Criticisms of Pastor Russell (page 2)

RR

This is recorded in various Bible Student histories and personal accounts of those who were there. It's also recorded in some of the very early literature of that time.

Here are some other intersting quotations.

October 31, 1916 - Death of C. T. Russell
"A.H. MacMillan intercepted the telegram at the Brooklyn Bethel home and wired J.F. Rutherford, then at a convention in Oakland, Md., "The old man is dead." Rutherford returns to Brooklyn and assumes control." (Herald of Christ's Kingdom Special History issue 2003)

November 6, 1916 -
"Brother MacMillan, the brother approached Brother Hoskins at the time of Brother Russell's funeral in Pittsburgh, November 6, and only a few feet removed from the dead body of our Pastor, Brother MacMillan said: "Brother Hoskins, I have something to say to you that I know will hurt you very much, and I haven't any idea that you have strength of character sufficient to follow my advice; but I am going to tell you, anyway. I think every one of you Directors except Brothers Rutherford and Van Amburgh ought to resign and give a chance for some decent men who know something to be put in your places. There is not one of you fit to manage anything, and you ought to resign; and if you don't resign you will, every one of you, get kicked out." - Light After Darkness 1917

November 7, 1916 - St. Paul Enterprise
"Brother Driscoll, with whom I was a traveler all the way, said: "By the way, I was made a committee to see you and tell you to get nothing in the Enterprise till after it comes out in the Tower." It fairly stunned me, for I knew that the paper was printing. I said: "You are surely deliberate in telling me about it and now the wheels are turning." "Can't you stop them?" he asked. "I don't see how it is practicable now," I said, and later and on due reflection I told Brother Pyles that I shall not permit a little clique of self-constituted dictators to run my affairs." William Abbott -- Editor St. Paul Enterprise on why he chose to publish the news about Russell's death in his paper, The St. Paul Enterprise (a weekly Bible Student publication of the time), before it was printed in the Watch Tower.

January 6, 1917
"Rutherford insists on incorporating and passing new bylaws. He did this without allowing them to be read first." (See remarks August 1917 Boston Convention)

Farkel

minimus,

: It seems that Rutherford surprised the Bible Students by the way he quickly took over. Obviously, he must not've been viewed as a threat to the BS.

Your lack of depth in understanding JW history is a constant amusement for me. Keep it up. I'm easily amused.

Your use of terms like "it seems" shows that you are still hooked to Watchtower idiocy, even though you claim you are out: You aren't still really OUT.

And your lack of knowledge in the actual history of what really happened when Rutherford "took over" is appalling. You've been too busy creating threads that bring all that attention to you, and too lax in taking the time to actually understand the history of the movement you just commented about.

That's ok with me. I don't care. But folks who do care and KNOW just scoff at your er, "deep" comments and observations. I suggest you stay with what you do best: nonsense.

I'm not picking on you and don't throw a tantrum on me. I just said it the way it is, and if you had rational bone in your body, you would have to agree with me.

Farkel

shotgun

RR

I don't see what you can gain by defending Russell, surely not anymore than what we gain by criticizing him.

Nothing really, we get a little satisfaction in blaming someone for getting the ball rolling which has adversely affected the lives of most forum members.

Do you believe he taught the truth, or would you agree all he did was start up a new religion of sorts?

From all the sources I've read I don't believe he had too many original ideas, he simply had the money and the drive to package and promote his ideas more than most.

Honestly, if you read Studies in the Scriptures you must agree that nearly all of his teachings were either erroneous or at times just plain silly.

Good man, bad man...does it really matter. His legacy is what he taught and the bulk of it is not something to be proud of.

If you want to submit something for research, submit his teachings and critically analyze them as you have the WTBTS.

Use the same method of research which freed you from WT beliefs.

VM44

RR,

There was a bioigraphy entitled "Charles Taze Russell, Early American Zionist." I have not seen a copy of it however.

You might also add to the list

* Strange medical cures/statements - grape cure, cancer cure, appendcitis due to biting worms, etc

Although I believe Russell was trying to help by printing these things. He was a good businessman, but did not know anything about medicine.

* Phrenology, that the shape of the bumps on one's head determines one's personality/abilities, etc.

* fascination with occult topics, such as pyramid prophecies, wing-sun globe symbols

* ready to believe crackpot ideas about astronomy, such as the Isaac Newton Vail Annular Ring theory for the source of the Flood waters. (again, show CTR had no basic education in many subjects, other than business and accounting perhaps) (Isaac Vail is another example of a man who fell in love with his own ideas.)

* Did not think it was necessary to know original Biblical languages such as Greek or Hebrew. Thought if you had enough translations of the Bible it was enough. (His lack of knowing even the complete Greek alphabet was demonstrated in a court of law once, after that CTR did not take the stand anymore as far as I know)

and there are probably a lot more that could be added to the list.

--VM44

RR

I don't see what you can gain by defending Russell, surely not anymore than what we gain by criticizing him.

This isn't about defending, this is simply to research.

Do you believe he taught the truth, or would you agree all he did was start up a new religion of sorts?

I believe he had the truth. Did he have ALL truth? no, but what he taught made sensen more sense than the current Watchtower teachings.

From all the sources I've read I don't believe he had too many original ideas, he simply had the money and the drive to package and promote his ideas more than most.

And he never claimed to. He stated he was simply a compiler.

Honestly, if you read Studies in the Scriptures you must agree that nearly all of his teachings were either erroneous or at times just plain silly.

I have read them, dozens of times. I don't think it's silly or erroneous.

If you want to submit something for research, submit his teachings and critically analyze them as you have the WTBTS.

That's what I'm trying to do.

Farkel

RR,

: I believe he had the truth. Did he have ALL truth? no, but what he taught made sensen more sense than the current Watchtower teachings.

So, your're saying that his lies made more sense the subequant lies made after his death?

"More truth than NO truth" = questionable "truth."

Fact is, and you have to face it: CTR was a false prophet with a ZERO track record of accuracy, just like those who took over his publishing company.

Do you believe his "Stone Monument" (i.e. pyramid) bullshit? I'm just curious here. I don't care, really. Unless you say "yes, I do." Then I will perk up and spring into action!

Farkel

RR

There was a bioigraphy entitled "Charles Taze Russell, Early American Zionist." I have not seen a copy of it however.

Yes, that book is out of print. It was published by David Horowitz, who passed away a few years ago. He was Jewish and the founder and editor of the United Israel Bulletin. I had some nice fellowship with him.

The book was originally a compilation of short articles that appared in the "UIB", and dealt mainly with the Zionist / Pro-Israel view of Russell and how the Society became anti-semetic in later years.

RR

minimus

Farkel, I do not pretend to have any special knowledge or understanding of the early history of the Bible Students or JWs. I read these items, esp. RR's with fascination. I appreciate all that is expressed on this board regarding the things Watchtower would never teach us or expose us to......It is a sad to see you trying to make this thread a personal attack on me, Farkel.

ozziepost

Off topic I know but I feel compelled to say that we have a long-standing policy of not allowing personal attacks.

Let's kick the ball, not the person!

kes152

Dearest RR,

Why do you worship this man?

Criticisms of Pastor Russell

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