The WTBTS's proactive steps at preventing child molestation.

by formerout 140 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

AlanF

BroBennett, assuming that you're sincere, I can at best characterize you as hopelessly naive. While it's true that the Watchtower Society has published a number of reasonably good articles about preventing child molestation, the fact that JW leaders do everything in their power to avoid responsibility for the abuses committed by various JWs, including certain Governing Body members, proves where their heart is -- and it's not with the children and certainly not with the loving, just God they claim to worship. The simple fact that they further abuse victims in court who bring justified lawsuits against the Society is absolute proof.
Here's a good example of where their heart really is: In 1984 Governing Body member Leo Greenlees was removed from the GB because he admitted molesting a ten-year-old boy. The parents complained to the Society about it. Greenlees then spent about five years as a special pioneer before his death around 1989. Did the GB report this pedophile to the proper authorities? No! Did they do anything to protect the JW community from him? No! Instead of disfellowshipping this pervert and reporting him to the police, they appointed him a special pioneer! Now, Greenlees was about 72 years old when he molested the boy. It should be obvious to you that he didn't just take up child molesting in his old age, but had been doing it for a long time. In particular, he was a molester when he was appointed to the Governing Body in 1971. This fact alone proves several things: (1) God has nothing to do with the appointment of GB members or any other elders; (2) The GB in 1984 knowingly set a long-time molester loose in the JW community. I can think of no worse example of gross hypocrisy.
By the way, if you don't believe what I've told you about Leo Greenlees, go ahead and call the Watchtower in Brooklyn and ask them about it. They won't deny it.
On to your latest foolish comments:
: I am sure that the Silent Lambs Crew are not looking for ways to prevent child abuse
You may be sure, but you sure are wrong. William Bowen is quite active in participating in SNAP (Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests; http://www.snapnetwork.org/) activities. Do you think that this organization is not interested in preventing child molestation? I'm personally extremely familiar with how vigorously Bowen is working at preventing child molestation for all children.
: and are only looking for JW cases of child abuse for propaganda.
Just like SNAP is only interested in beating up on the Catholic Church, right?
You're ridiculously naive.
Propaganda? What purpose do you think spreading "propaganda" would serve? Isn't it completely evident that the Silentlambs organization is doing exactly what it claims -- exposing the abuses of the Watchtower Society to force it to change and stop abusing abuse victims?
: When a crime happens, it should be made known to the authorities...
I agree. Then why are all elders not required to report molestation? Why does the Society only require them to report in U.S. states and various countries where clergy are required by law to report? Why did the Society not report Leo Greenlees to the New York police?
: The only reason the Witnesses might need more protection from what is bad is because they are taught to be babes to badness...
All the more reason for the Watchtower to own up to its self-proclaimed responsibilities and train elders how to properly handle child molestation. And equally important, to inform congregation members when a child molester is a member of the congregation. And also to drop the ridiculous and dangerous "two-witness rule" whose requirements are virtually impossible to fulfill and allow molesters to get away with their crimes and laugh at their victims.
: and that might be why more pedophiles look for JW children since it is a control issue.
Nonsense. By far the majority of abuse of JW children has been at the hands of others JWs -- usually JWs who were in positions of trust and/or authority -- like Leo Greenlees.
: But look! , I have contributed my time to show nine subjects found in the JW web site, and many issues from the Awake
Most people on this board are already quite familiar with that trashy literature, so you don't need to remind them. You were asked about other evidence -- which you've steadfastly failed to provide.
: to help the Silent Lambs Crew learn how to prevent child molestation...
LOL!
: but I doubt they will take the time to read it since it is from JW's.
On the contrary, the Silentlambs folks are thoroughly familiar with JW literature. That's why they do what they do to try to force the Society to do the right thing.
AlanF
pillsbury

One thing I was told a little while ago is not only are the elders to contact the Society first but they are also to contact the CO. The reason being is there are pre-selected brothers in every area that will serve on the investigation committee and judicial committee for molestation cases. This way they can cover themselves properly. I don't know if anyone else has heard this.
On the last CO visit he said to the car group why doesn't Bill Bowen (he just said that apostate) work on getting the laws changed to mandatory reporting instead of persecuting the Society. Unbelievable.
BroBennett

With regards to the outbreak of the [deleted] pedophile in the Governing Body being taken out, that is much better than most religions who accept such ones.
I am very proud of my religion and was told to post some info on proactive steps and I have done so, and we can all agree that the info that the Jehovah's Witnesses governing body has printed for years and years can be put to action in these last days of lawlessness.
Did you not read about the Dateline statements here? Why would an elder of all people not comply with the laws of the government? How many other religions disfellowship members and higher ups when there is proof?
In a written statement from the Jehovah's Witness headquarters, the church said it condemns child abuse and does not tolerate such actions.
It continued: ''If the elders learn of an accusation of child molestation, they do all that they reasonably can to protect the safety of the victim and other children, including complying with laws that mandate ministers to report to the proper authorities. This is even done when a child is the only one to allege the abuse.
''The victim and the victim's family also have the absolute right to report the matter to the authorities. Therefore, parents and others who are aware of the abuse are not hindered by the elders from reporting the situation to the authorities.''
This thred is about prevention and not about what should of been done since the best time to find evidence is when the crime accurs. I am sure I can bring a young adult or an adult to a tv show as well no matter what religion they attended.
Valis

we can all agree that the info that the Jehovah's Witnesses governing body has printed for years and years can be put to action in these last days of lawlessness.

thank you, but no! What a load of horse crap! Prevention requires action, not just a bunch of morons in New York pontificating on ways to cover their asses. Until Jehovah's WItnesses as an organization and as congregations acknowledge past wrongs involving child abuse and stop fighting victims in court they will never be anywhere near what one might call a "clean organization".
Sincerely,
District Overbeer
Swan

With regards to the outbreak of the gay pedophile in the Governing Body being taken out, that is much better than most religions who accept such ones.

But he wasn't taken out! Go back and read it again. He left Bethel and the Governing Body (no announcement of his departure was ever published in the Kingdom Ministry) under a shadow, but was a special pioneer in the New Orleans area. I'm sure he was happy, as there must have been a lot more young boys in his new congregation than there were in Bethel.
So all this crap about Jehovah's Witnesses removing the perpetrator from the congregation by disfellowshipping is just that... CRAP!
Maybe it was decided that to disfellowship Leo Greenlees for child molestation so soon after Ray Franz was disfellowshipped for eating a meal with his landlord wouldn't be seemly.
Tammy
OldSoul

This thred is about prevention and not about what should of been done since the best time to find evidence is when the crime accurs.

While an extremely poor example of proper english, this point is correct. What is the best way to prevent abuse? Never mind answering, it was a rhetorical question. I'll answer it. Your answer probably has to do with restricting potential victims.
The best way is to create an environment where the potential abuser is almost certain of exposure and prosecution. Abuse, especially sexual abuse, is about control - not sex. As long as having been abused is considered shameful and something to be quiet about, abusers will have plenty of easy targets. As long as abusers' acts - when reported to trusted counselors - go unpunished they will have more motivation to commit those acts again.
Prevention involves creating an environment in which the potential victim has more power than the potential abuser. Then the thrill from control is gone. You cannot shield children from badness and empower them to be angry - instead of ashamed - from suffering abuse.
AlanF

BroBennett said:
: With regards to the outbreak of the gay pedophile in the Governing Body being taken out, that is much better than most religions who accept such ones.
Do tell. Unfortunately, you haven't said anything about specific religions. All you've done is sort of imply that JWs are better than most in getting rid of pedophiles in positions of authority. But even the Catholic Church has removed such men when the parents of an abuse victim complained. So the JWs are really no better than the Catholic Church. Yet you claim they're much better -- but have yet to produce a single bit of evidence.
And as I said, this incident completely disproves the Fundamental Doctrine of Jehovah's Witnesses, namely, that God puts his word in the mouth of the Governing Body.
: I am very proud of my religion
Many Catholics are still proud of their religion, despite what the Church practiced for so many years. That doesn't say much for the integrity of such people.
: and was told to post some info on proactive steps and I have done so, and we can all agree that the info that the Jehovah's Witnesses governing body has printed for years and years can be put to action in these last days of lawlessness.
Yes, it can be put into practice. But it's exactly the same information most other churches and government agencies put out.
And you still haven't dealt with the demonstrable fact that what the Society advocates in literature meant for public consumption is not what it puts into practice behind closed doors.
: Did you not read about the Dateline statements here?
I'm quite familiar with Dateline.
: Why would an elder of all people not comply with the laws of the government?
You tell me. I know of lots cases of elders who didn't follow the law when the Society told them not to. You have only to read the real-life stories of abuse victims on the Silentlambs website to see this.
: How many other religions disfellowship members and higher ups when there is proof?
What "higher ups" do you know of who were disfellowshipped for child molestation? The only case I know of where a higher-up was accused was let off scot free.
:: In a written statement from the Jehovah's Witness headquarters, the church said it condemns child abuse and does not tolerate such actions.
Of course the Society claims that. But actions speak louder than words.
:: It continued: ''If the elders learn of an accusation of child molestation, they do all that they reasonably can to protect the safety of the victim and other children, including complying with laws that mandate ministers to report to the proper authorities. This is even done when a child is the only one to allege the abuse.
Wow. They comply with the law.
Sorry, but there are far too many cases on record where elders -- usually at the behest of someone anonymous Service Department guy -- failed to report abuse even when there was plenty of evidence. The Berry case in New Hampshire (which is still going through the courts; there's a current thread on that) is one proof.
It's true that in the last three or four years the Society has been much more careful to follow the law, but that's only because of the public outcry raised by Silentlambs and various TV documentaries like Dateline.
Tell me this: Why does the Society not proactively require elders to report cases of abuse to the authorities even in areas where there is a clergy exemption, and especially "when a child is the only one to allege the abuse"? Isn't this lapse proof that the Society is still mainly interested, not in preventing abuse and helping abuse victims, but in protecting its image?
:: ''The victim and the victim's family also have the absolute right to report the matter to the authorities. Therefore, parents and others who are aware of the abuse are not hindered by the elders from reporting the situation to the authorities.''
This is a new rule that was instituted at the Kingdom Ministry School for Elders three years ago. It was instituted because the Society knew that the Dateline program exposing its abuses was in preparation. Today the Society likes to give the impression that this rule has always existed, but until recently any JW who has had the misfortune of being molested has quickly learned that the overriding goal of most of the Society's representatives has been to protect the Society's image, which usually included lots of pressure to avoid reporting criminals to the authorities.
: This thred is about prevention and not about what should of been done
A history of failing to properly deal with abuse is an excellent predictor of the future. And we continue hearing stories of the Society failing to properly deal -- even within its own rules -- with abusers. The fact that the Society even today vigorously claims no wrongdoing in court cases proves my point. So does the fact that they still demand either two eyewitnesses to abuse, or a confession, to convict a molester and make sure that other children in the congregation are protected. These things together ensure that most abuse cases will go unreported, leaving the abuser free to continue, and most importantly, protecting the Society's image.
: since the best time to find evidence is when the crime accurs.
What does that have to do with anything?
: I am sure I can bring a young adult or an adult to a tv show as well no matter what religion they attended.
What's that supposed to mean? Can you try to be coherent?
AlanF
Big Tex

I am becoming more and more convinced this is not a real person.
Either the joke or parody is poor. Either way BroBennett has a great big bag of nothing.
BroBennett

Great big bag of nothing huh?
For now it will be in the "Child Abuse" area of the forum. I hope you can convince me that it should be changed to "Friends" or "Family" section. I really, really do hope you can convince me that a change is deserved.
Where else would it belong? Would it belong in that big bag of nothing... or would all in the family be able to know how to prevent child molestation..
Valis

Great big bag of nothing huh?

yes..

The WTBTS's proactive steps at preventing child molestation.

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