Posts by mamochan13

8

Amish in the City/The Village/JW's

by mamochan13 in

jw
friends

i watched amish in the city tonight and saw the village last night.

been thinking a lot about comparisons with jws.

i found the rumspringa thing quite interesting ever since i saw devil's playground (watch it if you have a chance, great documentary!).

mamochan13

I watched Amish in the City tonight and saw The Village last night. Been thinking a lot about comparisons with JWs. I found the rumspringa thing quite interesting ever since I saw Devil's Playground (watch it if you have a chance, great documentary!). My daughters and I were talking about the comparisons with JW's tonight. Difference? According to my daughter, most JW young people do the rumspringa thing, but hide it. Some decide to leave the "truth", others go back. But I was struck by the similarity...if you choose "the world" and all its pleasures, you lose your family and everything you grew up with. Horrible psychological pressure for a young adult.

I'm curious how others saw Amish in the city. I was disturbed by the scene where Mose almost drowned, then went back to the apartment and read the German bible and prayed, terrified because he had almost died and if he would have died while away from the Amish, he would have lost out on "eternal life" or whatever it was he was hoping for.

Reminds me of when I was DF'd. My daughters were told that if I died during that time I would not be resurrected. I think that was one of the things that really screwed me up when I finally got back in - I could have died on Monday when DF'd and god would not have remembered me. On Tuesday when the elders decided I was finally good enough (after a year and a half of their torture), I was free to have a heart attack and god would remember me.

geez....I'm depressing myself now!

17

Who do you blame? (WT related...)

by Confucious in

hey guys, .

of course, i know that most of you here are very frustated with the borg.

do you blame anyone?

mamochan13

When I was a JW, I could totally blow you out of the water with the things I knew.
But, oddly enough. If the NEW ME would debate the OLD ME... I would Kick the Old Me's Ass.
I guess ultimately you're responsible for yourself.
And I don't even blame those "A-hole elders" who just basically SCREWED ME over a barrel.
I think it's just part of THEIR system of thing.

Confucious, thanks for this...it's right on. Takes some of us a very long time to reach this realization, though.

25

Demons and Inanimate Objects

by VM44 in

the watchtower has published articles telling people not to shop at thrift stores, salvation army stores, etc, because the items purchased might have demons attached!.

experiences have been published by the wt, and particularly the awake!,where people are reported to have been bothered after bringing the used items home.

to only relief was after the objects were taken out and burned, usually after several attempts when the object would not catch fire!.

mamochan13

I'm not sure...I think its all manifestations of our own thoughts and fears. My mother (devout Jw) claimed she had this experience. She purchased chairs from a catholic second hand store in preparation for a big family event. Soon after, she noticed a strange smell every time she went down to the basement where the chairs were. She immediately felt something was wrong and discussed it with her children. She thought there was something wrong with these chairs and wanted to get rid of them. I was almost out at that time and told her this was nonsense. But she believed that the chairs were demonized.

Every day the smell got worse, to the point where she was afraid to go downstairs. One day she told me she had taken the chairs out and left them for the garbageman. the smell disappeared and she was fine after. It was several years later that she confided that one night the demons had come into her bed and raped her, and that the next day she had gotten rid of the chairs.

I have issues with my mother and her beliefs, of course. But she really experienced this, and in the telling of it I realized how horrible the experience was for her. I don't know what it was. But she believed and that's the key. I don't think we can discount the experience of others. We all see and experience things in our own range of perception. I don't believe in demons and inanimate objects, but I respect the feelings and emotions of those that do.

19

lost and alone

by black ghost in

jw
friends

i was raised a j.w.

for 20+ years and slid out of the back door in 1998(no-one noticed me slide) and when i went out into the big bad world i found i was completely naive and clueless as i had lived in a tiny shell all my life, for example i had never met a gay person and i believed every non member was evil and out to get me.. has anyone any similar experiences?how did you get the past out of your mind and move on?

do you still feel disadvantaged or do you think you benefited in any way?.

mamochan13

you are not alone, Black ghost. I left after almost 40 years. As long as you are doing what you need to do (university, etc.), you will make it. I've only recently discovered just how many of us are out there. You are not alone.

55

Was There Ever Any Rule That You Thought Was Silly In The Organization?

by minimus in

jw
friends

the rule on having "large gatherings" was stupid.

because some people abused a "christian get-together" that had a lot of people, we could only get together in smaller groups.

mamochan13

in the 60's miniskirts...in some congregations you had to kneel and the elders made sure your skirt touched the ground

Movies...a lot of disney ones were banned, anything with witchcraft (snow white, sleeping beauty). We weren't supposed to watch Bewitched.

the boots discussion - I remember go-go boots were banned. I wore a pair of brilliant yellow ones out in service one day - freaked them all out! hehehe

no beards, no sideburns allowed...I remember they used to portray Jesus as clean-shaven in the magazines, then one day they decided that made no sense and added a beard. But they still wouldn't let the "brothers" emulate Jesus in hairstyle.

stay in your house with all the lights out on halloween. or alternatively, answer the door and preach to all the little kids about how wrong they are.

Birthdays not allowed, but huge fancy wedding anniversary parties were ok.

the whole double standard about national anthem. You could stand if they were singing because singing was the "act" but if they weren't singing you were to sit down.

recorded music...they used to have people actually accompany the songs on piano, orchestras at the assemblies, but one day they decided that this was too individual.

lots more, just can't think of them right now...

D

16

Personal Growth

by simplesally in

jw
friends

have any of you thought of going to college since you left the jw's?

now that its not forbidden and you are free to do what you want .... it should not matter how old you are.

i know...... you think: i am 35 or 40 or 52, go to college?

mamochan13

oh, and I forgot to add - check out Athabasca U's PLAR process. http://prior-learning.athabascau.ca/ Other universities also have this, whereby you can submit a portfolio which is assessed for credits - it can save you a lot of time & money.

16

Personal Growth

by simplesally in

jw
friends

have any of you thought of going to college since you left the jw's?

now that its not forbidden and you are free to do what you want .... it should not matter how old you are.

i know...... you think: i am 35 or 40 or 52, go to college?

mamochan13

College/university - go for it simplesally! Several years after I made my complete break for freedom I enrolled in university (distance). I graduated last year with my BA, and I'm now in Master's studies. It has been the most wonderful experience of my life, and my graduation day was an emotional high second only to the birth of my daughters. The acquisition of knowledge in itself has set me free - if you ever had any lingering doubts left about what Jw's say, once you go to university you know for sure that they are dead wrong (which I guess is why they never let us go to university).

Regarding where to attend, distance university can be an excellent choice if you don't have the ability to attend a campus. But you need to be careful, some distance universities are not accredited as jwbot has pointed out, and the degree you will earn is not reputable (one you mention in your post is better avoided). Do some research & ask lots of questions - here in Canada we have one of the best in the world, Athabasca U - until you find one that suits your needs.

Depending on your circumstances, you may even be eligible for student funding like loans/grants, etc. University/college is hard work, particularly if you choose distance studies. But the reward is worth it.

Back in 1996 when I hesitated, thinking I was too old to start university, thinking I'd be a senior citizen before I graduated, a good friend asked me how old I would be ten years from now. When I responded, *x* years old, she said, "and if you don't go to university, ten years from now you will still be *x* years old, but without a degree."

9

Lehaa's High/ Lows for the week

by Lehaa in

time for high/lows again.. .

my high: lastnight curled up on the couch with my two year old daughter watching " my brother bear" we've watched it about 5 times in the last two days.. .

my low: been feeling really lonely adn alone this week, disfellowshipping really taking it's toll.

mamochan13

Lehaa, what you are going through right now is unbelievably painful, but one day your daughter will thank you for it. Mine have. I left as an adult, and my two oldest were already baptized. But they've thanked me repeatedly for having the courage to set the example for them by getting out. We have a wonderful, close relationship, perhaps made even closer by the fact that we have all been rejected and isolated from the rest of the family. They now understand the horror of what the religion put me through, and respect and admire me for being able to pull myself back together and heal.

I've been on a high for many years now, ever since I left. I have been able to finally do the things I was always prevented from doing. Gone to university, learned so much, had the world open up to me. My daughters are now able to do the same - every one of them is pursuing their dreams, no longer shackled by ridiculous restrictions laid on them by a paternalistic cult.

There are still lows, of course. At times it hurts that I have lost so much. I try and turn it around and focus instead on what I've gained, and on what they have lost (and continue to lose). This weekend they are all at the convention. It made me think about the way things used to be, and I won't lie that I do miss my family on occasion. But I keep reminding myself that it is their choice, not mine.

I know how bad it can get during the darkest days of the df'ing. I used to wake up screaming in the middle of the night, in intolerable pain, not sure if I could make it through another day. but I did make it, and I'm a stronger person for it. In a few more years I'll charter as a psychologist, and I'll be in a position where I can help heal others who have gone through the same kind of religious hell.

Stay strong, Lehaa. You will make it through. Take time for yourself and your daughter, do things you enjoy.

Send me a post if you ever want to talk. I've been there.

High this week? Attending my grandfather's 99th birthday party.

Low? Seeing my father at that party, all alone. Realizing again how the religion has torn my family apart.

High to make up for the low: my daughters, my little grandson, and I all at the party with my father!

40

How Would You / Did You Handle Disfellowshipping?

by minimus in

jw
friends

....as in if you personally were df'd or someone close to you was??

?

mamochan13

When I was in it, I had a close friend df'd. I went and visited her because I was worried about her state of emotional and mental health. I didn't know how important that was until years later when I was df'd myself.

It was an experience that almost destroyed me and tore my family apart. The elders kept me hanging for 14 months while I did everything they directed so I could be reinstated. They kept lying to me (starting with the first judicial meeting), telling me the Organization book said I had to wait a year. I made them angry because every month I'd make another request for reinstatement. They didn't care if I was "repentant." They just wanted to make sure I was punished well.

Seems weird now, why I wanted back in. As other ex j's will understand, it was the loss of my family, friends, lifestyle, faith, etc. They told my children not to talk to me, and forced me to let them go study the bible with other witnesses. My mother would not let me past the entranceway of her house (even though my father was not part of the religion). I was fighting to get my life back.

When they finally relented and magnanimously let me back in, I really lost it. Here I was the exact same person I had been 14 months previously, a good person who loved my family and god and wanted to do what was right. But for 14 months everyone I cared about was forced to treat me as if I was nothing, a diseased leper, unworthy of entering their home or being spoken to. Who were these men to say that one day I was unacceptable and the next day I was?

It was a turning point, and I finally woke up, thank god. It still took me some years to completely break free, but I'm glad to say that I'm now finally a whole person again. I left the religion, broke all ties with my family, and am finally happy with the person I've become. I'm free!

As horrific as the df'ing experience was, at least I got something good out of it. For Lehaa and others who are still struggling with the experience, remember that what they are doing is wrong. It is inhuman and cruel. A god of love would not approve.

You may choose to play the game and get reinstated if you want to maintain a relationship with your family and friends. But you have the option of leaving voluntarily after. Believe me, it gives me great satisfaction to be able to say "you 'kindly' let me back into the religion, but you know what? I've woken up and will never come back!"

11

how much did you give up?

by zen nudist in

i completely lost it and could not keep the tears back and my throat choked with grattitude to these men and my country.

i had missed feeling patriotic soooo much!

pasted from another thread...but got me thinking, how much did you stop doing as a jw, not because you really believed it but because you could not do it and still be a jw?

mamochan13

I gave up my youth, my aspirations, my relationship with my father, my marriage, opportunities in life...and a whole lot more.

But perhaps the more important question is how much have I gained? Freedom to think for myself!