Is it just me, or is Watchtower lowering its standards? (page 4)

Vidiot

Multiple elder visits… wrist-slaps for minors… 3-month probationary removal… everybody says hi anyways…

…at this point, WTF is the point?

It definitely is much easier to qualify to be an MS or elder. And very difficult to be removed. They are desperate for men to work for free. The majority of men still physically in don’t want to reach out as they like to call it.

Of the men who are appointed MS or elders, so many appointed men never go on ministry and most meeting are on zoom. They also keep cancelling assignments or say they need a break from any assignment. If you say you have stress or anxiety then you can come off any assignments but it’s very hard to be removed from your position.

It used to be if you found it was all a bit too much then you came off. Now you can stay on in name only.

there is a real need for speakers. So much so the CO is pressuring men to do more. Some just say no, what can the CO do? The answer is nothing.

The public talk coordinator keeps asking for brothers to give talks but the pool of speakers is getting smaller.

sometimes we have the same visiting speakers over and over again.

the congregation is starting to notice and say why don’t we get any new brothers it’s the same few we keep get visiting.

the cat is out of the bag now. There are less and less brothers.

we keep getting watchtowers and such saying the older men need to train younger men to take over. The issue is with this is that most of these older men were in this position as younger men and they never thought the system could last this long.

the current 1914 teaching means we should not need younger men to be trained up that would mean we could still have a long time left???

JohnR1975

wonder what would happen if an elder kept saying no to any assignment he was asked to do? Would he get taken off for not doing any assignments

Nothing will happen. There are elders in my current and old congregation like this. I remember this one old brother who said he had health issues but was fine when it suited him. All he ever did was go to elders meetings and accept anything he liked the sound of like getting involved in judicial matters. But he never ever gave any talks from the platform

JohnR1975

This is very good news for any men who are physically in but mentally out and who are appointed because they don’t have to come off they’re appointed MS or Elder they could just stay on and keep saying no to any assignments they are given unless they feel occasionally they might want to do some of the assignments They never have to go on the ministry on first call they never have to go to meetings. They could stay on zoom or if they occasionally feel like it go to the Kingdom Hall and go to the meeting and if they feel like it and syrup and have all the association and go to the social gatherings But don’t be pushed into doing something you don’t want to do when the circuit overseer keeps asking you to do assignments just say no and when he says why not just say I’ve got too much on life is very hard if you have to earn a living yourself it’s not like those of us who have to earn a living ourselves Get a rent bills, travel food and all of their expenses paid for we have to work hard and it’s getting very difficult with the cost of living crisis

Simon

The Watchtower had standards?!

Journeyman

we keep getting watchtowers and such saying the older men need to train younger men to take over. The issue is with this is that most of these older men were in this position as younger men and they never thought the system could last this long.

Not only that, but in the past when those elders were relatively young, they didn't think ahead about who would take over as they got older and less capable, and as the problems they had to deal with got worse. I know of several situations where elders kept overlooking young men as "not ready" for years, until those men moved on, either leaving the Org, becoming too busy with family and job, or in some cases becoming sick or otherwise no longer able to be considered. Now those ageing elders have the dilemma that the 'supply' of potential servants and elders is drying up, just when 'problems' in the congregations (family break-ups, depression, financial pressure, etc) are getting worse.

And it's not as though they weren't warned. Those WT articles you mentioned aimed at elders have been coming out every so often for years, saying they should train up younger men. But they didn't do it, probably because many of them were comfortable in their position and didn't want younger men challenging them.

The whole elder arrangement has been a cosy men's club in some congregations, and a fiery rivalry in others. Either way, in those situations, there would be no incentive for established elders to admit 'outside' younger men into it.

And if you set the bar so high that even say, a single instance of a young man "confessing" to viewing porn or some other youthful hi-jinks meant he was not considered for years, it's no wonder the Org is facing a crisis.

This is very good news for any men who are physically in but mentally out and who are appointed because they don’t have to come off they’re appointed MS or Elder they could just stay on and keep saying no to any assignments they are given unless they feel occasionally they might want to do some of the assignments

Indeed. I know of a number of MS and even a couple of elders who are rarely at meetings, only give a short item every month or two (maybe Gems or one of those 5 min ones before the book study), and apart from that are rarely seen or heard (never commenting in meetings or being seen at groups during the week). It seems you can only lose appointment now for being proved to have done something 'bad', or if you ask to step down. You cn always give ill-health or stress as an excuse. And with no need to even state your ministry hours if you're not a pioneer, it's even easier. Fine by me!

blondie

Let me add, what the WTS says in writing about training younger male jws, is much different from how elders actually teach. 1) What is said in the elder's manual is more important then what that new elder thinks the bible says, even if the WT directive does not use any pertinent scriptural support. 2) (if they still do this) Usually the CO looks over the publisher record cards, to assess the "spiritual" health of the congregation, missed one month reporting time, not reporting for 6 months, df'd and see if the elders have made a personal call on them (elders do a semblance of this making what my husband calls drive-by calls, drive by and assess if any one is home or catch them doing something "bad" such as holiday decorations or sneaking a smoke). Yes, the WTS uses a scripture that says that the shepherd must pay attention to the health of the sheep. 3) pick apart the length of a brother's hair, a sister's tight dresses, etc. The elders train new elders to do these things and many others, depending on the congregation. Yes, you must obey the elders or be labeled, a "problem" elder.

JohnR1975

You don’t need to do any preparation these days

you could turn up at any meeting without even looking at material and give the item as it’s all just there for you

Is it just me, or is Watchtower lowering its standards?

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