Fleur

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Posts by Fleur

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  146

  Extra training ... so you know that shooting babies is WRONG ?!?

  by Simon in

  1. social
  2. current

  how dumb and pathetic.. no extra training should be necessary for even slightly trained and disciplined soldiers.

  i guess it is for some of the rabble that the us call "troops" though.. of course the real problem is not just those on the ground that have committed the latest attrocity.

  it is the chain of command that tried to cover it up and all the way up to the president who sanctions bombing of civilian targets with nothing more than rumour for "intelligence".. from now on america, you are on your own.

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  Fleur

  "You leader Tony Blair supports the war!!!!111" is similarly idiotic, just because our PM blindly follows Bush into an illegal *mess* of a war, it doesn't mean the British people support it; we aren't sheep. Do any of you know how many people out of the whole population of Britain actually voted for Blair at the last election? 2,400.

  Um, I think you're referring to my post, and if you are, thank you for calling me an idiot, very kind of you. But, isn't this the very same point I tried to make about Bush??? I don't think anybody is listening. Repeat after me: Just because the president is behind this war does not mean that your average American is. Repeat until the meaning of the words sinks in.

  Simon, you don't have the answers either. Or if you do, please call up the Powers that Be and have them put into place, immediately so the bloodshed can end. My own opinion and that only is that we we never had any business going there, we shouldn't be staying there now. I hold the people behind the war responsible for not only the lives of the precious children who have died but also for every serviceman of every country that has died as well. But unfortunately if I try to recall the troops, no one will listen so it's just as frustrating for me as it is apparently for you.

  I just don't see the benefit in lashing out at an entire country of people for what a few in power are doing. But I guess I need to remember that this is Simon's house, he can decorate it here any way he likes and I really have no right to say anything.

  So with that, I leave you all to duke it out in this thread...

  essie
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  146

  Extra training ... so you know that shooting babies is WRONG ?!?

  by Simon in

  1. social
  2. current

  how dumb and pathetic.. no extra training should be necessary for even slightly trained and disciplined soldiers.

  i guess it is for some of the rabble that the us call "troops" though.. of course the real problem is not just those on the ground that have committed the latest attrocity.

  it is the chain of command that tried to cover it up and all the way up to the president who sanctions bombing of civilian targets with nothing more than rumour for "intelligence".. from now on america, you are on your own.

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  Fleur

  ...and I'm certain that no British soldier has ever killed a child in war, right Simon?

  I just hope that you and the rest of the world can realize that a LOT of us voted for the OTHER GUY and have no control over what our government is doing. And, um, doesn't your Prime Minister still support the war?

  It's a nightmare, never should have happened and your average American mother and housewife (pointing to self) loses more sleep over this than you can imagine.

  Whatever small vestige of respect and moral authority America had is long gone.

  You might mean your tirade to be aimed at the governmental powers that be but it sure sounds like an attack on those of us who just happen to live here. You can't pick where you're born, Simon. Please remember it's the powerful and corrupt who are also making our own people suffer here and neglecting them, like the people still living with buckets for toilets after Katrina almost a year out. If you think we're happy about it, well we're not.

  respectfully,

  Essie
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  29

  Brainwashed Children

  by I-follow-the-narrow-path in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i noticed an elder showed a picture of "paradise" and asked "who are the people dipicted"... .

  serveral children answered and said the same thing "they (look like they) are witnesses" -- .

  it was as if these children were taught that only jws are right... which they probably were.

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  Fleur

  Ah, yes, the Paradise book nightmares. My sister had them, bigtime. The Revelation book always bugged me, I was a teen by then and I thought the pictures were rather "demonic" to be in a publication trying to save people...

  The one that always got me the most as a child was the picture in the Bible Story book of Abraham about to sacrifice Isaac. He had the knife to his throat, and Isaac was just laying there, submissive. I remember having read that "Abraham was a friend of Jehovah" and thinking even as a child, what kind of friend asks you to kill your child for no reason and expects you to do it?

  This was when the whole "human sacrifice as ransom for human sin" thing started to stink to me. I didn't want Jesus to have to die for my sins. If I was bad, I figured I deserved to die. I didn't want anyone else to suffer for me, and it wasn't until my 20's that I really began to ask myself why a loving god would demand blood from one being to forgive the sins of another? It all struck me, suddenly, as being very barbaric. It still does.

  The biggest influence on me was when I was a child, we went on vacation and in the old town we were visiting (touristy) there was a huge cathedral. I had never been in a church, and I don't know why my mother took us in. But I remember, being six years old, standing there with my mouth open and gaping holes in my grin where my baby teeth had fallen out...bursting into tears when I saw a lifesize image of Jesus on the cross. The nails, the blood, the look on his face, the thorny crown. I just dissolved. My mom said she felt bad, she didn't think about that in advance that I might see that inside and I just remember literally falling to my knees and sobbing and wanting to tell Jesus that I was sorry that he had to suffer for me.

  Yes, JW children are brainwashed. And now in my mid-thirties I'm just beginning to realize how bad it really was.

  I'm so glad my child is free.

  essie
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  27

  TomKat: my gut feelings are getting stronger

  by Lady Lee in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  ok i don't bother much about celebrities and all this craziness about couples getting together and breaking up is more than likely media blown out of proportion but..... tom cruise and katie holmes .... something here really doesn't feel right to me.. we have older man vs young woman.

  clearly a man who has no problem making a spectacle of himself - jumping on the furniture on international tv - she seemed rather shy and subdued.

  a man who has no problem voicing his religious beliefs as if he and he alone has the ultimate truth of matters - she not so experienced so follows his beliefs (according to the media).

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  Fleur

  Oh no, Lee, it's definitely not just you! My husband even said before that he thought she should take off before the baby was born, and that it was such a mistake for her to have a child with him. Anyone with views as way out as his are definitely are a risk for being controlling/abusive.

  If he marries her, this will be his third marriage, btw. He was married to an older woman first, I think her name was Mimi Rogers? (Actress) She I think is the one who got him into scientology. Then he was married to Nicole Kidman and they adopted two children. She said recently in an interview that she still loved him and that the divorce came as a total shock to her.

  I think she should thank her lucky stars.

  essie
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  27

  TomKat: my gut feelings are getting stronger

  by Lady Lee in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  ok i don't bother much about celebrities and all this craziness about couples getting together and breaking up is more than likely media blown out of proportion but..... tom cruise and katie holmes .... something here really doesn't feel right to me.. we have older man vs young woman.

  clearly a man who has no problem making a spectacle of himself - jumping on the furniture on international tv - she seemed rather shy and subdued.

  a man who has no problem voicing his religious beliefs as if he and he alone has the ultimate truth of matters - she not so experienced so follows his beliefs (according to the media).

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  Fleur

  LL, I hope to heaven that it's true she left. I think he's a total psycho.

  I worried about the relationship pre-baby even when she said that as a young girl she'd had a poster of him on her bedroom wall and dreamed of marrying him. I think he "had her at hello" not to painfully paraphrase one of his movies, but the point is that she is love with an image she built up in her pre-teen mind. I'm sure that with his money he was very charming and able to really rope her in.

  I worry for her safety, and the baby too :( Seriously.

  The man's a freak.

  I hope she gets away from him...

  hugs

  essie
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  15

  Things JW's Say: "Yes I'm Brainwashed... And Proud Of It!"

  by under_believer in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  that last post about the "college education" was so successful i decided to post another.

  has anybody ever heard witnesse say the above?

  they'll say that, and then they'll follow up with "my brain is washed of evil thoughts, immoral sexual impulses, independent, goatlike thinking, demonism, etc..." this is something i have heard in conversation, comments at the meeting, and from the platform in the congregation, though never at a higher level than that.

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  Fleur

  Okay, just reading the phrase "goatlike thinking" has me ready to lose it. Ugh.
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  27

  Do we trade one arrogant "I am right" for another "I am right" attitude?

  by free2beme in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  when i was a witness, i was very arrogant in my life in thinking i was right in all things.

  the right religion, the right bible, the right understanding and the right lifestyle.

  when i left, it was not hard to shake this arrogance and i found at times i was the same person, only with a different "right" message and i annoyed my witness relatives as much as they annoying me.

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  Fleur

  Heck no, I didn't. I want to wear a little hat that says "Don't follow me, I'm lost too."

  The best thing I've ever learned is that truly, I know nothing. And neither does anyone else. We're all just muddling through the best we can. This helps a lot preventing me from judging anyone.

  essie
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  41

  What Exactly Is Your Relationship With Your Family Since Leaving The JWs?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i'm closer to my mom than ever before.

  but all the other witness family stays away.

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  Fleur

  "Dead".....how does it feel to be viewed as dead? People know you and just make believe that you don't exist! It's emotional blackmail.

  How does it feel? Let me ask you how you think it feels. Try this one. You're standing in an Intensive Care unit, having stayed up the entire night with your critically ill parent. Your previously (post leaving the org) very close cousin and her new husband who you have not met (not invited to the wedding, obviously.) come into the room to see your parent and they walk right past you as if you were a piece of furniture. You greet the cousin by name and she ignores you, a blank smile on her face as she continues talking to your parent as if you were not there. You walk out of the room to gather yourself before starting to throw things in frustration and your 'worldly' spouse comes in. Cousin's new spouse runs right up to said husband and extends his hand to introduce himself. My husband saw me leaving the room in tears, he knew that they had been ignoring me. He told me that it took all his restraint not to smash the self-righteous JW husband in the mouth for sucking up to him after ignoring me. He didn't shake his hand, he mumbled a greeting and then walked away. That's how it feels to be dead while you're still alive. And it eats you up, if you let it. I try not to let it. But some days, it gains on you more than you'd like. I just try to keep running and not look back. essie
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  45

  MY DAD HAD A STROKE

  by Mary in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i just got a call from my mom.

  my father's had a massive stroke and is in the hospital.

  i'm leaving now to go to the hospital and i probably won't have time to post here for a while until we know what's happening........

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  Fleur

  I'm so sorry, Mary. I hope that he got help within the first 3 hours.

  Most people do not know the signs and symptoms of stroke. I urge everyone to look at this page: http://www.stroke.org/site/PageServer?pagename=SYMP Most people also don't realize that you can only help a stroke victim if you get them medication and treatment within 3 hours of symptom onset. most victims do not get treatment for 12-24 hours.

  I've been through this with my own father and I know how terrifying it can be. PM me if you need to, k Mary???

  hugs and thoughts are with you...

  essie
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  41

  What Exactly Is Your Relationship With Your Family Since Leaving The JWs?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i'm closer to my mom than ever before.

  but all the other witness family stays away.

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  Fleur

  I am dead to them and sadly they don't see dead people.

  (((((((((((((((((Crumpet)))))))))))))))))))))))

  ditto that for me. With the exception of my parents (who need me) and a sibling who's 'drifted', they don't know I exist either...and things with my mother, well, if you've read any of my posts you know how that is.

  Sorry to everyone in the same situation. It just rots.

  essie