Cameron

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Posts by Cameron

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  17

  WT & Hitler Info required

  by aniron in

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  2. friends

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  can anyone direct me or provide the information of how many jw's actually were sent to and died in the nazi concentration camps.

  i believe that the jw's claimed so many numbers, but the actual figures were lower.

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  Cameron

  I recall reading something by Bill Cetnar (spelling?) who used to work at Bethel. He said that during World War II Rutherford came out with information explaining that since it was Jehovah's will that the Earthly Class will survive on into the new earth, therefore Jehovah would stop the bullets that the Nazi's fired at them. This was one of the reasons Witnesses were able to take such a firm stand against Hitler.

  But since those of the Heavenly Class must die before they can become Kings and Priests with Jesus in heaven, there was no need for Jehovah to stop bullets fired at them.

  Cetnar said that once this information came out, many of those who had claimed to be of the Heavenly Class all of the sudden decided that they were of the Earthly Class!

  Has anyone else heard anything about this?

  Don
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  11

  Why can't I find "Captives of a Concept" in Amazon or Abebooks?

  by hubert in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i just finished reading "crisis of conscience" by ray franz, and decided my next book will be "captives of a concept", by don cameron.

  i just read a post with this info on it the other day.. however, when i go to abebooks.com, or amazon.com, and type in the information, it comes up "o" hits.

  i tried using the authors name, then tried the title, and got nothing.

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  Cameron

  I noticed where Hubert said he was looking for a book that gets at the heart of the matter. This is what I tried to do with "Captives of a Concept" ...

  "There is only one thing that needs to be known about the Watchtower Society and there is only one way to know it."

  It has some different ways of looking at things and offers some 'outside the box' suggestions for helping Witnesses come to notice what has happened to them.

  Whereas Ray Franz's books take up 1,100 pages.(and I needed every one of them), "Captives of a Concept" only takes 147 pages. I got the title of the book from page 296 "Crisis of Conscience" (1st Edition).

  Don
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  11

  Why can't I find "Captives of a Concept" in Amazon or Abebooks?

  by hubert in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i just finished reading "crisis of conscience" by ray franz, and decided my next book will be "captives of a concept", by don cameron.

  i just read a post with this info on it the other day.. however, when i go to abebooks.com, or amazon.com, and type in the information, it comes up "o" hits.

  i tried using the authors name, then tried the title, and got nothing.

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  Cameron

  The book is available at www.CaptivesOfaConcept.com

  It is only available on the Internet at the present time (Lulu.com). I'm working on getting it listed at Amazon.com, etc. and in bookstores.

  It is in the process of being translated into German and Russian.

  If you have any quesitons please let me know at [email protected]

  Don Cameron
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  1

  Rich Warren & The Purpose Driven Life

  by Cameron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

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  any experiences with rich warren's "the purpose driven life"?.

  don

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  Cameron

  Any experiences with Rich Warren's "The Purpose Driven LIfe"?

  Don
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  42

  Are there any Masons on this forum?

  by Brummie in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  ?

  rumour has it that there are?

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  Cameron

  Seems to me I recall a program on the History Channel that explained that many of the early leaders of early United States Government were Masons.

  Don
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  22

  New OM book: Trusting the faithful slave is full of loaded language

  by truthseeker in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  why trust the faithful and discreet slave.

  our trust in "the faithful slave" is also manifest when we support the organization with our material contributions.

  three more keywords here: trust, manifest, material contributions.

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  Cameron

  Although the official teaching is that this "slave" refers to all the remaining anointed on earth at any given time, in practice this "slave" refers to the men who are hidden behind that term - the men of the Governing Body.

  I was finally able to 'see' this reality the moment I read Ray Franz's comments on page 296 of "Crisis of Conscience" where he said...

  "When the men of the Governing Body urge 'loyalty to the organization' (as they do in the new OD book)..they are talking about loyalty ... to the source of the teachings, the source of the authority. Whether the Governing Body memmers acknowledge it or whether they prefer not to think about it, the fact remains that...they, and they alone are 'the [faithful and discreet slave] organization."

  The only way Jehovah's Witnesses can be loyal to this "slave" is to be loyal to these men by accepting everything they are currently teaching - whether they are "true teachings of the Bible" or not. - See "Who is God's Organization?" p. 47 "Captives of a Concept."

  Therefore, as far as the Watchtower religion is concerned, the answer to Jesus' question, "Who REALLY is the faithful and discreet slave?" is "The men of the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses." Prior to 1976, "Loyalty to God's organization" required loyalty to the one man who was president at the time - especially since Rutherford's presidency. From 1897 to 1927 Russell alone was thought to be this "slave." - See "Proclaimers" book. p. 143

  Don
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  24

  The Concept That Holds Jehovah's Witnesses Captive.

  by Blueblades in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  it isn't what jehovah's witnesses believe about the bible that has made them captives of a concept.

  it is what they believe about the watchtower society that has done it.. there are two things that are necessary to compare.. 1) the society's interpretation of matthew 24:45--47, the most important scripture in watchtower theology.. with.

  2) watchtower history as it relates to their interpretation of matthew 24:45--47, the most important event in watchtower history, 1919 jesus's appointment of them as god's organization.. from don cameron's book, "captives of a concept".. if you haven't read it yet, it's right up there with 'crises of conscience'.if you have loved ones that you want to help get out of this organization, this book is the key.. blueblades

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  Cameron

  I got the title of the book from page 296 of Ray's "Crisis of Conscience" (first edition). I said...

  "The following statement by former Governing Body Member Raymond Franz may well be the best explanation that has ever been written about what makes Jehovah?s Witnesses ?tick?"...

  "I try in my own mind and heart to understand the feelings of all [Jehovah?s Witnesses], including those of the Governing Body. Based on my own experience among them I believe that they are, in effect, the captives of a concept. The concept or mental image they have of "the organization " seems almost to take on a personality of its own, so that the concept itself controls them, moves them, or restrains them, by molding their thinking, their attitudes, their judgments?The ?concept of "the organization"? becomes, in fact, the dominant, controlling force."

  As soon as I read that in 1984 I realized that it was true, not only in my case but with everyone I knew. It is just as former elder Peter Gregerson had observed during his 50 years of association with the Society...

  "It seemed that everything always

  [comes] back to the question: Is the Watchtower Society and its leadership the "faithful [and discreet] slave [organization] ?"

  According to the Society's interpretation of Matthew 24:45-47, there is only one way to know if the Society really is, or ever has been God's "faithifiul and discreet slave organization." It has nothing to do with anything that the Society has taught or done since 1919.

  The book tries to explain and investigate that one way.

  It is in the process of being translated into German by the same person who translated "In Search of Christian Freedom" into German. It is also being translated into Russian. Someone recently expressed the hope that it will be available in Spanish. He said that Mexico is having a real problem with Jehovah's Witnesses.

  The book is available in both PDF and print form at www.CaptivesOfaConcept.com

  Don
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  3

  Watchtower Theology,2

  by Blueblades in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  what to you is the most important event in watchtower history?

  hint, it's not the memorial.

  blueblades

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  Cameron

  I feel that the most Important event in Watchtower history is the appointment mentioned in Matthew 24:47.

  According to the Society's interpretation, in order for it to even have a chance of being God's organizaiton today, they had to have received the appointment mentioned in verse 47 in 1919..

  According to their interpretation, in order to have received that appointment they had to have passed Jesus' food-at-the-proper-time examination that they say he gave them in 1918-1919.

  According to their interpretation, in order for them to pass that examination they had to have been teaching the right things at the righit time from 1876 to 1919.

  The only way to know if they could have passed such an examination is to make the same examation they say Jesus made.

  Most who who do make it end up concluding the same thing Ray Franz concluded once he finally made in the late 1970s...

  "It would be an insult to Christ Jesus to say that he selected [i.e. 'appointed'] this organization on the basis of what it had been teaching as of 1919." - In Search of Christian Freedom, p. 145

  Don
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  7

  Watchtower Theology.

  by Blueblades in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  what to you is the most important scripture in watchtower theology?.

  i will start off my saying, matthew 24:45 - 47. do you agree, or do you have another scripture in mind and why?.

  blueblades

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  Cameron

  I too feel that "The Most Important Scripture in Watchtower Theology" is Matthew 24:45-47 - especially since that's the title of Chapter 2 of my book! ("Captives of a Concept")

  The Society's claim to being "God's faitihful and discreet slave organization" is based upon the way they interpret this Scripture. According to their interpretation, if Jesus didn't make that appointment mentioned in verse 47 in 1919 then the Society cannot be God's organization today no matter what they are teaching today.

  I also feel that the Society's most imporant teaching is that it is "God's organization." I think of it as the foundation cornerstone of the Watchtower religion. And yet, when I went to the Society's website and looked at the 40 teachings listed under "What Do Jehovah's Witnesses Believe?" - that teaching isn't mentioned!

  To me this would be similar to looking up the teachings of the Christian religion and not being able to find the one that says that "Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God."

  Don at www.CaptivesOfaConcept.com
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  37

  Can The Watchtower Society Be Reformed?

  by Cameron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

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  what about www.jwreform.org ?.

  don at www.captivesofaconcept.com

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  Cameron

  The above JW Reform Movememt people do not believe that the Watchtower Society is God's organization.

  It seems to me that in order for there to be a meaningful reformation of the Watchtower Society, the first thing the Governing Body would have to do is acknowlege that fact.

  But if they ever did admit such a thing, would the Watchtower religion be able to continue to exist?

  Don