OldSoul

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Posts by OldSoul

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  63

  website that will shatter everything about the Jehovahs Witnesses

  by watchmanofephraim in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  http://watchmanofephraim.tripod.com/

  go to this website, take a little time to read what is on it, and it will tell that eveything that the witnesse have been doing since the very day they started has had nothing to do with the god of israel.

  so dont feel anyway bad when any of you leave this lieing institute, they are responsible for more spiritual and literal deaths on this earth than any of the orginisations they slag off.

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  OldSoul

  WOE: And if I say to a wicked person, 'You shall surely die...'

  ...they might have you committed to a mental institution, get a restraining order against you, or have you arrested for making threats of physical violence.
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  41

  Physics Challenge! Explain "entangled particles" to me

  by AlmostAtheist in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hey all,.

  i'm totally fascinated by the concept of entangled particles.

  as i understand it, you take a proton (or something tiny like that), split it apart, but don't observe the resulting particles.

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  OldSoul

  Terry: If our understanding of nature was fundamentally wrong we could not split the atom

  That humans can split an atom does not demonstrate that their understanding of nature is fundamentally right. It demonstrates that a likely outcome can be expected from a certain action, within a degree of variance due to variable factors. It demonstrates nothing more than that.

  If anything, the fact that humans have split an atom just because they can demonstrates that their understanding of nature is fundamentally very flawed. Quite convincingly demonstrates that, in my opinion.

  I note that you did not address the fact that much of what we call "science," if traced through its riddled provenance, is little more "than a mass of abstraction and arbitrary assignation of meaning to concepts and relationships based on observed reality."

  Terry: There is art, music, literature, philosophy, mathematics, engineering, architecture, poetry, physics, etc to prove how splendid the process functions.

  Our current accomplishments in most of these fields would be sorely wanting if not for superstition and misinformed expectation.

  Terry: The FILTER I speak of is superstition and misinformed expectation.

  And science has never been the source of either? Mind, I am not arguing that science is bad and mysticism is good. I am simply raising the possibility that the two have something to learn from each other. The deeply rooted prejudices sharply dividing may be near to toppling.

  Respectfully,
  OldSoul
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  26

  Personality Wise----Are You THAT Much Different Since Leaving The "Truth"?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i believe that most people are what they are----whether they were jws or are exes.

  for example, if you were a basically happy go lucky person in the hall, you probably have that same nature now.

  conversely, if you were accused of always complaining and being miserable then, you probably still bitch and moan now.

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  OldSoul

  So it kind of depends on how good you are at trying to make yourself into a Jehovah's Witness or whatever, because unless you happen to be in a system (like belief and social) which is very similar to how you are as a person, then that would have come through in spite of the contrasting environment and mental indoctrination. Of course the thing is sincere people will work very hard at trying to change themselves, so it could just kind of peek out once in a while compared to the fringe Witness that was never really in.

  Yep, that probably explains why I have been called a spiritual man but have never been accepted as such, when it comes right down to it. I suck as a JW.
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  25

  The Organization Trains Witnesses To Feel Guilty

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  very seldom do you hear of a witness feeling like they are satisfied with what they have done in the "truth".

  most feel like they "need to do more".

  there's all this "urgency" to reach "honest hearted ones" before it is too late.

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  OldSoul

  Blondie: Is their technique backfiring on them or is this just doublespeak?

  Proabably both.
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  16

  What would your special powers be?

  by dh in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  if you had a choice of any special power what would it be...?

  (only allowed one)

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  OldSoul

  To acquire the entire human experience of any other human simply by touching them.
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  26

  Personality Wise----Are You THAT Much Different Since Leaving The "Truth"?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i believe that most people are what they are----whether they were jws or are exes.

  for example, if you were a basically happy go lucky person in the hall, you probably have that same nature now.

  conversely, if you were accused of always complaining and being miserable then, you probably still bitch and moan now.

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  OldSoul

  I am more myself the more I find freedom for my expressions.
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  34

  Comments You Will Not Hear at the 5-1-05 WT Study (Christ's Slaves?)

  by blondie in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  comments you will not hear at the may 1, 2005 wt study (march 15, 2005 issue date)

  review comments

  many elders have been able to become a leader and still have the comforts of the world.. paragraph 18.

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  OldSoul

  This Week In Sophistry

  Welcome, once again, to This Week In Sophistry. Blondie has done another outstanding job ripping apart the words of a few false prophets to demonstrate their hypocrisy, deceit, presumptuousness, and counterfeit words. I try to provide a weekly exposé that focuses on one or two paragraphs and demontrates, in depth, the mechanics of how they keep so many fooled through sophistic reasoning.
  

  One of the primary tools of the sophist is flattery. Often the flattery is not direct and it is usually hard to detect, because there is a price to be paid to qualify. A price paid in reason and logic. Before you can be deserving of the flattery, you must forego your own thoughts and adopt those offered by the sophist. This creates, in effect, a Pavlovian response in the readers of the sophist's words.

  In my opinion, paragraph 16, in this week's article for consideration, provides an outstanding example of the effectiveness of this sort of reward conditioning based on false or misrepresented premise.
  

  16 Jesus Christ wants us to keep faithful to our decision to be slaves of God. He said: "No man that has put his hand to a plow and looks at the things behind is well fitted for the kingdom of God." (Luke 9:62) Dwelling on what we have left behind is definitely not the right thing to do when slaving for God. Instead, we should treasure what we have gained by choosing to be Gods slaves. To the Philippians, Paul wrote: "I do indeed also consider all things to be loss on account of the excelling value of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord. On account of him I have taken the loss of all things and I consider them as a lot of refuse, that I may gain Christ.--Philippians 3:8.

  The WTS asks, in effect, do you want to please Jesus, do you want to do the right thing, do you want to prove that you appreciate what God has given you? Then agree with us, because otherwise you have answered, "No!"

  But let us examine the basis for these questions, as provided. Jesus, we are told, wants us to be faithful to our decision to be enslaved to God. This presupposes we have already enslaved ourselves, it is now only a matter of proving whether we are going to honor our debt of servitude. Of course, this ignores many scriptures that directly state sentiments in agreement with the thought that if we are really God's children then we were called for freedom, not for slavery. That sort of argument is best left to another post. For now, we will simply dissect the sophist's words as presented.

  What scripture is used to substantiate Jesus' desire for us? Luke 9:62. Let us examine the context to determine if "slaves of God" were even on Jesus' mind when he spoke those words:
  

  Luke 9:49-62 49 In response John said: "Instructor, we saw a certain man expelling demons by the use of your name and we tried to prevent him, because he is not following with us." 50 But Jesus said to him: "Do not YOU men try to prevent [him], for he that is not against YOU is for YOU."
  
  51 As the days were now coming to the full for him to be taken up, he firmly set his face to go to Jerusalem. 52 So he sent forth messengers in advance of him. And they went their way and entered into a village of Sa·mar´i·tans, to make preparation for him; 53 but they did not receive him, because his face was set for going to Jerusalem. 54 When the disciples James and John saw this they said: "Lord, do you want us to tell fire to come down from heaven and annihilate them?" 55 But he turned and rebuked them. 56 So they went to a different village.
  
  57 Now as they were going on the road, someone said to him: "I will follow you to wherever you may depart." 58 And Jesus said to him: "Foxes have dens and birds of heaven have roosts, but the Son of man has nowhere to lay down his head." 59 Then he said to another: "Be my follower." The man said: "Permit me first to leave and bury my father." 60 But he said to him: "Let the dead bury their dead, but you go away and declare abroad the kingdom of God." 61 And still another said: "I will follow you, Lord; but first permit me to say good-bye to those in my household." 62 Jesus said to him: "No man that has put his hand to a plow and looks at the things behind is well fitted for the kingdom of God."

  Now, I readily admit that I am not the sharpest tack in the box. However, I cannot find a single indication in this scripture that Jesus was speaking of remaining "faithful to our decision to be [a slave] of God." I do not see the term "slave" mentioned here at all. I see the term "follow," and the term "follower." I would have to look up the scripture in an actual Bible and read it in context, which means considering the surrounding verses, to realize that the WTS application is a gross expansion on what Jesus is reported to have said.

  From this initial misapplication, we see thw WTS take great liberty in the following sentence. The WTS version of the right thing to do (slave for God) is subliminally contrasted to the wrong thing to do (dwell on the things behind). This contrast is not supported by the scriptures provided. We are presented with two extremes and our minds automatically gravitate toward the one with which we most identify. We want God to like us, don't we? We have already been prepped to make the right choice in the preceding sentence. The WTS said Jesus himself wants us to prove ourselves faithful slaves by not dwelling on the things behind. The Bible did not say that.

  Next, we are told that proving ourselves unfaithful slaves is demonstrating our lack of appreciation. We are only treasuring God's gift to us if we become slaves. Now, you may think that assertion is wildly paradoxical.

  A quote from Paul seals the deal, because every true Christian should measure up to the example of Paul. For some reason, that seems to be the belief among Jehovah's Witnesses despite the fact that Paul replied like a madman that he was more outstandingly a minister of Christ, even in his own day (2 Corinthians 11:23-27) Paul did not say that only those who consider all things refuse can gain Christ. He simply stated his personal choice. The WTS implies that this scripture is a formula for gaining Christ. The Bible does not indicate that at all. Anywhere.

  That's it for This Week In Sophistry. I hope you have enjoyed it.

  Respectfully,
  OldSoul
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  35

  Out of context Watchtower quotes -- join in, have fun!

  by AlmostAtheist in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the watchtower is constantly pulling quotes out of context and distorting the original author's meaning.

  why not give them a taste of their own poison?

  here's a few to get you started: .

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  OldSoul

  If someone hypocritically tries to deny his serious sins ... or grudgingly admits only what is already known by others, refusing to confess fully, this could well be evidence of a wicked heart. -- w95 1/1 pp. 28-29

  NGO Affiliate to the UN/DPI, anyone?
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  41

  Physics Challenge! Explain "entangled particles" to me

  by AlmostAtheist in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hey all,.

  i'm totally fascinated by the concept of entangled particles.

  as i understand it, you take a proton (or something tiny like that), split it apart, but don't observe the resulting particles.

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  OldSoul

  Terry: Or, to put my point simply: what a thing is.....is according to its nature. We are the ones insisting that the nature MEANS this and that in order to fit it into an overall pattern. That pattern is often (mostly?) (always?) an artificial construct for the purpose of understanding it.
  
  I am NOT saying what Immanuel Kant said. Nature is not impossible for us to understand because it can be misunderstood. We must simply take care to wipe the equations already on the blackboard off before we begin the new set of numbers.
  
  I'm not even sure I've made any point now that I re-read the above. Try this: When we disturb the nature of anything in order to discover what it MIGHT BE we risk only seeing what it has become now that it is disturbed and then extrapolating and imputing MEANING.

  Terry,
  

  In my opinion, this is one of the best thoughts I have read since starting to post here. I believe I have gotten your point and if so I agree completely.

  Our "understanding of reality" is sourced in inductive and deductive conclusions reached from what really amounts to nothing more than a mass of abstraction and arbitrary assignation of meaning to concepts and relationships based on observed reality, which can only be obtained by disturbing the nature of the observed (or sensed). We therefore can confidently conclude that our "understanding of reality" is fundamentally very wrong, even though we may not be able to state exactly how and where it errs.

  When Dave, myself, and others have trouble wrapping our brains around newly "understood" realities it is always rooted in our difficulty getting rid of this mass of unfounded "realities" that we have saddled our conscious minds with, through little fault of our own. In seeking to make the universe make sense, we try to force it into a box too small. We end up limiting ourselves in our ability to comprehend it.

  Respectfully,
  OldSoul
• 
  63

  website that will shatter everything about the Jehovahs Witnesses

  by watchmanofephraim in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  http://watchmanofephraim.tripod.com/

  go to this website, take a little time to read what is on it, and it will tell that eveything that the witnesse have been doing since the very day they started has had nothing to do with the god of israel.

  so dont feel anyway bad when any of you leave this lieing institute, they are responsible for more spiritual and literal deaths on this earth than any of the orginisations they slag off.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  OldSoul

  WOE: You still not listening, just making light of somehting htat seems pertty dam serious, of course you got to believe that God exists for it too make sense, if you dont then you will not see it.

  Okay, firstly, I believe you are correct. Secondly, I believe none of the people on this forum would have understood a thing you are talking about from the volume of rant on your Web page. Thirdly, if you want large groups of any humans to listen to what you have to say, you had better start learning to concern yourself with how you say things. Fourthly, I understand your broken heart over the reaction that you have received, seeing things from your point of view. Fifthly, I understand the reaction you received from the point of view of almost everyone else I know.

  Your site expresses alarm and deep sympathy. Empathy, however, seems lacking.

  Respectfully,
  OldSoul