Has anyone felt like leaving God altogether?

by lookingnow22 82 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Marilyn

  Actually MD, for those that believe in it, prayer is as good as meditiation, which is apparently very good for us. I have never thought I was very smart - but it astounds me that people like you and JH and AF and lot's of others I have enormous respect for, all took a while to work out about God being a con. My loss of faith in the JWs and God was pretty well simultaneous. I could see the jw thing not working, and I guess there was a degree of the 'where else' syndrome - but only inconjuction with 'why look eslewhere'? I guess I stayed in a long time while I worked out a lot of things. Either that or there really is a god - cause like I told you I'm pretty dumb!!!! I've asked a lot of people in the 20+ yrs I've been out - especially academics and people of science but the answers are always vague and fuzzy. No substance. For years I thought someone would eventually say something that would turn my mind back to believing. But they had to say something logical and ingisghtful. It hasn't happened yet. Btw I don't think the washing powder from Amway would have been worth putting up with all those Amway drones!! EEK!

  Marilyn
• 

  Jang

  At times I feel guilty for thinking like this, as if I'm treating the "Almighty Creator" in a blasphous way.

  I spoke to Dave about it and he said he feels the same way. So maybe lots people feel like this

  I felt like that for about 2 1/2 years after I left. Almost all the xjws that I have talkd to in the last 20 years have felt the same.

  Let's face it - we are burnt out on religion period. Why would we want to put ourselves through more before we are past that? If you burn out in a job need a couple of years to recover before you can face it again .... no different here.

  It is best to leave any decisions for or against until we are past the worst of it all, and can separate the good from the bad in our experience. That's when we can think clearly and if we make a decision we are doing because that is the way we want to go and not the way we are being "pushed" in reaction to our experience.
• 

  Introspection

  For those of you who have expressed something to the effect of "nobody has told me anything to make me think otherwise", regardless of your current thinking/position, don't you think that you need to be able to understand what they're talking about? Now don't take this the wrong way, but quite frankly some things are just not easy to understand. I can understand someone explaining quantum physics in a round about way, but I've forgotten too much of the math I took in school to actually logically follow the details. My point is a part of that does depend upon the individual. Why would someone with true insight come knocking on my door? Do we expect people who really knows something to come to us like the witnesses do???
• 

  Abaddon

  I agree with those who say you can't 'leave' something that doesn't exist.

  Initially I had vauge remnants of a belief in god. But logically, scriptually, scientifically there is no proof of god - nor does any other religion I have investigated 'prove' that god exists. I realised this over about three years.

  I thus feel that while there may be forces we don't know yet and that there may be intelligent entities elsewhere in the Universe, there is no personified creator that is concerned with our lives, no god, no heaven, no hell; it's all make-believe, just like Zeus and Thor, and will be seen in the same light as those beliefs are now in another two thousand years, probably a lot sooner.

  kes152; please prove the Bible is god's word before quoting it. I find the contradictions in the Bible (both externally and internally) show it is not god's word and would be interested in your reasoning, as you must have very clear and definative proof to be so confident.
• 

  kes152

  Abaddon,

  you said:

  kes152; please prove the Bible is god's word before quoting it. I find the contradictions in the Bible (both externally and internally) show it is not god's word and would be interested in your reasoning, as you must have very clear and definative proof to be so confident.

  I cannot prove that the Bible is God's word. The reason why? Because neither I, nor the Father, NOR the Son, NOR holy spirit EVER claimed that the Bible was "God's word."

  Even the Bible itself does not claim to be "God's word." It is very clear in stating that the 'word of God' is not a book, nor 'writings.'

  This is the word of God:

  John 1:1
  John 1:8
  Revelation 19:13
  Hebrews 4:12, 13 (notice the word "he")

  The Bible, is a book that contain writings, some are inspired, some aren't. The reason it was permitted to come in this form? Because our faith should not be in a book anyways. Our faith SHOULD be in the Son.

  No one gets life by "knowing the scriptures." They get life by "believing in the Son" and thus recieving holy spirit. The Son is GREATER than the Bible. All authority was given him. I listen to him. If a letter from Paul says one thing and my Lord says another, I go with my Lord. Paul cannot save me, nor any other apostle. Only the Son.

  The Son even mentioned the FUTILITY of 'searching the scriptures' because you think you can 'live forever' by means of them.

  John 5:39, 40

  But of course, "men" have risen up "among us" teaching the bible to be "the Word of God" such a title that solely belongs to Christ, not a book.

  For those who do not have the 'faith' to "hear" the Christ directly, these scriptures are provided for a 'basis' for their faith. It's either you'll believe in Him, or you won't.
• 

  Prisca

  No, I haven't "left" God altogether.

  I will be honest in saying that I have doubts and questions that can't be answered. Unlike my JW days, I don't expect black-and-white answers to be at my fingertips. I may be able to figure out these things in time, or I may not. At the moment, after 30 yrs of JW indoctrination, I've had enough of it all. At least for the time being.

  I still believe in a Creator - when I'm around nature I feel closer to God than any building man could construct.

  I would describe myself as spiritual more than "religious" - I believe in the principles of the Bible, but also believe in taking responsibility for one's own life, rather than relying on our Maker to solve everything for us.

  Thank you for listening
• 

  Jang

  Esther, I used to feel like that about Paul too.

  One day I cam across a book that changed my whole outlook and made me dig into it a little further. The book was by former JW ELder Charles Trombley and called Who Said Women Can't Teach? From there I read a little more ... and one book by Katherine Bushnell was a real doozy.

  When you are ready I have all these in the library here and you are welcome to borrow them.

  Just to give you some idea of how men change it so you can't see the real meaning in a translation go look at 1 Tim 5:14 in the Greek and you will see the women are told to be the oikodespoto

  oiko means "house"
  despoto means "uncontrolled power"

  Now when it is the masculine oikodespotes then "master or ruler of the house" as you can see in places like Luke 22:11

  Now Esther, we all know what a DESPOT is .... and that is what Paul told us to be in our own homes.

  Paul, coming from a Jewish background would have know how things worked in kosher Jewish homes ..... and even today, a Jewish man will not superced the authority of his wife when it comes to household matters .....

  JanG
  CAIC Website: http://caic.org.au/zjws.htm
  Personal Webpage: http://uq.net.au/~zzjgroen/
• 

  Abaddon

  Thanks for replying kes152;

  You say;
  

  I cannot prove that the Bible is God's word. The reason why? Because neither I, nor the Father, NOR the Son, NOR holy spirit EVER claimed that the Bible was "God's word."

  Even the Bible itself does not claim to be "God's word." It is very clear in stating that the 'word of God' is not a book, nor 'writings.'

  What happened to "All scriptures are inspired and beneficial?" Timothy isn't it? Can't remember.

  This is the word of God:

  John 1:1
  John 1:8
  Revelation 19:13
  Hebrews 4:12, 13 (notice the word "he")

  Er, no, what that is is some dead bloke attributing the words he was writing to god. It's simple;

  And God said to Abaddon; "You must abstain from blue coloured M&M's, and from Rayon, and from Tuppaware in all its form."

  That's easy isn't it? You say;

  The Bible, is a book that contain writings, some are inspired, some aren't. The reason it was permitted to come in this form? Because our faith should not be in a book anyways. Our faith SHOULD be in the Son.

  And how exactly does one determine which bits are inspired and which bits aren't? Is there some special highlighter pen? I really don't mean to be sarcastic - I have a genetic condition. But you talk of 'faith'. We are created in god's image, are we not?

  As such our desire for proof is natural and reasonable. We have enquiring minds, god-given freewill, and yet we should have faith? Belief in god should be from demonstrable fact, not from unprovable faith.

  IF our lives and/or immortal souls are at peril if we do not do the right thing, IF god is a god of love, he would make it clear WHAT the right course is.

  Would he condemn millions born as non-Christians who by geographical accident may never be exposed to the Bible? Obviously not; god is love.

  With this claimed characteristic it is unthinkable that god allow doubt and confusion to reign. He could let ALL people know his way in a way that was incontravertable. He does not. Thus his existance in any personified way as spoken of in the Judaeo-Christo-Islamic corpus of literature is doubtful.

  If he exists he is asking people to make a leap of faith, and logically this does not conform to god being love if the result of being WRONG is non-existance or worse. If god ISN'T love, why should he be worshipped?

  For those who do not have the 'faith' to "hear" the Christ directly, these scriptures are provided for a 'basis' for their faith. It's either you'll believe in Him, or you won't.

  And god is partial? Your arguement suggests he is by bearing special witness to some due to an intagible characteristic and not to other.

  I can understand your affection for the idea; it's a nice idea, god. But there is no evidence, scientifically or logically.
• 

  jelly

  The question is have I ever felt like leaving god altogether? Well the short answer is No.

  The long answer is that I have decided to leave religion altogether. Many people ask the question when leaving the organization ‘if Jehovah is not using the governing body what is he using’? My answer to that is the creator is using me to lead me on my own spiritual path. So in reality I don’t know if I could be defined as a Christian anymore however I do think that Jesus’ example is a valid one for leading a healthy life. Likewise I do not think of myself as a Hindu but Gandhi also left a sterling example of how a person should try to live.

  So in summation I believe that there is some creative process that has intelligence and that is God, I don’t think any religion on the face of the planet has the correct exact understanding of what that is. However I do believe many religious traditions hold myths that a valuable for gaining wisdom to lead a better life.

  Jelly (sorry my thoughts are not well organized I wrote this at 5:08 AM, I need to sleep but I fear the clown will eat me)
• 

  COMF

  And how exactly does one determine which bits are inspired and which bits aren't?

  Oh, that's easy. You just find yourself somebody who directly receives messages from God, huh, kes. In kes's case, it's that prophetess-wannabee from H2O, who has gone by the posting names Phoebe, LifesWaterFree, AGuest, and SJ (changing the name each time after pitching a fit and saying she was leaving for good), and who now owns NewLight2's forum, having taken it over in the same way that a cancer takes over the body.

  If you want to know the word o' God, son, why, just get on over there and hang around for a minute. She'll be having another message from him any second now. Ain't that right, kes.

  COMF