umbertoecho

Joined

• started 63 topics
• posted 864 times   see topics posted on
• send a message

Posts by umbertoecho

• 
  50

  The Report - BBC Radio 4 about Jehovah's Witnesses and Child Sexual Abuse can now be heard

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0612hjs.

  the report about child abuse and jehovah's witnesses is now live.. jehovah's witnesses handle child abuse cases.

  jehovah's witnesses and child sexual abuse, the report - bbc radio 4 .

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  umbertoecho

  Thank you mephis, it's the only way I will be able to hear or see it.
• 
  13

  LET'S EXPLORE A LITTLE THOUGHT EXPERIMENT

  by TerryWalstrom in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  over here on the left we have a governing body which is inspired directly by jehovah to receive his instructions for how to worship and interpret the bible accurately.. on the other hand, on the right we have a governing body which isn't inspired nor directed by jehovah, but which is making the best guesses they can make as mere humans as to proper worship and bible interpretation.. here is our thought experiment.. what differences would we see or would have seen in the last 100 years of jw teaching in each instance, .

  and how would they differ?.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  umbertoecho

  I cannot see how they suddenly arrived in this form of GB. They are a young relgion using the research of older established religions to form doctrine. I just can't believe in any sort of "spirit direction" that they claim. Even this claim is Catholic, the resurrection is Catholic, or was. They have taken many of the hard core approaches that Catholicism use to contain critics. One of those methods is to denounce any form of questioning or asking for evidence. I'm happily comparing some of the Catholic methods of indoctrination with those that the society and others have adopted. Some methods are identical.

  I can't even begin to believe these GB. It feels like a lie to me. It is completely false.
• 
  28

  Ray Franz and You.

  by John Aquila in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if ray franz would have kept his mouth shut and not disfellowshipped, and remained part of the governing body how many of us ex-jw would still be trapped in the cult?.

  would we have come this far?.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  umbertoecho

  OH, while I'm on the topic of Ray Franz and other such means of getting clear about the WT..........One thing I vividly recall was being told that my sorrow over the recent death of my youngest daughter, was in fact showing a lack of faith in the resurrection.........Yes. She had been dead for only two years and I was lonely for her, wanting her back.....My study conductors, two old die hard seventy something, cold eyed and bitter to the core witness teachers, had the gall to tell me this.........Some of Ray Franz' observations about this lack of love and compassion was a great assist in letting me call things as I saw them.

  Those two oldies had expected Armaggedon to have been and gone by now and they were caught up in hating the young and lovely people in the hall who were modern and still able to have fun. My only wish was that these young people would get out...in the end. Oh dear, I feel very angry and upset about it this morning for it took years of joy out of my life and I let it.
• 
  28

  Ray Franz and You.

  by John Aquila in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  if ray franz would have kept his mouth shut and not disfellowshipped, and remained part of the governing body how many of us ex-jw would still be trapped in the cult?.

  would we have come this far?.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  umbertoecho

  I read Ray Franz book just before I was due to be baptized. I was in a state of anxiety about the coldness and harshness of the congregation I was in. I was told in so many different ways that I should not ask too many questions. It was showing a lack of faith.

  But things were bothering me greatly. I read that book and just knew he was telling the truth. Then I recalled something about a "great apostasy" that had taken place at Bethel from family who are still in....It helped me to loosen up and research even more. So in a great way, Ray Franz book helped me to get past "men in authority". It shook me up though, for I was deeply convinced from childhood that it was the only truth. I felt sure I was going to die no matter what good I did for other people.

  I was devastated at how spiteful the congregation seemed to be. They were not spiritual in any sense that I could see. They were mean to some of the younger and more beautiful sisters and picked out a man who was gay but inactive and treated them like shit. A recently widowed woman was treated as though she was mentally ill, when all along she was simply grieving. So Yes. A big yes about the impact Ray Franz had on me. Sorry for the intimate aspect of this post, but they really hurt me.........these lovely witnesses with their earthly spiritual paradise......not.
• 
  24

  Bible Students Convention ......New Understanding of 607!!

  by umbertoecho in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  july 23, 2015 at 3:35 pm.

  i have just read this from berean pickets in the comment section.

  it's quite a leap.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  umbertoecho

  FayeDunaway No. They are not promoting any religion in the sense that you are speaking of. They believe in God, Christ.....but they are not promoting a new sort of faith. From what I have read, they are conscious of the fact that all organized forms of religion have failed miserably over the centuries. Of course being on human..........we shall see.

  I just thought it might interest some of you on this site who have looked into this 607 teaching before. It is interesting to me to see how they can divert attention away from the fault and introduce some airy reasoning about this date. It leaves (for them) the topic open to being proven all over again. Of course they will leap upon this new understanding as it will assist them to maintain the 1914 date.

  I see so much information has been posted here already. I think it's quite a sign of a sort of desperation on the orgs part in having to stoop to such methods of defending themselves.
• 
  12

  Will the Royal Commission into Child abuse...

  by zeb in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  ....get a mention at the coming conventions in australia?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  umbertoecho

  Will the Royal Commission get a mention? I doubt it will be the subject of a Sunday talk, but amongst themselves they will be humming with speculation. Some will outright go into damage control. My sister may even shove another bloody tablet in my face to force me into seeing how it's all "lies" as per the society..

  I also hope that the Card requirements are not changed by this Commission. The lawyers are sneaky bastards and good at twisting the facts outright. Tool has said that he can get out of any .........can't remember the exact phrase now........He said there is no question or fact that he cannot twist. I think that was the word he used.
• 
  24

  Bible Students Convention ......New Understanding of 607!!

  by umbertoecho in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  july 23, 2015 at 3:35 pm.

  i have just read this from berean pickets in the comment section.

  it's quite a leap.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  umbertoecho

  Berean Pickets is not affiliated with WTBTS at all. It is a site created by some who have disagreed with the inaccurate doctrines of the WT. Some are elders who have stood down due to the persistent refusal of WT to correct it's deceptions and the GBs almost godlike status, amongst other things......
• 
  24

  Bible Students Convention ......New Understanding of 607!!

  by umbertoecho in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  july 23, 2015 at 3:35 pm.

  i have just read this from berean pickets in the comment section.

  it's quite a leap.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  umbertoecho

  I have no idea. I would like to know what "proof" they have come up with. What I find interesting, is the fact that they feel compelled in some way, to explain this long faulted doctrine. It seems like a back sliding or just loading up some sort of banal reasoning to justify this strange and inaccurate teaching of theirs.

  WT has noticed the dissent, it must be obvious to them, even from a cursory view of the internet. I think it's a rather desperate attempt to qualify a long disqualified claim. As we all know, 1914 is absolutely important to them, for everything hinges on making this fit in with their version of the "truth", or the imminence of the end....
• 
  24

  Bible Students Convention ......New Understanding of 607!!

  by umbertoecho in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  july 23, 2015 at 3:35 pm.

  i have just read this from berean pickets in the comment section.

  it's quite a leap.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  umbertoecho

  July 23, 2015 at 3:35 PM

  I have just read this from Berean Pickets in the comment section. It's quite a leap. What do you think of this.....I find it quite amazing how this new twist to make "it fit" has been approached. By the way. Berean Pickets is quite a good site for information related to doctrine. Not harsh, good research etc.........The posters name is there I think. At any rate, he felt strongly enough to send the message straight through.........

  "I am at the Bible Students Convention in PA. There was just a discourse on how the date for the beginning of the invasion of Jerusalem is 607BC. The destruction of Jerusalem is in 587BC. So 2,520 days from 607BC is 1914. So the date is correct it’s just that the understanding of what happened in 607BC is incorrect."

  REPLY
• 
  4

  Love and forgiveness....

  by Tornintwo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i've been musing a lot about the 'love' that exists in the organisation.

  what i've noticed over the last 20 odd years is that an overemphasis on the requirement for forgiveness by those who have been wronged.

  of course as christians we should forgive eachother, but i'm talking about obvious abusive and bullying behaviour by 'prominent' ones, which is excused by the ageold 'we are all imperfect'..... 'its an organisation of imperfect men....', you should forgive.....and quickly dismissed.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  umbertoecho

  In response to a question as to "how often one should forgive" Christ said something about seventy seven times. That was in response to a person" asking for forgiveness" and therefore, implied that the one doing wrong was contrite. It was not about forgiving someone who didn't care or seek to repair the damage done.

  So, if someone should request forgiveness for past wrongs, then it is a sign of regret. When the person or entity makes no attempt to seek forgiveness, I see no command to go about forgiving.

  I may have this wrong.........but I don't think I am far off the mark.