Remember the lawyers credo, never ask a question you don't know the answer to. Make sure whatever you decide to ask them you already know what the answer is and then you can listen to them try to twist the facts etc. And when I say "know the answer" as some of the questions maybe not be ultimately "knowable" what I mean is you've done the reasearch and have an answer that you are satisfied with, one that you are convinced is correct. So if you choose 607 as a question make sure you do the research and know the arguments that have convinced you that it is not the right date. Or say shunning, get the eyewitness accounts (which are easily obtainable here and at other sites) to where you are in no doubt the practice actually takes place and then listen very carefully to their answers, whether they flatly deny it or whether they try to weasel around the actual question which as was mentioned above, circular reasoning. Bottom line, be prepared!
I have decided to sit down and talk with a JW any advice?
by MM090503 22 Replies latest jw experiences
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Crumpet
vittvin try here
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cheeseman
Ask why the dinosaurs were created. Point out that a tyrannosaurus rex was made for one thing...killing. Carnivores, ripping each others heads off with gigantic pointy teeth and claws. Product of a loving creator?
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jula71
And I think most importantly ask about the PROVEN UN involvment and the financial interests in Phillip Morris.
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Honesty
Ask the JW if the religion follows Jesus' command to baptise in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. When the JW says yes, ask to see the 2 questions asked at the assembly of all baptismal candidates. If the JW stutters just tell him/her they can find the answers in the new "Organised to do Jehovah's Will" that was released to all U.S. congregations this past Sunday, March 20, 2005.
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what_Truth?
Keep in mind that even though you technically can't be shunned for being an unbaptized apostate (at least there's no official rule against it) Jehovah's Witnesses generally consider apostasy the worst sin a person commit. I've been shunned by JW's for questioning their faith in too great of detail even though I was never baptized.
I've always found that the best way to ask a question to these kind of nutjobs is to pretend like you already agree with them and are looking for a clarified opinion. For instance, instead of asking them about the UN for instance i'd say something like. "Yunno, these government sure are corrupt. I don't even vote anymore because most of these leaders couldn't lead cub scouts to Denny's let alone run a country." look for that little glimmer of hope in the JW's eyes as they grab for the nearest book or bible scripture. Nodd your head s/he sputs his crap, but don't let him change the subject. After he's done rambling say "BTW I have this crazy friend that says the JW's where part of the UN. I know it's not true but what would I say to someone like that?" -
vitty
Thanks for the link Crumpet, I wanted that quote to give my sister.
I didnt realize it was in that book, I do know its also in a WT cos I read it myself a few months ago. I think that was in `86 too
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Check_Your_Premises
Is your bf a jw? What is his relationship with the org? It is an important question because it will dictate how you proceed, and what your ultimate goal is.
Playing gotcha with a jw is probably not going to bear much fruit other than making you "the bad guy".
I would recommend Steven Hassan's book, Releasing the Bonds, as a good "how to" for getting a loved one out of a cult.
Resist the urge to get in a "knockout". It won't happen unless he already has serious doubts. If he has "drank the koolaid"
Your basic steps are
1. Build trust and rapport with cult member and their cult identity
2. Gather info about cult, mind control, why they joined, other cults as well
3. Plant seeds of doubt, encourage free thinking, reduce effects of instilled phobias he has about leaving org, all by asking well thought out questions.
4. Involve family and friends who will do the same.
5. Educate him about other cults and how they use mind control. He won't listen if you talk about how jw's use mind control
6. If he still won't leave, maybe plan an intervention.
Or find some other guy who isn't going to cause you so much grief. There are plenty of happy, balanced, decent guys who aren't members of cults. Why waste your time on a fixer-upper? And whatever you do don't get pregnant! You will be an unbelieving mate, with no respect because you are a woman. Your kids will be raised jw whether you like it or not.
You will know them by the fruit they bear. Indeed.
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Buster
The important point here is not that you take on a JW with such blazing logic that you stump the poor cult-controlled fool.
Rather, the goal is show a good-faith attempt to your boyfriend. So, I would focus on making the JW support a couple key JW tenets. Then, sit back and look for flaws in their reasoning. Specifically, like Dragonlady said, look for circular logic. Also, look for the strawman. Better yet, sit with your bf first and explain to him what you will be looking for so he will see it when you do.
I would try to keep the conversation on one or two topics.
1. I would definitely make the JW take this one: Prove that the WTBTS was chosen by God, in 1918, as his only channel of control and communication.
2. I would make them defend false prophecies and deny they are a false prophet: They will say they are not, and never have claimed to be prophets. Be ready with quotes from the Watchtower. They are easy to get from the Quotes site.
Above all, do not let the JW control the topic. If they had such great truths, they would be able to defend them. the hard part will be to keep them on topic.
Good luck and let us know how it works out.
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Buster
Now that I think of it, this topic should trump all the others: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/7/87443/1.ashx
Go to that topic. Read how the JWs think their God will treat unbelivers' 6-month-old babies. Don't let him give you any BS about how 'only Jehovah can see into their hearts' or that they can't be sure what will happen. They believe that their God will wipe out the innocent of the innocent.
Watch 'em squirm. Watch 'em lie.
Then you can find out what your bf is made of by gauging his reactions too.