i know this is going to come up in a conversation shortly, how would you respond to this?
i've had it said to me before, specifically about health, one week wine/eggs/milk/axle grease is good for you, next week it's not..
Oh, I will take a doctor over a priest anyday. In my post I was just theorizing that discrepancies can happen because of differences of opinion, human error, and new evidence.
A doctor, even the most experienced doctor, can not guarantee results simply because a human body is not a car! A procedure that works fine in 99 patients may not work in someone else. No slight on the doctors experience (or lack thereof) but simply because all human bodies are different.
i know this is going to come up in a conversation shortly, how would you respond to this?
i've had it said to me before, specifically about health, one week wine/eggs/milk/axle grease is good for you, next week it's not..
Don't get me wrong, I think science is wonderful. But, the way I see it science is not hierarchical as is religion. Anyone calling themselves a scientist can publish an article or book or whatever stating their findings/beliefs. I am not aware of a "pope" head scientist that they must get approval from. That's why even scientists can disagree with one another.
But many scientists get funding/grants from the government or wherever, and in order to continue getting further funding they must come up with some results. I don't doubt that sometimes they might "fudge" a little to produce enough results to aquire more funding.
Now, I didn't think this up myself but I don't recall where exactly I heard it. Perhaps I heard it years ago when I was still in WT Land, I just don't know. But it sounds reasonable, I mean even scientists are only human, right?
and they left the congregations, would you then feel open to be thier friends?.
many on here have the same complaint, that in the jw congregations, there were clickes, no one had time for each other,.
people judged, there was a lack of association, freindship , true concern and love were lacking.
sowhatnow,
Thanks for your response! It sounds like you and I are in very similar situations. I am actively working on the best way to get out of this situation. If I were to tell you everything, it would be like writing a book, so for right now let me just address one thing you mention.
"you mean to tell me, if you told her to sell the house and buy another one closer to a kingdom hall so she can go more often, [if shes even able to]
she isnt open to the idea? use her psycology. get closer to the hall see people, have new area to explore, bla bla. id call her bluff. start packing, lol
and yes you certainly need some sort of job if anything just to get out of the house!"
Yep, that's exactly what I mean. Over ten years ago I was living in Arizona. I moved back to Texas and was unaware that the Kingdom Hall here had been closed. There were very few brothers and sisters here, but those who were, humbly sold their houses and possessions and moved closer into the cities to be near the KH's. Except my mom. She waved bye-bye to them and said "Keep in touch".
Now, on one level, I can't fault her there. Pretty clever way to do a fade if you ask me. But she still acts like a "sister" strong in the truth. Telling her how much she needs to be near the brothers and sisters doesn't sway her one bit. I've been over that many times.
The elders don't help matters any. They don't come to visit as much as they used to, but when I've brought the subject up with them they tell her how much Jehovah has blessed her by giving her this house. For the record, Jehovah didn't give her this house, the WT certainly didn't give her this house. She got it through an agent of Satan, a government program!
I could just leave, I really should. If I called her bluff she would just say "Bye". I know her all too well. A couple of years ago I did make plans to leave but a very unfortunate thing happened. My younger brother suddenly died. That's where the real long story begins, and I had to stay in order to take care of managing his estate.
If my mother were to just die suddenly, it would be one thing. But I don't see it happening that way. As you mentioned, she will probably end up going into a nursing home. You are right, they will take possession of her house.
My mother listens to the meetings on her phone. She can turn 'em on and turn 'em off at her leisure. Once in awhile the elders pay her a visit and tell her what an inspiration she is and how much they love her. She'll cut 'em a check for a hundred bucks or so. She thinks she can buy her way into paradise.
So as to my "Good, Bad, and Ugly" analogy, the lines are kinda blurred as to who the good guys and who the bad guys are.
But as for me, well, I'm the Man With No Name, naturally. Stay tuned!
so, my wife and i purchased a house about a month ago and recently we met our new neighbors.
they are an older couple.
they are very nice and even brought us cookies.. in conversation they brought up that they were mormons and mentioned how much they loved it.
This is a long story really, but I'm going to keep it short. I had a similar experience just a short time after learning TTATT.
My neighbor, who was a member of the Church of Christ, asked me one day if i would mind meeting her really good friends, who were husband and wife. I agreed, even though, like you, I suspected it was a recruitment meeting. So, I got all prepared regarding what I would say to them. BE CAREFUL!
When they came over to my apartment and started talking, they didn't let up! I couldn't get a word in edgewise! My brain simply shut down, just like it did for the 30 plus years when I went to the KH! They were an older couple and I didn't want to be rude, and I ended up just agreeing to whatever they said, just like I did as a JW. Then at the end of their 30 minute infomercial they handed me some literature and told me to study it for when they come back next week. Like I said, I just agreed just to get them to shut up and get them on their way!
After they left I felt terrible! I was ashamed of myself! I threw their literature in the trash. I couldn't believe that I literally went into a JW trance when they started droning on and on about their religion. I never invited them back and they never bothered me again and it soured my relation with my neighbor.
But, as I said, I was a new ex-JW at the time. I've learned a lot since then, and I'm ready to tangle with any cult member who wants to try me!!
and they left the congregations, would you then feel open to be thier friends?.
many on here have the same complaint, that in the jw congregations, there were clickes, no one had time for each other,.
people judged, there was a lack of association, freindship , true concern and love were lacking.
sowhatnow,
Yeah! I have that feeling, very much so! I can relate to most everything you say. People "of the world", as they say, look upon me like a freak, as though I'm a bible-thumping nerd that they are afraid of offending should they say the word "butt". And the reality is, I am not a bible thumping anything, I'm just trying to be a good guy.
And then there is the JW's, who look upon me as though I'm a part of the Manson family ("I've heard he listens to rock music and country music, eewww")!
I'm 60 years old and out of work. Fat chance of me finding work in the small town that I live in. So why don't I move into the city? Glad you asked, here's where my story gets real interesting!
I am not married and I moved here to help take care of my elderly mom, a JW for the last 50 years. The Kingdom Hall closed down here over 10 years ago, so she is the only JW in this town. She refuses to leave her house. In my opinion she is a WINO, (that is, Witness In Name Only).
The closest Kingdom Hall is an hour away. I ceased attending meetings years ago. I am not DF'd. When JW's do come to visit my mom, I treat them very cordially, I know that they are visiting my mom, not me. But if asked, I never fail to tell them where I stand, so they quit asking.
I don't actually know this, but I strongly suspect that the only reason that they don't DF me is, if they do, it will fall upon the JW's to take care of my mom, and they don't want that. But I believe they do want to inherit my mom's house and bank accounts. Not while I'm alive , they won't!
So you see, I'm kind of between a rock and a hard place. Go back and watch the last fifteen minutes of "The Good, The Bad, And The Ugly", the famous stand off scene. That's exactly how I feel right now.
And even though my mom is in her 90's, I'm beginning to think she may outlive me!
and they left the congregations, would you then feel open to be thier friends?.
many on here have the same complaint, that in the jw congregations, there were clickes, no one had time for each other,.
people judged, there was a lack of association, freindship , true concern and love were lacking.
Simon,
I agree with your last statement. I learned soon after leaving WT Land that there is not necessarily a real bond between X-JW's. People leave or get kicked out for many different reasons. Some turn around and join other controlling cults, some sink into drugs and other immoralities, some even commit suicide. One thing I have noticed also in people that I have known, the majority take up smoking cigarettes, even if they never smoked a day in their life before. ( I never felt that smoking cigarettes should have been a DF offense, I just agree with most that it is not a healthy habit).
I realize that there is a lot of anger built up inside one when they realize TTATT, there certainly was in me, but I strive to be a better person than the one I was while in WT Land. I will never get entirely over the emotional and mental scars from life in the WT but I manage pretty well
thankfully my parents are converts so they aren't wierd.
seemed pretty popular by all accounts.
they are "popular" jws even now.
Well, it certainly is factual to say that the JW's have their share of weirdo's. But, think about it, you are what you eat! And you are what you feed your mind!. You have come to realize what the WT Society is feeding its members.
Don't expect good fruit from a rotten tree!
The whole world is filled with weirdos. Just look at the political parties. Look at other religious organizations. Every group and organization in the world will have its share of peculiar characters. Be very careful when aligning yourself with an organization.
everyone has an opinion on things.
oftentimes, we ask for help or want the view of the board in a matter.
but just remember, the comments are simply personal views.
cofty,
by the way, here in Texas I believe it is 13 degrees outside, but what's the wind chill factor??
what saying made it all around the country?.
the ones that were passed around, word of mouth.. for example.
"donations basis proves jehovah is behind the work!".
"Put the fuckin' bricks in the wall!!!"
Okay, I admit it's not exactly a cliche, but that is what my former boss, an elder in good standing (RIP) used to say out on the job when I worked for him. I heard it many times, so it seems like a cliche to me!
everyone has an opinion on things.
oftentimes, we ask for help or want the view of the board in a matter.
but just remember, the comments are simply personal views.
Ucantnome,
But "sisters" must go out in field service in freezing temperatures with their bare legs exposed. The Bible doesn't say a thing about how one should dress when "witnessing", in fact, the Bible doesn't say a lot of things, but that's another topic!
