"Oh Europe's So Racially Tolerant" (page 3)

blacksheep

Indeed, let's remember that the behavior of a few doesn't reflect the entire nation/culture. Would that people remember that when they try to pontificate about the Iraqi POWs. This supposed "outrage" that somehow represents all Americans doesn't feel so good when the shoe is on the other foot...

Sirius Dogma

I would like apologize for my fellow americans who seem to think they are better than the rest of the world and make comments about how they expect bad treatment in other parts of the world because they are american and still don't see how either (or both) of these statements is offensive and ignorant.

blacksheep

I would like apologize for my fellow americans

Apologize for your own sorry butt. You don't represent "Americans."

imallgrowedup

I would like to apologize for Americans who making pompous statements and ass-u-me that some other Americans expect they will get poor treatment abroad simply because they have noticed an increase in "America(n) bashing". Further, I would like to point out that just because it has been observed that this activity is indeed participated in, (hence, the news article), it does not automatically mean that any person who has observed this increase believes that they would be personally bashed simply for setting foot on European soil.

growedup who wishes people wouldn't extrapolate comments into something completely different than was originally intended and who takes great exception at being deemed "offensive" when my intent was nothing even close to how my comment evolved through other posters

Abaddon

ColdRedRain

This is the Utopia of Europe.

Look, it's really easy to make a good arguement if you not only supply the opposing argument but the initial argument as well.

Many Europeans will be happy to agree that the USA is behind Europe on any number of social scales, but not many would argue it is a Utopia. Germany especially sucks and lags behind the rest of Europe as regards race issues.

Most Europeans would agree that one area where racism really still needs to be targetted is the area of football supporters. That's not to say most football supporters are racist; it would be a little tricky as most of the best players ARE black... however, the hooligan element is often identified with racism. This is less than 1% of fans, so excuse me if I think you're being sensationalist and quite probably have never been to Europe.

I can take you for walks through areas in the UK and the Netherlands with LOTS of coffee coloured babies. Interracial marriages are a far bigger deal in the USA. There, 4% of marriages are interacial... but as black people are 12.5% or so of the population, that is really not that impressive, is it? And if you want to really get down to it, in the USA a black man is several times more likely to be executed for the same crime as a white man.

I can compare the perfectly ordinary schools I went to with the ones I visited during a teaching exchange in the USA, and see greater segregation (self imposed) in the USA. At lunch it was like the kids had been sorted by colour. I can cite statistics about how little the percentage of an average black salary in comparison to an average white salary has changed.

So until I see Americans mingling more, in canteens, in marriages, until I see no difference in the outcome of a conviction between a white man and a black man, until I see the differences in black and white salaries equalising, I think I will regard a few thugs spitting as a shameful incident that does not really represent the progress made battling racism in Europe in the past forty years, and regard any American's who think this means the USA has better race relations and policy as just a little under-informed about their own country.

As for Americans being victimised by Europeans, I think that's just a continuation of the classic song of self-pity sung by the right-wing white American male.

Never in the history of human self-pity have people with so much complained about being discriminated against so loudly... bloody cry-babies...

Of course, most of those claims regarding 'bad treatment' come from people whose experience of Europeans is limited to being on the opposing end of discussions with Europeans regarding politics on a bulletin board.

I'm surprised that such people don't realise a bulletin board is a bulletin board and real life is real life. Just because a lot of Europeans think American politics (especially foreign policy) is a rather dangerous and unfunny practical joke doesn't mean they hate or even dislike Americans on an individual basis.

But since when have an absence of facts or knowledge lead to an absence of opinion?

LittleToe

People are people, whatever their birthright.

I have nothing else to add, that hasn't already been stated by my eloquent European contemporaries.

blacksheep

I can take you for walks through areas in the UK and the Netherlands with LOTS of coffee coloured babies. Interracial marriages are a far bigger deal in the USA. There, 4% of marriages are interacial... but as black people are 12.5% or so of the population, that is really not that impressive, is it?

This is one of the most ridiculous arguments to support US "racism" and European "non-racism" that I've heard thus far. First of all, you claim anecdotally, that there are lots of "coffee colored" babies in the Netherlands? What, no precise statistic, as in with the US? And, where are you getting your stats for the US?

Beyond that, I don't know what you call "impressive" but by your figures, 32% of blacks are in interracial marriages. I'd say that's pretty significant.

Beyond that, who ever said "racial interrmarriage" is a sign of racial tolerance? Many people tend to marry those within their own culture, not because they are racists, but because they often share common cultural values, experiences, etc. You are trying to back into the whole racial issue by your hopscotch logic and random, illogical conclusions

And, just to fill you in, I lived in the Netherlands, and the lack of racial disparity was eerie to me, considering that I'm from CA, where's there is a lot of diversity. It was eerie working and socializing with people who were all of the same race, looked alike, thought alike, etc. I was glad to get back to the US, where there was more diversity, in both ideas and appearance.

And, the woman in the Netherlands who assisted me with relocation was a African American; she was married to a Brit. She mentioned how they had to overcome the predudices they experienced.

So, as much as you'd like to portray your country, or Europe in general, as so racially supportive/tolerant, as opposed to the US, you are providing NO proof.

blacksheep

So until I see Americans mingling more, in canteens, in marriages, until I see no difference in the outcome of a conviction between a white man and a black man, until I see the differences in black and white salaries equalising, I think I will regard a few thugs spitting as a shameful incident that does not really represent the progress made battling racism in Europe in the past forty years, and regard any American's who think this means the USA has better race relations and policy as just a little under-informed about their own country.

I'm about ready to puke at your self-righteousness. You appear oddly "underinformed" on your country's stats, although you seem to be an "expert" on US stats. So, how many blacks ARE there in the Netherlands? How many interracial marriages do you have in the Netherlands? What stats do you have for "mingling in canteens" of Americans versus the Dutch. What's the salary rate for the black man as opposed to the white man. I know what the salary rate for women is in the Netherlands, because the Dutch manager who hired me screwed me royally. I went to HR and they fortunately fixed it, because he had taken it upon himself to make up his own rules, which didn't conform to company rules. I was a woman, so didn't need as much salary as a man, obviously.

Your "eloquence" about European/Dutch racial/ethnic tolerance sounds wonderful. So back it up.

ball.

As no one noticed my last post:

Realist

LOL

what a hilarious thread!

imall,

i suggest you go to europe for your next vacation! if you come in june i can show you the highlights of austria

you really should not confuse bush / US gov. bashing with US citizen bashing! for some reason most europeans like americans!

"Oh Europe's So Racially Tolerant"

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