So would run, run away really fast be to easy an answer?
Welcome to the forum.
is there any concrete proof the JWs are wrong? Iam new here.
by Buck 49 Replies latest jw friends
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bem
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gumby
Some Governing Body members are not annointed.
As Poztate mentioned....you might want to re-check yourself.
We're talking the GB....not the President.
Gumby
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Buck
its funny most people here tell me to run. Ive heard that before.
There is no way to make this easier, I guess.
I do thank everyone that posted to my topic. I wish walking away was easy, but as most of you know, its not. I will keep posting on this board and reading topics listed. I will never stop questioning and learning. I do know that the people that truly believe in the organization, believe in it whole heartedly. These are good people and if thats what they choose, its fine with me. I just dont know what my choice is. And I dont want the choice made for me.
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bem
Buck,
Honestly I can remember this conversation I had with my now x husband..... We had walked to the bus stop to meet our children and as always I was trying to convince him that the ladies I had been having a bible study with on and off for the last three years HAD THE TRUTH tm. I remember telling him "as sure as I'm standing here talking to you this is the truth"! {{ I believed that wholeheartedly}}Boy was I ever wrong. I faded out, My oldest son is DF. My daughter is bitter cause we each believed no doubt we were doing the only true thing that could save our lives. We never missed a meeting. The kids did not date solo.We went out in service, pioneered and aux'pion, many times. we were very good and sincere jws.{{ we lived it wholeheartledly}}
We were there in servus many times to see ones talk about others in the car group when they got out to go to the door. I seen my son treated badly and counciled for the same things others got away with. Confidentialities were not kept.An Elder lied had an affair and the wife that was wronged was told not to cause problems.The divorce was granted and the wronged Sis sat in the same KH as the newly married couple. While they worked at getting re-instated. and she was told not to cause problems. You will hear there is love there. do not kid yourself that love comes with conditions. For instance my hard working married son. Is shunned by the congo ( and for a while by his Dad) he is a good person. caring, gentle man. he is un-fit to talk to. But they can see it is no problem going to prisons to study with persons of all sorts of crimes be told they can live forever.Any man can sexually abuse a child in the org. and we are told to keep it hush hush, not to bring re-proach on jaws name. ... the love shown by the actions of the people in the org. Speaking/teaching one way and acting another in my opinion would be considered wrong. Feeling superior to fellow man, kinda see that as wrong. Cause they are ordered from the scriptures to love there fellow man, Yet give the talk of being around to clean them up like they were manure on the ground. post -armageddon. Hints of wrong imo.
But your right you'll have to decide for your self what to believe.
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Gerard
I just dont know what my choice is. And I dont want the choice made for me.
That is your answer! With the Watchtower in your home, all choices AND THINKING are already made for you. Literally, you have no room for independent thinking.
Watchtower 1983 January 15 p.22 Exposing the Devil's Subtle Designs ***
Avoid Independent Thinking
20 From the very outset of his rebellion Satan called into question God's way of doing things. He promoted independent thinking. 'You can decide for yourself what is good and bad,' Satan told Eve. 'You don't have to listen to God. He is not really telling you the truth.' (Genesis 3:1-5) To this day, it has been Satan's subtle design to infect God's people with this type of thinking.-2 Timothy 3:1, 13.
21 How is such independent thinking manifested? A common way is by questioning the counsel that is provided by God's visible organization [a.k.a. WTBTS of NY, Inc]
Get this straight: she is in a cult. Using the Bible does not make the Watchtower "loving". Unless you join her in you will become her enemy, an unbeliever, a Satan's spawn.
Running while you have a chance does not seem so bad now. Eh?
Gerry
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Bubbamar
I do know that the people that truly believe in the organization, believe in it whole heartedly. These are good people and if thats what they choose, its fine with me. I just dont know what my choice is.
But Buck - they didn't CHOOSE it. That's like saying a drug addict choose to be a drug addict. They thought getting high looked good - so they tried it and before you know it they are stealing their mama's TV set to get more.
When people begin studying with JW's they are NOT fully informed about what they are getting into. It is a very subtle process. When they knock on your door they WILL NOT tell you about shunning, failed prophecies, blood doctrine, alterations to their "bible," hatred and demonization of other religions. Even if you ask - they will not tell you whole truth because then, who the heck would sign up?
In the past, people believed wholeheartedly that the world was flat. So belief doesn't mean much does it. It's not fine by me that 6 million people are misled - DELIBERATELY by an organization and called upon to sacrifice their life, freedom, children and family. They are told to avoid information about the JW's other than what the JW's appprove of. Why would they do that? What are they afraid of?
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Mulan
Are you sure about this.The last time I checked all GB members were"annointed"
You might be right. I was thinking of the newest members who are in my age group, so would unlikely be annointed, but anything can happen if they want it bad enough. One of the news ones used to be an elder in our area, Guy Pierce. Maybe he claims to be annointed now though.
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BrendaCloutier
The WTS has no interest in "serving God" as they claim, but is desgned totally to promote their literature, and make converts who will do the same.
The ultimate pyramid scheme. But the only ones to get rich are those at the "top".
I just had to do a smart assed quip, couldn't let that one go!BTW, Welcome Buck. I hope you find here what you need, and I commend you for seeking the truth behind the Truth (tm).
I think you will find that no matter how much you and your gal love each other, her love will be conditional on your accepting and becoming a JW. If you chose not to convert and get baptized, if she's a "good" JW woman, she will likely not continue the relationship.
If you do continue your relationship and you do marry (without you becoming a JW) she will be looked down upon and pittied, maybe even unofficially shunned because she married a "worldly person". She will be considered weak no matter how strong her beliefs and her actions in the ministry.
Good luck and blessings
Brenda
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Mulan
Listen to that little voice, that is nagging at you. And listen to all of us. Either you will become one of them or the relationship will end. No other possibility.
Her family absolutely will NOT accept you if you don't join them. For now, it's early and they are thinking you will probably convert.
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Gerard
More facts for your informed decision:
Facts Jehovah?s Witnesses WON?T TELL YOU WhenCalling at your door .
http://www.ankerberg.com/Articles/_PDFArchives/apologetics/AP3W0699.pdf
By Lorri MacGregorThe Watchtower Bible & Tract Society headquartered in Brooklyn, New York, USA, was founded over 100 years ago by Charles Taze Russell, who had no theological training, but adopted the title, ?Pastor?. His ideas were strange right from the beginning.
1. Early Watchtower magazines (3/15/13 & 1/15/12) reveal that he believed a person?s desire to worship God was due to the shape of their brain. He believed that if a dog?s head were shaped like a man?s, the dog would think like a man!
2. He offered health advice too, believing appendicitis and typhoid fever were caused by ?biting worms in the colon?.
3. He sold ?miracle wheat? at greatly inflated prices. Despite all this, his followers then (and now) believed that he was God?s ?faithful and discreet slave? referred to in Matthew 24:45.
After his death, his legacy, the Watch Tower organization became this sole channel for God in the eyes of its followers.
JEHOVAH?S WITNESSES BELIEVE & TEACH4. THAT Jesus Christ (who is Michael the Archangel in their doctrine) is mediator for only a small, elite, group within their ranks called the ?anointed remnant?. Others must come to this group who control the organization and earn their salvation by absolute obedience to it.
5. THAT all religions except their?s are of Satan, and your Pastor or Priest is under the Devil?s control.
6. THAT the Watchtower Society is the only source of truth on earth today, and all churches teach error and will be destroyed at Armageddon.
7. THAT the cross is a pagan symbol of sex worship, and that all buildings or persons displaying the cross are likewise pagan. Jehovah?s Witnesses deny that Jesus died on the cross. However, ?new light? in the Watchtower Magazine has admitted they are not certain about the cross, but will continue to deny it anyway.
8. THAT no one goes to heaven but 144,000 Jehovah?s Witnesses, and your soul will be destroyed if you refuse to join their organization.
9. THAT the Christ child was only an ?IT?, not a ?HE?. See the New World Translation , Luke 2:16,17.
10. THAT Jesus was not the Christ (or Messiah) until age 30, even though their own bible says in Luke 2:11, ?because there was born to you today a Savior, who is Christ the Lord.?
11. THAT after Jesus was buried in the tomb, Jehovah dissolved his body into gasses and it disappeared forever.
12. THAT Jesus rose invisibly in three days, so Jehovah had to ?materialize? a fake body for him complete with fake nail prints so His disciples would believe it was really Jesus risen.
13. THAT Armageddon and Christ?s second coming were foretold to happen in 1874, 1914, 1925 and 1975 by this ?non-prophet? organization.
14. THAT when Christ failed to show up in 1914 The Society claimed in later years that He had come?invisibly?of course, and all Jehovah?s Witnesses believe this today.
15. THAT Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob etc., were to be back on earth as perfect humans in 1925. The Society built a palatial home for them BUT, when the patriarchs failed to show up, the President of the Society moved in.
16. THAT their light gets ?brighter and brighter?, allowing for the many changes and ?about faces? on their doctrines. Yesterday?s error is today?s ?truth?. Often the ?light? bounces back and forth from old to new views and back again! Does real light return to darkness?
17. THAT the Watchtower Society and its followers are all prophets of God today and the Governing Body is directed by angels from God.
18. THAT salvation for Society members consists of doing the good works of placing Watchtower books and magazines and winning converts.
19. THAT soon Jehovah God will become a GRANDFATHER and Jesus will be promoted to ?EVERLASTING FATHER?!
20. THAT Jehovah God is not omnipresent, but still Almighty. Think! How can this be?
They have NOT BEEN TOLD ?By the leadership of the Society21. THAT when they translated their New World Translation of the Bible they deliberately altered almost every scripture on the Deity of Christ, to make him only a creature.
22. THAT the Society used a translation by a SPIRIT MEDIUM, Johannes Greber, to support their rendering of John 1:1 with full knowledge that his sources were DEMONIC. Greber was exposed in the Feb. 15/56 W.T. However in 1961 they released a translation based on his occult one then denied they knew what they were doing on page 31 of the Apr. 1, 1983 Watchtower!
23. THAT none of their ?translating committee? knew Biblical Greek or Hebrew. No scholars at all.
24. THAT Fred Franz, who for many years headed the Society, perjured himself under oath in Scotland in a court trial, by saying he could read Hebrew, and then failing a simple Hebrew test.
25. THAT the following encyclopedias consider the name ?JEHOVAH? to be FALSE Merits Student Enc.; Encyclopedia Americana; The Jewish Encyclopedia; Encyclopedia International, The Interpreters Dictionary of the Bible; The New Catholic Encyclopedia; The Universal Jewish Encyclopedia, etc.
26. Jehovah?s Witness?s own ?Aid? book admits on pages 884 & 885 that ?Jehovah? was first recorded by a Catholic monk about 700 years ago!
27. THAT the date 1874 was taught for Christ?s invisible presence by the Society until l929. (See their book, ?Prophecy?, p. 65. sold until 1941. Also WT. Jan 1, 1924, p. 5.)
28. THAT top executives of the Society have admitted under oath that they forced their members to accept false prophecies or face disfellowshipping and be found worthy of death.
29. THAT true salvation is FREE (Ephesians 2: 8 & 9), and consists of receiving Christ as your Savior. (John 1:12 , John 6: 28, 29).
Summary30. We find the Watchtower Society practicing their belief that it is proper to deceive people. But they say this really isn?t lying. Why? Because the Society has a different definition of lying than most of us. In their book ?AID TO BIBLE UNDERSTANDING? under the word ?LIE?
we read:
Lying generally involves saying something false to a person who is ENTITLED to know the truth?.While malicious lying is definitely condemned in the Bible, this does not mean that a person is under obligation to divulge truthful information to people who are not entitled to it.Of course it is the Watchtower leaders that decide WHO deserves to know the truth.
DO YOU DESERVE TO KNOW THE TRUTH?Write to us for further help or documentation on this information.
Mrs. Lorri MacGregor
MacGregor Ministries
Box 294
Nelson B.C. V1L 5P9
Canada
phone: (205) 352-9327
website:
e-mail: [email protected]