Dateline--Fahrenheit 911

by patio34 180 Replies latest social current

  • patio34
    patio34

    Hi Richie,

    You said:

    let me give you this article to read (and please read it all, not partly!), written by Christopher Hitchens, who is even a leftist liberal commentator, just in case you would bring this up and say that this article comes from "republican sources".

    Just for the record, Chris Hitchens is not really a "leftist liberal" since Iraq. Note the following:

    Chris Hitchens in the Wall Street Journal editorial page-- oh my!

    Chris Hitchens is one of my favorite personalities -- willing to take on the establishment, even cases that no one else would dare touch with a ten-foot barge pole (the Mother Theresa story). Hitchens has fallen out with many of his former collagues and friends on the Left post 9-11 and over the war with Iraq issue.

    In this article (subscription required) he says

    When viewed from any objective standpoint to its immediate Left, the American conservative movement manifests one distinct symptom of well-being. It is fairly conspicuously schismatic, and it possesses the confidence to rehearse its differences in public.

    Pat

  • dubla
    dubla

    rem said:

    I'm trying to figure out the logic behind this whole litigation reasoning... so the fact that NASA doesn't sue conspiracy theorists who claim that we never went to the moon means there must be something to it. (???)

    Maybe there is nothing worth suing over. Having a different interpretation of the same facts isn't something you can sue over. I'm sure it's pretty difficult to sue someone for taking your words out of context with creative editing

    i thought that deserved a repeat.....great points rem. for those that keep regurgitating this silly argument, id love to hear a reply to the above nasa analogy.

    simon-

    just curious, how can you so adamantly defend michael moores self-proclaimed "op-ed" pieces, and then turn around and lock a thread involving an entirely fact based study (from ucla/stanford no less) simply because you view the study as "propaganda"? this seems to be contradictory.?.

    aa

  • Richie
    Richie

    Tomorrow is the big nationwide debut of Michael Moore's new movie, "Fahrenheit 9/11". So, as a tribute to the most popular author and film maker on the left, I've decided to post some of Michael Moore's best quotes.

    Enjoy!

    "If someone did this [9/11] to get back at Bush, then they did so by killing thousands of people who DID NOT VOTE for him! Boston, New York, D.C., and the planes' destination of California -- these were places that voted AGAINST Bush!" -- Michael Moore On 9/12/2001

    "There is no terrorist threat in this country. This is a lie. This is the biggest lie we've been told." -- Michael Moore, October 2003

    "In terms of marketing (Fahrenheit 9/11), Front Row is getting a boost from organisations related to Hezbollah which have rung up from Lebanon to ask if there is anything they can do to support the film. And although Chacra says he and his company feel strongly that Fahrenheit is not anti-American, but anti-Bush, 'we can?t go against these organisations as they could strongly boycott the film in Lebanon and Syria.'"

    "I would like to apologize for referring to George W. Bush as a 'deserter.' What I meant to say is that George W. Bush is a deserter, an election thief, a drunk driver, a WMD liar, and a functional illiterate. And he poops his pants"

    "Unfortunately, Bush and Co. are not through yet. This invasion and conquest will encourage them to do it again elsewhere. The real purpose of this war was to say to the rest of the world, "Don't Mess with Texas - If You Got What We Want, We're Coming to Get It!"

    "(Americans) are possibly the dumbest people on the planet ... in thrall to conniving, thieving, smug pr*cks. We Americans suffer from an enforced ignorance. We don?t know about anything that?s happening outside our country. Our stupidity is embarrassing.?

    "DO YOU FEEL like you live in a nation of idiots? I used to console myself about the state of stupidity in this country by repeating this to myself: Even if there are two hundred million stone-cold idiots in this country, that leaves at least eighty million who will get what I'm saying..." -- P. 85 of "Stupid White Men"

    "(T)he dumbest Brit here is smarter than the smartest American". -- Michael Moore At London?s Roundhouse Theater

    "On his North American tour in support of Dude, Where?s My Country, Moore substituted Canadians for Britons, telling audiences that the ?dumbest Canadian? in attendance could surely outwit 'the smartest American.'" -- Moorewatch

    "There's a gullible side to the American people. They can be easily misled. Religion is the best device used to mislead them."

    "I like America to some extent." -- Michael Moore's response after being asked "You do not seem to like the U.S., do you?"

    "Moore wrote he'd once been "forced" to listen to my comments on a TV chat show, The McLaughlin Group. I had whined "on and on about the sorry state of American education," Moore said, and wound up by bellowing: "These kids don't even know what The Iliad and The Odyssey are!" Moore's interest was piqued, so the next day he said he called me. "Fred," he quoted himself as saying, "tell me what The Iliad and The Odyssey are." I started "hemming and hawing," Moore wrote. And then I said, according to Moore: "Well, they're . . . uh . . . you know . . . uh . . . okay, fine, you got me--I don't know what they're about. Happy now?" He'd smoked me out as a fraud, or maybe worse. The only problem is none of this is true. It never happened. Moore is a liar. He made it up. It's a fabrication on two levels. One, I've never met Moore or even talked to him on the phone. And, two, I read both The Iliad and The Odyssey in my first year at the University of Virginia. Just for the record, I'd learned what they were about even before college." -- Fred Barnes

    "White people scare the crap out of me. ? I have never been attacked by a black person, never been evicted by a black person, never had my security deposit ripped off by a black landlord, never had a black landlord ? never been pulled over by a black cop, never been sold a lemon by a black car salesman, never seen a black car salesman, never had a black person deny me a bank loan, never had a black person bury my movie, and I've never heard a black person say, 'We're going to eliminate ten thousand jobs here - have a nice day!'"

    "It was when Moore went into a rant about how the passengers on the planes on 11 September were scaredy-cats because they were mostly white. If the passengers had included black men, he claimed, those killers, with their puny bodies and unimpressive small knives, would have been crushed by the dudes, who as we all know take no disrespect from anybody." -- From an article by Yasmin Alibhai-Brown describing a Michael Moore show in London

    "Since September 11, the Bush Administration has used that tragic event as a justification to rip up our constitution and our civil liberties. And I honestly believe that [with] one or two September 11s martial law will be declared in our country and we're inching towards a police state."

    "The Patriot Act is the first step. "Mein Kampf" -- "Mein Kampf" was written long before Hitler came to power. And if the people of Germany had done something early on to stop these early signs, when the right-wing, when the extremists such as yourself (Bob Novak), decide that this is the way to go, if people don't speak up against this, you end up with something like they had in Germany. I don't want to get to that point."

    "The motivation for war is simple. The U.S. government started the war with Iraq in order to make it easy for U.S. corporations to do business in other countries. They intend to use cheap labor in those countries, which will make Americans rich."

    "I think (Bin Laden is under the protective watch of) the United States, I think our government knows where he is and I don't think we're going to be capturing him or killing him any time soon." -- Michael Moore in an interview with Bob Costas

  • exjdub
    exjdub
    "I would like to apologize for referring to George W. Bush as a 'deserter.' What I meant to say is that George W. Bush is a deserter, an election thief, a drunk driver, a WMD liar, and a functional illiterate. And he poops his pants"

    I resent the fact that Michael Moore is lying about Bush pooping his pants. At least I think that one isn't true...

    exjdub

  • exjdub
    exjdub

    Richie,

    The Michael Moore quotes brought a smile to my face and I enjoyed them immensely...but not for the reason that I think you intended. Thanks.

    exjdub

  • Crazy151drinker
    Crazy151drinker

    Im thinking Moore is gay and likes big black men.

    I found the bowling for Columbine cartoon extremely offensive.

  • exjdub
    exjdub
    "I think (Bin Laden is under the protective watch of) the United States, I think our government knows where he is and I don't think we're going to be capturing him or killing him any time soon."

    I disagree with Moore. I think there is a possibility that Bush may get Bin Laden just before the November election. If I am wrong I will change my mind and attribute it to the "light" getting brighter. Am I too cynical? Maybe.

    exjdub

  • exjdub
    exjdub

    Hey, quit hijacking the thread with your fantasies about Michael Moore Crazy151.

    LOL.

    exjdub

  • berten
    berten

    >...I found the bowling for Columbine cartoon extremely offensive.

    Why?

    Was it too close to the truth?

  • Richie
    Richie

    A little bit more news on Michael Moore - after that, I don't want to waste my time further thinking about this half-brained waste of space anymore.........

    Book: 'Michael Moore Is A Big Fat Stupid White Man'

    A just released book takes on Michael Moore as never before. Its title screams: ?Michael Moore Is A Big Fat Stupid White Man.?

    And surprisingly, this book has been published by the same publisher who gave us Michael Moore?s own runaway bestseller ?Stupid White Men.?

    Apparently, more than a few people want to take revenge on Michael Moore and the timing couldn?t be better ? with the release this week of his ?documentary? attack piece on George Bush - Fahrenheit 9/11.

    Moore is so terrified by his detractors he claims that he has already hired a cabal of lawyers. He says he will sue Bush supporters who he thinks may be preparing to slander him.

    Moore's hypocrisy is obvious. Slate editor Jack Shafer says ?Moore's hysterical, empty threats" to sue critics of his latest schlockumentary shows that he "appears to believe in free speech only for himself."

    One possible target for Moore?s lawyers may be the publisher of his own book.

    Moore?s one time publisher, ReganBooks, is out with a disturbing yet comical book that dismantles every cog of that propaganda machine marketed as Michael Moore.

    David T. Hardy and Jason Clarke's "Michael Moore Is A Big Fat Stupid White Man" begins by unearthing his phony roots and goes right up to his latest "documentary."

    Meet the Flint-drone: Everybody knows Moore is a blue-collar guy from Flint, Mich., right? That's how he always sells himself.

    In reality, he was born and raised in the wealthy, lily-white town of Davison, Mich, the authors reveal. No wonder the clown prince of self-loathing developed such a complex about hating rich, stupid white males.

    In a letter to Roger Ebert of the Chicago Sun-Times last year, Moore still listed his town as Flint. In fact, despite his proclamations that "capitalism is a sin" and "an evil system," he lives in a $1.9 million apartment in Manhattan and enjoys a $1.2 million summer home on Torch Lake in Michigan.

    Does not play well with others: Moore can't get along even with his fellow travelers.

    Hardy and Clarke disclose how the radical magazine Mother Jones fired the "arbitrary" and "suspicious" Moore; how he started his feud with his replacement, David Talbot, who later founded Salon; how Ralph Nader's organization fired Moore; how he attacked Pauline Kael, Harlan Jacobson and other prominent critics who exposed the deceits of his schlockumentaries; how he lost a lawsuit for betraying fellow lefty activist Larry Stecco in "Roger & Me," etc.

    Nor can the elitist Moore tolerate those lowly working classes and students he claims to represent.

    "Big Fat Stupid White Man" gives details of how he abused the staff during a speaking engagement at London's Roundhouse Theater; how he castigated a student who dared question his hefty speaking fee; how he attacked a young documentary maker who had the nerve to give him a taste of the "Roger & Me" treatment, and so forth.

    And don't forget his amusingly shrill denunciation of those awful blue-collar crewmen who, unlike his fellow multimillionaires in Hollywood?s left, booed him during his tirade at the Oscars.

    The book presents one example after another, alternating between frightening and hilarious, to make a brilliant case for Moore having Narcissistic Personality Disorder.

    Then there's his feud with his former publisher, HarperCollins subsidiary ReganBooks, which gave us his best seller ?Stupid White Men? and now brings us ?Michael Moore Is A Big Fat Stupid White Man.?

    ReganBooks, he claims, tried "to censor me and the things I wanted to say. They insisted I rewrite up to 50 percent of the book and that I remove sections that they found offensive to our leader, Mr. Bush." The company plotted "to 'pulp' and recycle all 50,000 copies of my book that were gathering dust in a warehouse," he insists.

    However, ReganBooks issued a statement to NewsMax.com contradicting these allegations:

    "Originally scheduled for release on September 11, 2001, the book was delayed by mutual agreement between author and publisher after the events of that day. Despite erroneous reports that have appeared in the press, the publisher never attempted to censor the book on partisan grounds, though the publisher and author did discuss replacing the original version of the book with an updated version to address the post-9/11 world. Ultimately, the decision was made to release the book in its original form, and it went on to become a huge success for both the publisher and the author. ReganBooks has since declined to exercise its option to publish another book by Mr. Moore."

    After all, Moore and other members of the left-wing thought police can't bear a commitment to diversity of ideas.

    Judith Regan, president and publisher of ReganBooks, noted that her company had produced books by Howard Stern and Moore as well as Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh.

    "As publishers, we have an obligation to publish a wide range of ideas, opinions, and perspectives," she said in a statement issued to NewsMax. "Our job is to publish voices on the left, on the right, and everywhere in between ? to provide a broad range of opinion.?

    "We agree with Michael Moore that free expression is one of our most important human rights," Regan said, "and publishing widely and freely is the only way to honor that tradition."

    Unfortunately, Moore fights his critics' right to free expression, as Slate's Shafer noted and as Hardy and Clarke document at length.

    Howlers in 'Columbine': Some of the distortions and falsehoods that plague the movie "Bowling for Columbine" are already well known, but Hardy and Clarke add details and reveal new whoppers.

  • Moore claims that National Rifle Association taunted the Denver area and the nation by holding "a large pro-gun rally" only days after the killings at Columbine High School.

    In reality, the annual meeting had been planned well in advance, was required by law, could not have been changed in time to another city, and was stripped of all rallies and ceremony in deference to the community.

  • The movie depicts Charlton Heston as making his famous "cold, dead hands speech" in Denver.

    In reality, the remarks came a year later in Charlotte, N.C., and Moore spliced bits of footage from that and another speech for maximum distortion. "It is a lie, a fraud, and a few other things," Hardy and Clarke write.

  • The fantasy film claims that Heston exploited a school shooting in Mount Morris, Mich., by staging another "big pro-gun rally" in October 2002.

    In reality, Heston?s appearance came eight months after the shooting, at a get-out-the-vote event in nearby Flint. Others campaigning in the area around that time included Al Gore, George W. Bush ? and Moore himself, touting Ralph Nader.

    The authors conclude: "Bowling for Columbine has less documentary value than the average Bugs Bunny cartoon. You see Heston giving a speech ? but it's doctored. You see history ? but unconnected facts are given a particular Moorewellian spin. You hear that a factory is making weapons of mass destruction ? actually, it's building satellite launch platforms. You're led to believe that a rally was a response to a shooting, but it turns out it was eight months later, in anticipation of an election. You watch a Bush-Quayle campaign ad, but in reality it was an ad Moore himself assembled."

    'Stupid' is as stupid does: Hardy and Clarke dissect "Stupid White Men" and "Dude, Where?s My Country?" along with the latter's celluloid ugly stepchild, Fahrenheit 9/11, to delve into the heart of Moore's pathology. A few highlights:

  • Moore harps on his portrayal of America as a "nation of idiots" (i.e., people who disagree with him) and illiterates.

    In reality, the "statistics" he offers indicating widespread illiteracy include two sizeable groups: immigrants who are often fluent in other languages but not English, and the blind and visually impaired.

  • Moore, who after all graduated from high school, delights in ridiculing his countrymen?s poor grasp of geography. "The dumbest Brit here is smarter than the smartest American," he snickers to an audience in London.

    But Moore chooses not to add an important fact: young adults worldwide performed badly on the National Geographic survey he so selectively cites.

  • He claims that Florida wrongly disenfranchised thousands of pro-Democrat criminals in the 2000 election. "Thirty-one percent of all black men in Florida" are felons, in his paranoid fantasy world. (No wonder this limousine liberal travels in such exclusive circles.)

    In reality, the Miami Herald showed that Democrat-run counties violated state law and let the overwhelmingly Democrat felons vote illegally ? more than 2,000 votes, most of which went to Gore.

  • Most importantly, "Michael Moore Is a Big Fat Stupid White Man" refutes Moore's wild attempts to implicate the president in 9/11. Every American should read these chapters. They are too detailed to summarize here, but one example will demonstrate this book's importance.

    Moore claims President Bush invaded Afghanistan and toppled the Taliban so he could get an oil pipeline built. You've probably heard others parrot this allegation. A master of propaganda knows that if you repeat a lie often enough, people start to believe it.

    In reality, Bush had supported Enron's plan to run pipes under the Caspian Sea and avoid Afghanistan. "Clinton was the one backing the rival Unocal plan to put them through Afghanistan," Hardy and Clarke observe.

    Inspiration to terrorists: Moore's favorite claim: ?THERE ? IS ? NO ? TERRORIST ? THREAT!" If so, why do terrorists take succor from him?

    The most damning indictment of Moore in "Big Fat Stupid White Man": the salute offered by Imam Samudra, leader of the Muslim terrorist bombers who murdered 202 people, mostly Australians and other tourists, two years ago at Paddy's nightclub in Bali.

    "I saw lots of whiteys dancing and lots of whiteys drinking there," Samudra told Indonesian police. The authors note, "It was 'Kill Whitey' (to quote a chapter heading in Stupid White Men) with a vengeance."

    Samudra's attorney Qaidar Faisal concluded his defense by praising the Taliban and quoting from "anti-western texts" including Moore's "Stupid White Men."

    Despite all the appalling revelations in "Michael Moore Is A Big Fat Stupid White Man," it's hard to finish the book without feeling pity for this man.

    Had he used his talents to make actual documentaries and write books devoid of distortion and mendacity, he could have offered a useful critique of the Bush administration's flaws.

    Instead, fueled by a narcissism that springs from hatred of self and others, he mangles reality to dupe the uninformed, delight the blame-America-first crowd and even inspire terrorists.

    He concentrates his venom on one politician and one party but damages a nation.

    "Michael Moore Is A Big Fat Stupid White Man" marks a confident step in undoing his damage.

    Editor's note:

  • More on Moore and Fahrenheit 9/11

    It's clear that Michael Moore has gone off the deep end when even Democrats compare him to the Nazis' master of propaganda:

    "Hollywood agent and Kerry supporter Tom Baer told me, 'Kerry should flee Moore's movie. It's Goebbels all over again." This quotation comes not from Ann Coulter or Sean Hannity or Rush Limbaugh but from a column in the Washington Post by Tina Brown, a queen of the liberal media establishment.

  • Christopher Hitchens, a contributor to such partisan publications as New Left Review and The Nation, writes for Slate: "Fahrenheit 9/11 is a sinister exercise in moral frivolity, crudely disguised as an exercise in seriousness. It is also a spectacle of abject political cowardice masking itself as a demonstration of 'dissenting' bravery."

  • Andrew Sullivan, a former editor at the liberal New Republic:
  • "Moore is beneath contempt".

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