Science vs. Spirituality? (page 2)

Sunchild

No, for once the cause is discovered it ceases to be spirituality and becomes solely silence.

Why can't it be both at once? Meditation has been proven to be good for a person's health, but it's still considered a spiritual practice.

Maybe this is hard for me to understand or explain because, to me, everything is part of the whole, and very few things (if any) are mutually exclusive. I know this must be about as much fun as explaining "red" to a colorblind person, but if possible, I'd really like to understand how people can see things as being so... separate. I want to understand other people a bit more, so that I can relate to them better instead of feeling frustrated by our differences.

*Rochelle.

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"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."

Sunchild

Larc, check your e-mail.

*Rochelle.

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"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."

larc

Sunchild,

What you said about meditation and science is not correct. It has been known for a long time that meditation is beneficial to one's health. Many research psycologists have written about this. They have taken it a step farther and developed a method called biofeedback which has very powerful, benefical effects on mental and physical health.

By the way, are you the Flint person I had in mind?

Sunchild

What you said about meditation and science is not correct.

All I said was that meditation is a spiritual practice which has been scientifically proven to have positive health effects. Since when was meditation no longer considered a spiritual practice, and you've said yourself that it has positive effects. I get the feeling you're not listening to me.

And yes, I'm the person you had in mind. I've sent you an e-mail.

*Rochelle.

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"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."

Seeker

I'd really like to understand how people can see things as being so... separate

Don't think of them as separate, then. Think of science as not needing spirituality, but if you want to enjoy both go right ahead. As the saying among the ladies goes, science needs spirituality as a fish needs a bicycle.

For instance, your meditation example. If science can explain why meditation works, that's all it needs to do. It doesn't need spirituality.

Now, if you want both in your life, that's different. But science itself does not need it.

Sunchild

If science can explain why meditation works, that's all it needs to do.

Yes, I know. I never said it had to do more.

I really don't think I explained this well. I've seen a lot of "Science this" and "Science that" so far, but only a tiny hint of "I think" or "I believe this way because..." which was really my main concern. I don't know if I can clarify things, and I'm sorry that I bought this up.

*Rochelle.

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"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."

hippikon

My question is, Do you believe that science and spirituality are diametrically opposed

Your definition of spiritualty is very broad. Religion on the other hand I feel is diametrically opposed to Scientific method. Religion requires faith – trust in an intangible supposition. Very unscientific. At best religion is used to fill in the gaps in scientific understanding. Ie If there isn’t a satisfactory scientific explanation there must be a spiritual one than can be adjusted to fit. Scientific method is a search for absolute truth based on provable fact. I think religion for the most part is an attempt to answer that which science so far has been inconclusive.

Science doesn’t attempt to answer questions like why are we here and what is the purpose in life but the answer to how we got here has bearing on that. The opposite also is true of religion. Religion answering the question “Why are we hear?” will also invent an answer to “how did we get here?”

In summary: Why do we have to answer questions by inventing God.

Think. We have not progressed through four hundred years of scientific realization only to arrive at the unchangeable now. More and more progress will be achieved in the field of science until not only evolution must be accepted by the most hard-bitten fundy, but progress in the field of quantuum physics will convince the most hard-bitten materialistic, deterministic scientist of the existence of God.

Sorry Francoise I respect your opinion but I don’t agree. I don’t think it is reasonable to say “Wow this is incredible – I don’t understand it therefore God must exist and have designed and invented it. ( I admit I know very little about quantum physics. In fact I’m not even sure I understand your last statement)

like, for example, the good effects that spirituality can have on a person's mental and physical health

History shows that religion for the most part has had a detrimental effect on science and humanity.

I think myths are a valuable part of the human experience

Fables and fairy stories are different from spirituality / religion

"But it does move"
Galileo

hippikon

BTW My disbelief in God is not based on science. I just don't belive in invisible do nothings.

edwkey

There is not such a thing like Science vs. Spirituality....because there are two different disciplines.

Let's see what the dictionary says:

Main Entry: spir.i.tu.al.i.ty
Pronunciation: "spir-i-ch&-'wa-l&-tE
Function: noun
Date: 15th century Inflected Form(s): plural -ties
1 : something that in ecclesiastical law belongs to the church or to a cleric,as such
2 : CLERGY
3 : sensitivity or attachment to religious values

So, what the heck "spirituality" has to do with scientific facts ?...NOTHING at all !!!!

The Force be with you !!!
4 : the quality or state of being spiritual

Sunchild

Your definition of spiritualty is very broad.

I know, and I defined it that way on purpose. Some people I've encountered act though it's a terrible thing for me to even have a spiritual side (for the curious, I'm a Wiccan, not a Christian, and I'm not out to convert anyone), and I just don't understand why it bothers them so much, let alone why they're so hellbent on talking me out of it. That's what I'm trying to figure out here.

Fables and fairy stories are different from spirituality / religion

The topic was actually myths, not ordinary fables or fairytales. Stories of Zeus, Isis, Jesus, Kali, Etc., are very much a part of spirituality and religion, past, present or both. And in my own belief system, myths are a very imortant tool for illustrating how the seasons flow, personifying different aspects of the Divine, etc.

*Rochelle.

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"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."

Science vs. Spirituality?

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