"If it were not for the disfellowshipping gun to their heads, many would extricate themselves from the stinky mess."
Oh absolutely - and I'm not talking about my situation - I'm not born in.
Alive!
JoinedPosts by Alive!
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12
IT IS ALL SHITE !!
by hamsterbait inand you know what?
i am never going to argue about the babble or witchtower comic book fairy tales ever again.
a big f to the lot of them.. whew - feels good doesn't it?.
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Christianity vs. Churchianity/Spiritual Buffets
by apostrate infrom zion's watch tower, september, 1883:.
"we are living in an age of shams and counterfeits.
satan seems to have abandoned the hope of crushing out the christian church by a process of undisguised hostility, and now seeks to destroy her efficiency by stealthily draining off her vitality, and robbing her of every supernatural element.
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Alive!
"Much of the current worship is done by proxy. Lazy religionists surrender their sacred rights to others. They take it for granted that the preacher is on the right track, and readily swallow whatever may be doled out from the pulpit, without using their own brains in searching for the hidden treasures of truth."
That's the life of a JW.
I love my dear JW friends - but have been shocked by the anger and viciousness shown by some when I raised a question....or two...
I was the "darling" of the congregations years ago when I was a "truth searcher' and a "questioner"......I was "an honest hearted one coming in from the world."
And how those "born-ins" loved being in my company - "so encouraging' - after all the years of being in the "truth", these people were desperate for a true friend.....
Lol - now I know why.
Apparently - my current status of searching is wicked.....OK
Sounding bitter? Sorry - just angry. Not with the people (well actually that's not quite true, I just have to deal with that on a personal level) but the dirty WTBTS.
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We Now See Hard Proof That God Does Not Guide This Religion
by metatron inonce upon a time, there was a small, controversial religion that got into trouble because of child sexual abuse.
there were lawsuits and nasty headlines and bad press and concerns about what other sort of sexual misdeeds might be covered up.. then, in a breathtaking moment of hubris, the apparent 'boss' of this religion gave a widely reported speech in which he revealed his obsession with homosexuals and young men wearing tight pants..
this is not "meat in due season".
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Alive!
Hey - sorry about poor spelling and grammer - just writing my heart out and my fingers and mind can't keep up!
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We Now See Hard Proof That God Does Not Guide This Religion
by metatron inonce upon a time, there was a small, controversial religion that got into trouble because of child sexual abuse.
there were lawsuits and nasty headlines and bad press and concerns about what other sort of sexual misdeeds might be covered up.. then, in a breathtaking moment of hubris, the apparent 'boss' of this religion gave a widely reported speech in which he revealed his obsession with homosexuals and young men wearing tight pants..
this is not "meat in due season".
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Alive!
And what frightens me - is the absolute resistance to criticism from my intelligent JW friends ( not the crazy ones) - how mad is that? Im talking about people who have responsible and important jobs...one friend said "its just a slip up and human imperfection" Really?
So - I work in a challenging and competitive environment - I have to write a bit of spiel - I know about spiel.
I keep it honest, but upbeat.
There is no, no way I would write some of the utter crap, and devise some of the totally repellant shite that these guys do - and who am I? No-one.
It was a proactive choice to make the deaf masturbation video and put it on the internet.
It was a proactive choice to depict Jehovah's organisation as being a heirarchy of Pullman chairs around an executive boardroom table spiralling down to practically a frigging milk stool for congregation members.
What message is that all about?
This is the scarey part - there are very intelligent people out there who are JWs and yet, make the most inane excuses for this stuff...
"Ho Ho - dont get too strung up - probably just an over zealous and inexperienced brother at Bethel in the writing department....just made a mistake, human imperfection...don't let that stop you from serving Jehovah"
This came from a dear friend who has the most wonderful character, has a very responsible job and is LOVELY. Her non-witness family are LOVELY - yet her life is trapped, she eats as if there is no tomorrow - seriously, over the past two years I have felt so close to suicide - I feel for anyone who is struggling to pull out of the entrapment. It stinks.
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We Now See Hard Proof That God Does Not Guide This Religion
by metatron inonce upon a time, there was a small, controversial religion that got into trouble because of child sexual abuse.
there were lawsuits and nasty headlines and bad press and concerns about what other sort of sexual misdeeds might be covered up.. then, in a breathtaking moment of hubris, the apparent 'boss' of this religion gave a widely reported speech in which he revealed his obsession with homosexuals and young men wearing tight pants..
this is not "meat in due season".
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Alive!
"This is heedlessness."
Oh yes.
You know, when I saw for my own eyes the deaf masturbation video on JW.org - the brothers showing the masturbating actions of women and men in orgasmic ecstasy...I think that was another deal breaker for me.
Of all the important messages to be given on the internet to deaf people - they chose this.
It was obscene, unneccessary.
As my husband said, obviously this is for deaf people who can see - so therefore, if the information was yet still important, they can READ it.
But NO - the GB decided that a video which brought ridicule and contempt from the world was just what was needed.
In this crictical time of the end.......oh yeah.
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When did you start getting ANGRY?
by Separation of Powers inwhen i started the fade....i recognize that i was upset, mainly because of the desillusionment.
but, over the course of the past several months, i am noticing an increasing anger toward all thing org.
it can only be described as indignation, not simply upset.
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Alive!
it's been a slow burn.
Various articles, recognising a certain tone of voice coming across in the publications and wondering how the hell could I expect people outside of our religious community to be attracted.....
Remember that appallling life experience where a certain Robert explained that if his witness family had shown weakness by having even a little contact with him when he was disfellowshipped, he wouldn't have been motivated to "return to Jehovah" .
This was recent, not decades ago. Approved and published just last year.
Unbelievable. I flipped!
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preface question:
by mohrb inorder of operations is important, so, i'll ask a question before i make assumptions and start "fixing things.".
obviously, the site heavily encourages the viewpoint of former j-dubs and others who have disagreements with the political posturing of the wbts.
i get that, and see your points.
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Alive!
Hi - thank you for your very well thought out comments Mohrb, you took time and care in considering my written thoughts.
Believing that what I was taught and what I in turn taught was nothing less than absolute truth was not of my own internal reckoning.
Arrogance was a word used by yourself to sum up that particular element of my spiritual journey as directed by the WBTS.
Did you mean my arrogance or the Watchtower's?
This is a matter of life and death apparently - people responding to the Good News of the Kingdom.
People are sick to death of religion - and yet in these critical times when peoples trust in organised religion is pretty low, the best we can offer is poor reasoning on far too many bible subjects.
And.....false expectations and false dates.
The same man who pronounced us to be Jehovah's Witnesses also pronounced that there would shortly be an earthly resurrection of ancient ones who would all live in a very pleasant mansion in the USA.
What spirit was leading that man? How do you honestly think your tidy illustration of platters and cutlery sit with honest people who dare to think that the true God would not "mess" with us, allowing really bad error to influence his people.... In a time that is supposedly so critical of the lives of folk.
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preface question:
by mohrb inorder of operations is important, so, i'll ask a question before i make assumptions and start "fixing things.".
obviously, the site heavily encourages the viewpoint of former j-dubs and others who have disagreements with the political posturing of the wbts.
i get that, and see your points.
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Alive!
Absolutely StarTrekAngel.
And when your deepest desire is to be a faithful witness, yet one repeatedly feels the horrible anguish and painful discomfort of "things not lining up" - well let's just say it's a hard, hard journey swimming to the surface and getting a gasp of guilt free clear air....only to feel like you are going down again and drowning in a murky underworld of guilt, fear and anxiety as yet another publication throws up the story of Korah, equates conscientious questioning with "an independent spirit" - would I really want to bring my non-witness family and friends into this mental prison?
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preface question:
by mohrb inorder of operations is important, so, i'll ask a question before i make assumptions and start "fixing things.".
obviously, the site heavily encourages the viewpoint of former j-dubs and others who have disagreements with the political posturing of the wbts.
i get that, and see your points.
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Alive!
Another thought regarding working from within, writing constructively to Brooklyn etc.
Do you remember the illustration showing the earthly organisational structure? The governing body were depicted sitting on executive pullman chairs, heads down, around a large boardroom table - NOT looking out towards the reader thus inviting mutual respect for a shared work....then elder bodies depicted sitting on basic office chairs around a simple desk and so on.....it depicted a heirarchy of diminishing corporate value, the furniture and chairs getting simpler and more basic the further they were removed from HQ - this didn't strongly portray a fellowship of workers for Christ, where none are lorded over (Christ wasn't even in the illustration) - so my question, in what way does that invite me or any other brother and sister to feel I can approach the GB freely as a fellow worker? The illustrations are not a last minute add on - they are well thought out and take time to execute...what message was bring delivered to myself and the worldwide congregations?
Where in our literature is I stated that am I allowed to THINK?
My conscience along with my emotional and mental health has really suffered as I've struggled to fight pains of guilt for not feeling "loyal" and for developing critical thinking to the point where I find the way we are dealt with as unforgivable.
I could write a book on my experiences and observations...
Thanks Doc and Phizzy for your comments.
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preface question:
by mohrb inorder of operations is important, so, i'll ask a question before i make assumptions and start "fixing things.".
obviously, the site heavily encourages the viewpoint of former j-dubs and others who have disagreements with the political posturing of the wbts.
i get that, and see your points.
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Alive!
"But, what is this "can not be fixed" rubbish? You realize the foundation of the religion is based upon questioning man-made teachings. The system isn't broken, the people have just been too lazy and sheepish to do their duty and speak up in a constructive, upbuilding way. Easier to throw a useless fit on the internet than do something productive and help the congregation grow."
Forgive me, my first post here and I haven't introduced myself yet..... Mohrb, reading your posts, regarding staying within the religion, providing Christian support and working to up build and effect change from within - this sounds wonderfully reasonable and appealing. But, our fundamental role is to make converts.
How can an honest person "witness" to folk with flawed and unscriptural doctrines - how could I possibly teach the latest generation teaching when I'm personally shaking my head and thinking...how could I have taught previous interpretations as if it were truth, absolute truth - praying with my students "that these marvellous truths sound down into their heart?"
How could I expect an honest hearted person to accept our stand on blood? Blood poured out for the intake of fractions is a conscience decision, but blood poured out for a transfusion is wicked and detestable to Jehovah? Is blood sacred or not? This isn't just about "us" - it's about proactively teaching others and drawing them into the organisation.
Would you witness and conduct bible studies, teaching interpretations which you have personally found difficult to swallow? What does that do to us? How damaging is that to our conscience? But what options do witnesses have? Is it fair to ask folk to join God's organisation knowing that once they are baptised, they will be expected to believe whatever new 'truths' are handed out.
I have loved the teaching of paradise like so many here - but over the past 20 odd years, my conscience has taken a battering. I prayed for the understanding of what turned out to be error..... so many times. That hurts - and it hurts that I have delivered intellectually dishonest publications to folk, containing manipulative language at times. Not my words, but written by men who don't seem to think it's a problem.....it's heartbreaking.