Heroin Overdose=Daughter=HELP!

by patio34 29 Replies latest jw friends

  • patio34
    patio34

    Hi all,

    I'm having a crisis in my family and really need some advice and even (((())))!

    Background:
    Daughter is 28-yrs-old. Has illegitimate 2 boys, ages 4.5 and 22 months. She has a long history of drug use since her teens. She also has an explosive temper.

    Multiple health problems also. Most recent and critical is epilepsy, which is why for 10 weeks the boys have been living with me. She is on Phenobarbitol for the epilepsy. Can't drive nor keep her kids by herself, because of risk of blacking out from seizure or falling into deep sleep from meds.

    Suspicion:
    For a while, the family (2 jw sons, 1 df'd son) have been suspicious of illegal drug use also.

    Crisis:
    2 days ago, on Sunday 6/17/01, she od'd on heroin and 'died' at the hospital, but was revived. Our suspicions were confirmed.

    I haven't talked to her since. I talked to Children's Protective Services yesterday re gaining custody, but they said it might be better to sit tight as long as she is cooperative in not wanting the kids at her house when she is alone.

    Immediate Problems:
    The State pays for day care while I work, but that is running out 6/29. Then I can't afford to pay it. The daughter says she will get another agency to pay for it, since she is disabled. But if she doesn't, then CPS says I can have her give me some kind of legal guardianship and I can obtain it.

    But all of that will take time I presume. In the meantime, day care for both of them costs 1000 a month!

    Options:
    Try to get custody of them now. Sit tight and take my 2 weeks vacation when $$ run out and then get funding. CPS says it could all blow up if they get involved because they have to prove that she is endangering them and see it for themselves. Even when she od'd she knew they were safe with me, so that doesn't count.

    I'm seeing a psychologist throughout all of this through my work. He says 'do you have any new friends since leaving your religion?' I say 'when, since I now have two children all the time? But I do have this discussion board to 'talk' to people.' He says 'use it for this too.'

    Oh, woe is me! Any ideas, experience in this area, guidance??

    Pat

  • OrangeBlossom
    OrangeBlossom

    I'm not in a position to offer advice, perhaps someone else will post something that can help you.

    But I can offer you my sympathy for what you are going through. This must be an extemely difficult time for you.

    Please keep us updated.

  • Abaddon
    Abaddon

    Dear Pat,

    My thoughts are with you, as I have witnessed (in the non-JW way) what Heroin addiction can do, as my eldest brother was a Heroin addict.

    First thing. Talk to your daughter. In order for her to either get the funding for you to have them in day care, or to transfer guardianship to you so you can continue to get funding, I think you need to do that.

    I'm not saying it will be easy or that you'll know exactly what to say. And don't give her a hard time, it's too bloody obvious and will probably result in her temper flaring up.

    Approach on common ground; you both have the intrests of the kids in mind, so just deal with that first, asking what she thinks the best thing to do is, rather than presenting her with a 'this is what I want you to do' kind of deal, and discuss it.

    That way you will actually talk, rather than getting into a shouting match that will help neither one of you. It will also resolve the funding issue for the kids daycare.

    The main thing with family who are drug dependant is keeping the dialogue open so that when they want help they know they can come to you.

    All the best.

  • Kent
    Kent

    Hi Pat;

    Drug problems are shit, yes - and if you have to pay for treatment yourself, it might be expensive.

    I know quite a lot about drugs and drug related problems - and the problem here is, maybe, to get your daughter into a new environment - new people, new friends.

    The problem is that drugs, herion, does cost money - and there isn't many ways for a girl to rise that kind of money. Then we're in the merry-go-round, I'm afraid.

    I don't say this to make everything seem hopeless - but I just try to draw a realistic picture of what's going on here. Change of environment and friends is absolutely neccesary!

    I don't know if she cares for her kids - but she might soon face the possibilities of loosing them if she doesn't strighten up.

    The first thing you should do is talk to her!!!!!. Talk to her a lot, and LISTEN to her. There is always a reason, my friend. Nobody starts up with heroine just for fun.

    Find out what's the problem behind all this - and then you can start planning what you should do.

    I'm afraid this isn't all the help in the world - but there isn't the best chanses when these things happens anyway.

    Show her that you love her - and never let her down" She needs you!

    Yakki Da

    Kent

    "The only difference between God and Adolf Hitler is that God is more proficient at genocide."

    Daily News On The Watchtower and the Jehovah's Witnesses:
    http://watchtower.observer.org

  • outnfree
    outnfree

    Hi, Pat.

    I may have something to offer.

    CPS will NOT step in to remove the children from their mother unless she endangers them, which you have stated she does not.

    I am the full guardian (in my state there is "limited" or "full" guardianship") of my grand-niece. For several years I tried to get CPS to remove her from her mother's care, as the mother has borderline personality disorder and was in and out of mental health units and her father was in jail. However, because the mother placed my grand-niece in the care of her aunts (never mind the atmosphere in their homes!) and thus "reasonable care" was being taken by the mother to keep the child safe, CPS would do nothing.

    So. Finally I got custody by at least one parent agreeing to LIMITED guardianship. If the father(s) do not have parental rights, you must deal only with your daughter. Perhaps she will realize that it would be better for you to have guardianship and will agree to at least limited guardianship (if this exists in your state) if not full.

    Things can actually move quite quickly once she signs the papers (usually a form available at the county courthouse -- Probate or Estate Division, as legal guardianships are also used for incompetant or ill heirs, etc.). In the meantime, she can give you a letter authorizing you to have the children in custody and allowing you to authorize any necessary medical care. A court date will be set as soon as the signed forms are submitted, and in the meantime, you will have temporary legal guardianship.

    My court appearance was very brief and cut & dried. "You are petitioning for legal guardianship of xxxxxx. What is your relationship? Where are the parents? Why did you only request limited guardianship? ("Because that was the deal with her mother.") I am granting you FULL guardianship because I think it is in the best interests of the child. ("But, Your Honor...") Yes. This way YOU control visitation. Thank you, Mrs. xxxx." Gavel down.

    We did not request any financial assistance from the parents (yes, they can be forced to contribute) or from the state. It seems in your case that because you work (I don't.) you will need some kind of state aid. Sorry I don't have any experience in this area. Perhaps somebody else will?

    I'm going to send you my e-mail address in case you'd like to talk more.

    outnfree

  • outnfree
    outnfree

    Forgot the hugs!!!!

    (((((((((((((Patio)))))))))))))

    outnfree

  • mommy
    mommy

    Oh Pat! (((((((hugs)))))))
    I recall you mentioning having the kids there, I did not know the rest of the situation. You have alot on your plate right now, and I wish there was something I could do to help. The children are probably more needy of your attention as well, due to their mother's actions.

    Financially there are so many programs avail, it is just finding them in your community. There are many church groups that also offer assistance. As far as being the guardian I am not familiar with the legalities of that, but Outnfree gave you some good info. I suggest you contact a social worker for a list of community helpers. There is also usually a child head start program in every area. A friend of mine recently applied, and is only paying $82 a month for her daughter, and the programs are really worth it.

    I know the cost of daycare is outrageous. For my two children the cost is $160 week, but when they were younger I remember paying more. Not to mention food, and clothing that they need, as well as fun stuff for them to do. What a position you are in, my heart goes out to you. One other suggestion I have is to talk to legal aid. They are minumally inexpensive, or even free based on your income. I believe there are many things you can do, because you are the grandparent. You can call any lawyers office and obtain the phone number.

    I recently had a run-in with CPS and I can tell you that there are not many brain cells in the program(at least here anyway)There is so much red tape, adn noone is willing to bend the rules a bit, and cut some. I sometimes wonder if the "best interest of the child" is really their intent.

    I am so glad you have shared with us. I know this internet world is not reality, but the comfort you can get here is amazing!

    (((((hugs))))) and "pleasant thoughts"
    love,
    wendy

  • Darkangel
    Darkangel

    Pat,

    I feel your pain, both on the needing to care for the children, both from the daughter standpoint as well as the grandkids standpoint.

    Speaking as a former user of heroin, you ultimately have to try to step into your daughter's shoes, just for a moment, no matter how upset you may be with her. From experience, I can tell you what heroine does: it makes you feel like everything is peaceful and there are no worries at all. Everything seems to be at peace in your life, and you want to just sit there and relax, soak it all up.
    It's a sense of peaceful euphoria.
    The downside, of course, is waking up the next morning after the drug starts to leave your system. It HURTS. Picture the worst hangover known to mankind and multiply that by 1000. If you ever had a migraine, imagine that all throughout your body. You want to curl into a ball and die, anything to make that horrible pain stop.
    It's even worse when you have loved ones on top of that, and shame, paranoia, and pride all take hold. You know you're hurting them, and your body is telling you to stop hurting it and get some more. Heroin is a lot easier to get than you would think. My habit was free because my friends were junkies, and when they nodded, they wanted company. I could pretty much get anything if I was in the right place at the right time. I swore that the day I needed to actually PAY for the drugs was the day that I was officially a drug fiend. Little did I realise just how fast you get addicted to heroin. Your body goes through DT's from just one dose. I'd been a regular user of prescription drugs before that (they were prescribed for my stomach problems, and just general anxiety attacks), but no one told me they were addictive, and the bottle said take as needed. Next thing I knew I was detoxing when I tried to stop taking them. Heroin detox is a lot like that, but worse.

    I took heroin because I was miserable at the time. I'd heard that you coul overdose on the first try, and it made no difference to me because the way I looked at it, it was a way out either way.

    I made it through my addictions with help from my family. If they hadn't been there for me, I most likely would have killed myself through overdose instead of just going through the detox pain. They gave me something to live for. I understand that you're probably furious with your daughter for doing what she's done, and it's understandable. I was mad at myself for the longest time. Especially after seeing friends die from overdoses.

    What I'm attempting to say is, first and foremost, try to understand your daughter's pain. You don't have to stop being mad at her, just try to be there when she comes back around. It won't be easy. It wasn't easy for my mother, and I didn't even have kids. I'm happy to say that I've been drug free for about two years now. The past has been left in the past, and I've gotten on with my life and a successful career. It wasn't easy. You have to want to succeed at it. You have my support and I'll be happy to give you my email address if you want to vent to me. Just keep a smile for your daughter and show you support her, and she'll be alright in the end. This timeframe is going to be the hardest of all, for both of you.
    As to the children, this will be very rough on them as well. Try not to vent to them about their mother. If your daughter really doesn't want the children, then by all means ask her to give you custody. If she wants them, however, you taking them away might only make her problems worse, sad to say. From my own standpoint, I've been as careful as possible regarding birth control, etc., because I've always felt that if a child comes from me, it should be intentional and wanted.

    Ending, just from the standpoint of a former druggie, don't give up hope. With love and caring, you, your daughter, and the children can get through this. It will be a rough road. The end of the journey is worth it, however. My mother and I are closer than we ever were before. Once I got straight, I saw things from her perspective, and I realised how selfish I had been. We gained a better understanding of each other.

    For the immediate problem that you face, the two week vacation might not be a bad idea. If possible, try to re-open the lines of communication with your daughter, and let her know that you're there for her, but you won't be a doormat. Tell her how you feel, and ask her for her point of view. I think you'll find that she is most likely in the same frightening place that I was in not all that long ago.
    Is there any way you could possibly hire a babysitter instead of a daycare? Someone you know in your neighborhood who could use the extra cash? Someone you trust, who you know likes children?

    I hope everything works out for you, and I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you and your daughter, and the children.

  • safe4kids
    safe4kids

    (((((((((((((((((Patio)))))))))))))))))

    I don't have a lot of useful information to share, as I've never had to deal with the situation that you're in...but I wanted to express my care and concern for you. You will be in my thoughts...

    DarkAngel, I really liked what you had to say. Dealing with a family member who is an addict is difficult, at best. But as you brought out, there is hope so long as the person wants it. I was very touched by the following:
    "For the immediate problem that you face, the two week vacation might not be a bad idea. If possible, try to re-open the lines of communication with your daughter, and let her know that you're there for her, but you won't be a doormat. Tell her how you feel, and ask her for her point of view. I think you'll find that she is most likely in the same frightening place that I was in not all that long ago."
    I've been in recovery from alcoholism for going on 5 years now but I will never forget those early days when the world was an extremely frightening place. I didn't abuse alcohol because I didn't love my family...I just couldn't help myself. Patio, I echo what DarkAngel said above, let her know you love her but don't be a doormat. It's a difficult line to walk but the rewards are well worth it. And please...I dont know if you're thinking this at all, but please don't feel that you 'caused' her drug problem in any way. Nobody caused my alcoholism and nobody could help me until I was willing to help myself.
    (((((((((((((Patio))))))))))))) My heart really goes out to you, your daughter, and your grandchildren.

    Dana

    "A single event can awaken within us a stranger totally unknown to us. To live is to be slowly born."
    Antoine de Saint-Exupery

  • Darkangel
    Darkangel

    Dana,

    I wish you the best of luck with your continuing recovery. I've had friends who were and are alcoholics, I suppose at one point I was probably one, given the guidelines for the definition of an alcoholic. Alcohol never left me needing more, however, and the best way for me to deal with it was to just cut back on my drinking habits. MUCH easier that heroin. And very well-said regarding the addiction in relation to family. I loved my family dearly. I would do anything for them. I felt ashamed of my drug use because I knew it was hurting them, yet my physical symptoms wouldn't allow me to stop. I never realised that the way I was feeling mentally was also a heroin side-effect.

    I finally went to a psychiatrist for my manic depression, and was prescribed Zoloft first. The ride was not a fun one. I became a psychological guinea pig at that point. They started trying different combinations of drugs on me. One day I found myself in the hallway of my old apartment staring at the phone jack and drooling on myself. That was the point I just stopped taking everything they had me on, and told my doctor that I had quit cold turkey, that enough was enough. That worried them. They tried Celexa next, with much better results, but still there were too many negative side effects to justify the positive ones. I finally decided to stop taking everything, and see what happened.
    Luckily I found someone who understood everything I was going through, and we helped each other in many ways. neither one of us has touched alcohol in three months since we met. Two years clean from heroin for me, three months clean from alcohol for both of us (well, one drink a month we'll let each other have, just so we'll never be cheap dates. :) )

    When you have support to help you through the rough times, you would be amazed at what can be accomplished. I haven't needed to take Celexa since I met my significant other. My mood swings are less frequent, and when they do happen, I let them out and he holds me til they pass. It's wonderful to know that I have my family's and his support through everything.

    Finding this board has helped me to see many things through others' eyes. To walk in another's shoes, and see the perspectives of many different people. And for the first time, I'm really "seeing" what my mother and family must have gone through. I always had an inkling, but now I see it "in the flesh" so to speak. My main prayer is that I have helped out in some small way, and to know that I at least made the attempt. Understanding comes through knowledge, and vice versa.
    Any assistance I can give will be freely given if it will create a happy ending for everyone. :)

    *still keeping fingers crossed for Pat*

    Angel

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