No Atheists in a Foxhole

by hippikon 34 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  bigboi

  Rem:

  You said:

  Heck, both Jews and Christians disbelieve in the actual existence of Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny - does that mean they share the same belief system?

  No, I never said that all atheists share the same beliefs in thier belief systems. I said that atheism is a belief system. All religions are party to different interpretations of their beliefs. Athiesm is no different.

  Take Christianty for example. Mst Christians believe that the God of the bible is the only true God and he sent his Son to die for the sins of mankind. That is in essence the tenet of Christianity. In Islam they believe that Allah is God and Mohammed is his prophet. That's thier basic belief. Yet, in both these religions you find different groups who believe in different interpretations of these basic tenets and their accompanying bylaws. The atheism you describe seems to me to be quite similar.

  ONE....

  bigboi

  "it ain't what ya do. it's how you do it" quote from the song "True Honeybunz" by Bahamadia
• 

  rem

  Intro,

  In my opinion disbelief in god due to emotional reasons such as the foxhole scenario is not desirable. In reality, I think there may be many apathetic people who come to that conclusion based on such subjective reasoning. I think that many do, however, come to the conclusion that disbelief in god is preferable due to the lack of evidence for the (in my viewpoint) extraordinary claim of his existence. There are also logical arguments against certain types of gods (such as omnibenevolent or omnipotent gods) that may be the impetus for certain ones to reason in favor of disbelief in at least those gods and hold out judgement for other types. In the mean time they may reason that since there is no evidence for other types of gods, there is no real reason to believe.

  I personally don't believe because I don't see evidence - especially in the god of the bible. I know I can not know for sure because there may be evidence in the future, but for now I suspend belief until evidence for god's existence becomes available (which may be never). I guess that makes me a type of Agnostic Atheist.

  Bigboi,

  Did you know it is possible to be both a Jew and an Atheist at the same time? Calling atheism a belief system in relation to other religions is a stretch by any means. It's not even a philosophy - it's only a disbelief in something. There are no atheist meetings or ceremonies. All one has to do to be an atheist is disbelieve in god - that's all.

  I think it would be a stretch to say that disbelief in Santa Claus (or god) constitutes a belief SYSTEM. Like I've already demonstrated, people from diverse belief SYSTEMs can share a disbelief in something. I would venture to define a belief system as being more than a belief or disbelief in a single thing. Does belief in the existence of Jesus make one a Christian? Does belief in the existence of Jehovah automatically make one a Jehovah's Witness? Does disbelief in Satan make one a Buddhist? Is disbelief in Satan a belief system?

  I'm not trying to pick on you. I'm just trying to explore this a little more. I admit that I've never given it much thought before. :)

  rem

  "Most people would rather die than think; in fact, they do so."
  ..........Bertrand Russell
• 

  bigboi

  Rem:

  I think I now see your point. Atheism to you is simply a common belief that some folks share. I got cha now.

  I think it's belief systemn because of the way I hear it defended sometimes around here. Also in some programs I hear atheists talk bout Nature in almost glowing terms, like it was their God or somethin. I really see no difference between atheists and religious beliefs. I think it's the same shit, different theory.

  ONE....

  bigboi

  "it ain't what ya do. it's how you do it" quote from the song "True Honeybunz" by Bahamadia
• 

  Seeker

  Bigboi, atheism is not a belief. It is a lack of belief. Period.
• 

  larc

  bigboi,

  Let me try this on you. Atheists don't have meeting where they have to encourage each others to maintain their beliefs in fear that one of them might become religious. The only thing they have in common is one particular belief. Hence they do not share a belief "system". Some might hold science in great awe, because the natural world is an awsome place. Others may have little interest in science.
• 

  Hojon

  I think it's belief systemn because of the way I hear it defended sometimes around here. Also in some programs I hear atheists talk bout Nature in almost glowing terms, like it was their God or somethin. I really see no difference between atheists and religious beliefs. I think it's the same shit, different theory.

  The big difference here is that speaking of Nature like that is based on evidence seen in the world around us. Many athiests I know are athiests in part due to the fact that there is no evidence of god. They base their beliefs on scientific facts that can be proven, not on a religious book that requires faith. That's not a put down, it's just a totally different path.

  Faith and science are diametrically opposed, one is belief in only what we can see and the other is belief in something specifically because we can't see it.
• 

  bigboi

  Ha So, Ha So. I see, I see.

  I stii think it's a belief system even though only one belief ties atheists together. All atheists might not meet together but some do. Whether they be scientific atheists, natural atheists or whatever. I think the belief that there is no God is the basis for this belief system. All Christians don't meet together, alot of ppl who don't go to church consider theselves christian. Neither are all ppl who go to church afraid of becoming athiests, that's an absurd insinuation.

  Faith and science are diametrically opposed, one is belief in only what we can see and the other is belief in something specifically because we can't see it.

  I like this statement. Evolution is considered science yet no one to my knowledge anyway, has ever observed the theory of evolution. No one has observed creatures changing into different forms. Fossils are highly subjective. Yet some ppl still hold to that belief that life evolves on this planet. Why, because they choose to cling ridgidly to their belief system. Despite knowing nothing for certain.

  ONE...

  bigboi

  "it ain't what ya do. it's how you do it" quote from the song "True Honeybunz" by Bahamadia
• 

  larc

  bigboi,

  Now, that is just plain silly. You have not seen special creation from God either, but you chose to believe it. Perhaps, God used the slow simple process of evolution as the way to create. Have you ever considered that?

  Within our life time, we have seen changes within species as they have adapted to their environment.

  That was the 6 o'clock report, the rest of the news at eleven.
• 

  bigboi

  Larc,

  Exactly, you just proved my point. So why is my belief different from yours?

  Adaptation imo is not equal to evolutionary change.

  ONE....

  bigboi

  "it ain't what ya do. it's how you do it" quote from the song "True Honeybunz" by Bahamadia
• 

  Norm

  Hey you guy's,

  Everybody on this board is atheists. Most people on earth are atheists. Take our fundy Rex, or our esteemed Christian Ros for example, both staunch atheists. They don't believe in Shiva, Thor, Poseidon etc.

  They have no faith in 99,99% of the Gods, they beleive in only 1 God.
  There are some atheists that excludes that last one too, but all of us are atheists.

  If those who believe in the last one could think some more about why they are dismissing all the other gods, they would of course realize that there is just as little reason to believe in the last one. But that is a thought they choose not to think.

  Here endeth the lesson

  Norm