C.S. Lewis statement.... (page 5)

Shining One

Well Hamsterbait,
If really you can't accept hearing from God then you have made the decision not to. No amount of any evidence will ever be convincing to you. This is your choice...for now. Our Lord Himself answers the question of belief/unbelief in John 3.17-21. The Apostle Paul shows you both sides in Romans 1.16-25.
Too bad.
R.

LittleToe

SO:Is that all you've got, by way of contest to HB's interpretation of Romans 2?

Come on, surely you can do better than that?

Shining One

Here is what I posted:
C.S. Lewis says Jesus' claim to be equal with deity leaves us only one other choice:

A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic — on a level with the man who says he is a poached egg — or else he would be the Devil of Hell. You must make your choice. Either this man was, and is, the Son of God: or else a madman or something worse. You can shut Him up for a fool, you can spit at Him and kill Him as a demon; or you can fall at His feet and call Him Lord and God. But let us not come with any patronising nonsense about His being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. He did not intend to.**from Mere Christianity

Point one: Jesus claimed to be God (son of God is of the same essence of God).
Point two: If he is not God then he is crazy or evil.
Pont three: Clearly you can't 'straddle the line' because of point one!
Point four: Sheeeesh!

Now parts of Leolaia's post:
*****You know, I love C. S. Lewis. He's a genius. No, not just a genius...he's a god!! In fact, I find his words so inspiring and heart-searching that I cannot believe he is anyone other than God himself. And I'm not the only one. In fact, I have a whole bunch of friends who think the same thing too. Some of them in their younger days even knew his former students (who have since died in the decades since).*****

Scripture says:
"After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers at the same time, most of whom are still living, though some have fallen asleep." How could Paul make that claim if it were not true? He is appealing to eyewitness testimony and your sarcastic analogy shows how foolish you are.

Leo again:*****"In fact, our faith is so strong in the deity of C. S. Lewis that we'd die for our faith."***

Eyewitnesses who lived and died FOR the belief in Jesus, they saw Him alive after He had risen,
ACCORDING TO SCRIPTURE, which means BY PROPHECY. Any reasonable person can see that people who are involved in a conspiracy do not die for a lie. Witness the analogy given by Chuck Colson in his book, "Born Again". I'll let you read it. If you are so intelligent you will be able to figure this one out.

******I know our faith is true because of the way I feel his presence when I worship him. Now, one of my friends, this very spiritual dude named John, wrote a very inspiring biography about C. S. Lewis which explains not only how he touches our lives, but also where he came from and how he has given his loving gift of salvation (Oh may C. S. Lewis be praised!!).*****

No need to repeat any more of the details that Leolaia spews on and on........

Here is what 1 Cor. 15 says:
Now, brothers, I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received and on which you have taken your stand. By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain.
For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance : that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,
that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures,
and that he appeared to Peter, and then to the Twelve.
After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers at the same time, most of whom are still living, though some have fallen asleep.
Then he appeared to James, then to all the apostles, and last of all he appeared to me also, as to one abnormally born.
For I am the least of the apostles and do not even deserve to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God.

Those are 'lines of evidence' started in a clear and concise manner. The evidence is backed up by people who witnessed and could testify to the veracity of Paul's claims. All of the NT was written before the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 CE with the exception of John's gospel, letters and Revelation. The dating is in dispute in many circles since you have no reference to the destruction of Jerusalem. Liberals date the books later of course, to give the idea that enough time had elapsed in order to concoct myths. Natualists will always date them later due in part to their presupposition that 'no real prophecy or supernatural can occur'.

Her post is so convoluted that I am not even sure wheter she was trying to bring in Watchtower ideas or scripture or both! People can twist scripture out of context to make 'straw man' arguments. They are either deliberate or foolish in their efforts along these lines of misinterpretation. There is no need to answer such disingenuous arguments. Here they are used to bring oneself acclaim from the rest of the clique that dominates this board. Not much has changed in ex-Watchtowerland!
Rex

Shining One

It's not Romans 2, Little Toe. R.

AlanF

LittleToe said to Shining One:

: Come on, surely you can do better than that?

I'm afraid he can't. He's been using the same tactics ever since he got Fundy religion 4-5 years ago. It's a pity what accepting such nonsense does to a person.

AlanF

heathen

shiningone----

BTW, why does everyone here accept the existence of these other figures but many do not accept the existence of Christ Jesus?

I don't know where you got that idea . Despite my screen name I believe jesus was real and the rest not real . I just couldn't get why so many people would write so many things about a person such as jesus and it not be real . I'm not keen on religion because of the hypocrisy involved .......... I think CS lewis was a great fantasy writer but really couldn't give a crap about his opinions on religion .I have read mere christianity a very long time ago and never felt like reading it again .

hmike

Actually, Romans 2:12-16 shows that even those who don't know the name of Jesus can be saved by God

The crucial thing is that they follow their conscience as they truly see it to be. This is a fundamental teaching of the RC.

Certainly, in places that haven't been exposed to the Bible, there is an idea of right and wrong. The assumption seems to be that if people do what is right according to their conscience, that will be good enough in God's eyes. Even if someone had a concept of right and wrong that matched God's, would they always do the right thing?

Paul went out on his missionary work to Gentile cultures teaching that Jesus was the only way of salvation because nobody could meet the requirements of the Mosaic Law or their own conscience. If any culture had a vaild way to God, why bring in Jesus?

LittleToe

SO:As you can see from Hmike's quote, HB refered to Romans 2...

Hmike:Good point about audience.

Lewis' arguments wouldn't stand up to modern day skeptics, but then he wasn't addressing them...

hamsterbait

I am quite happy to hear from a being called God.

Since he has never been posting on this board, we have only the poorly argued contradictions of various posters, who do not always agree on major doctrines, never mind details so dear to the heart of the self righteous.

As for Romans 2 : The scripture quite clearly states that these people of the nations are accused or excused, by God in the judgement.

This is not my interpretation, but is quite clearly stated in the Catechism of the Roman Catholic Church. I don't see how Shining One can argue successfully with what the vicar of Christ on earth has endorsed for instruction of the faithful.

HB

hamsterbait

As for St Paul preaching to the Gentiles Hmike: Romans 11 says in part -"salvation has come to the Gentiles to make Israel envious."

and "God has bound all men over to disobedience, so that he may have mercy on them all."

HB

C.S. Lewis statement....

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