironically during an interview he gave after testifying, he commented, "Even if the Society were to win this case outright, I would hope they would do the right thing and not further injure a victim of childhood abuse by pursuing costs. People don?t donate money to the Witnesses so they can turn around and attack, retaliate and intimidate survivors of childhood sexual abuse inside the court system."

Neither side has released a decision regarding appeals.

ashitaka

Well, no matter what she said, it's obvious that you're getting through to her. Now, it's a slow process of her wanting to know more. Don't force-feed her. Mentions here and there, a casual discussion can always be good.

ash

Nathan Natas

Shiloh, VERY well done, my friend! What you were watching was cognitive dissonance playng out in your friend's mind.

There are some people for whom the mistreatment of OTHERS is enough to AWAKE! them to the reality of the WTS cult, but for most, as AlanF once pointed out, it has to become PERSONAL before they really snap out of it. But this day you have planted some seeds. Nurture them.

kj

Thanks. That is an unbelievable story. I will share it with my mom, but I will probably get a similar response as I did after I asked her about the Dateline show. She will claim it is just someone's personal grudge against the WT. Sad.

kj

shiloh

kj,

Honestly, that was the reaction I would've expected from my friend had I just been asking her about the case itself. With the latest ruling on the court costs, I was able to pretty much marginalize the particulars of the case and focus on the money ruling. Decisions on wrongdoing can always be second guessed or minimized by an apologist. What I was trying to focus on was the action of the WT in the court cost portion of the case. There is much less wiggle room there. It's a pretty clear case of the WT "going after" someone in a retributive or vindictive way with the only real motivation to do so being revenge or intimidation or both.

I asked my friend, "Is this what Jesus would want? Would someone who is professing to follow the example of Christ do this (go after money) to someone who has already been hurt so profoundly whether it's the fault of the WT or not?" She answered "no, of course not."

My JW Friends reaction to the Vicki Boer press release

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