My, my, it looks like folks had fun with my post. Many were downright predictable with the name calling. What I liked best, though were the posts by Abbadon and Narkissos. Instead of just brushing me off as a fundie, they did make some very good points. Abbaddon mentioned that there is no direct prohibition on abortion in the Bible, despite the procedure being known in ancient times. Very good! Narkissos had the best one, I think, for the business of the thread! Some secular scholars don't believe that Israel was ever powerful enough to commit the massacres described in the Bible. Most higher critics, think the bible is just so much fiction anyway. If one is going to hold to that view, then this whole matter of the massacres is just irrelavent anyway. Kudos on that one Nark!
Despite what I said, I am not a fundie. What I am is a fader who is trying to figure things out. I am not a literalist, but then again, neither am I inclined to accept the higher critic's proclaimation that the Bible is just the product of human thinking either.
As to abortion, you might be surprised to find out that the Supreme Court has never found an absolute right for a person to have one. In Roe v. Wade, the Supremes found that a woman's right to privacy extended that far, subject to state regulation. On the question of a right to an abortion, the Court said, "...some Amici argue that the woman's right is absolute and that she is entitled to terminate her pregnancy at whatever time, in whatever way, and for whatever reason she alone chooses. With this we do not agree." The media would have you think that Casey v. Planned Parenthood found otherwise and established an absolute right to an abortion, it didn't. The Supremes said, "we are led to conclude this: the essential holding of Roe v. Wade should be retained and once again reafirmed." That included the holding that I quoted earlier. They said "We also reaffirm Roe's holding that 'subsequent to viabilty, the State in promoting its interest in the potentiality of human life may, if it chooses, regulate, and even proscribe, abortion except where it is necessary, in appropriate medical judgement, for the preservation of the life or health of the mother.'" So a woman has no unlimited right to terminate a pregnancy.
My personal feelings on the subject are not so bound up in scripture as many of you assumed, especially in light of Abbadon's comment. I simply feel that abortion, especially as it is practiced today, is a barbaric practice unworthy of use by an enlightened people. How so many people who claim to be for the humane treatment of our fellow beings as many who champion the cause of "the woman's right to choose" can so revel in such a cruel and barbaric a practice as abortion is beyond me. Rather than killing those unborn who are incovenient, I feel that people should be responsible enough to take the steps not to get pregnant in the first place. You may not like it, but that is where I stand.
Forscher
Forscher
JoinedPosts by Forscher
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91
Which massacres did Jehovah sanction?
by Spectrum inthe ones i'm familiar with are from the repercussion of the rape and murder of the levites concubine.
judges 19-21 .
about 100,000 died in battle then all the towns of benjamin were put to the sword as were the people that didn't join in against the benjamites.
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Forscher
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91
Which massacres did Jehovah sanction?
by Spectrum inthe ones i'm familiar with are from the repercussion of the rape and murder of the levites concubine.
judges 19-21 .
about 100,000 died in battle then all the towns of benjamin were put to the sword as were the people that didn't join in against the benjamites.
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Forscher
How can anyone in the twenty-first century take the writings of Karl Marx seriously considering the abject failure of his theories and the bloody record of those who followed them? But many still do! Personally, I am not going to dump all over God like some do. Try comparing the God of the Bible with the Gods of the Assyrians, Philistines, Babylonians, Aztecs, Mayans, and a few others around the globe, and he isn't so bad after all. And really, considering the wholesale slaughter of innocents going on in the name of "a woman's right to choose", I have to ask myself just how we can dare claim the moral right to judge him?
But guess what? We do! I prefer Miyagi's take on the matter. Remember that he told Daniel san not to disparage the Gods, one of them might be listening!
Good night.
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Circuit Overseer Pensions and the Implications
by AlanF ini just learned that the watchtower society has instituted a pension plan of sorts for circuit overseers.
this is a big change.. previous to this new plan, the various kinds of "traveling overseers" were pretty much on their own when they retired from the traveling work.
in a few cases, such men were invited to live out their lives in bethel, but in most cases they simply went back to being normal rank and file members who had to fend for themselves financially.. i can only speculate that the reason for this change was that the society has been having difficulty getting elders to become circuit overseers.
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Forscher
I heard that Alan!
I knew a CO who'd worked in that position quite a few years. His wife got sick. for awhile he would do his work as a CO during the day and go to his wife at night in the hospital. After a few months of that, he was let go from the circuit work. He got no help. No more coverage for his wife's hospital bills. And after she died, he ended up supporting himself working in a barber shop. I've never heard of him being allowed back into the circuit work. Somehow I doubt that happened while he was still trying to pay off his wife's hospital and funeral bills.
I've never forgotten that. It struck me as rather callous on the part of the organization. And that was almost thirty years ago!
Forscher -
135
My Dad died this evening
by Mulan ini thought i would let you know that my dad, passed away a little while ago, tonight, january 23. they called me at 6pm to tell me.
he had been failing rapidly for the past month, and had completely lost his hearing and was totally blind.
the dementia was extreme too, and he still knew me on thursday, but didn't wake up to know me in the following days.
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Forscher
My condolences as well Mulan. It is never easy to lose a loved one! So here's a hug,
One Big Hug!
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disassociation and family
by davidsf init's been a while since i posted and asked this question so i wanted to ask again in case there's been any "new light" on the matter.
i da'ed myself a year ago.
if i invite jw family members over for dinner can they attend?
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Forscher
I don't know the page. But I thought I'd mention that since the book came out, they even announce it differently. I think the announcement is "so anso is no longer one of Jehovahs Witnesses." That way, the R&F don't know which it is DF, or DA. Both are treated the same. You should find the details in whatever chapter deals with the subject of discipline within the Borg. The index should get you there.
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Studying the WT
by startingover inmy loyal dub wife is careful not to flaunt her jw activities in front of me.
whenever she prepares a talk or does any studying, it is at a time when i'm not around.
she always leaves for the meetings with a smile, so she does not try to guilt me in any way.. yesterday i came home unexpectedly and she was studying her wt for the afternoon meeting.
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Forscher
I know what you mean. To keep from being so bored, I started looking up scriptures in the Greek & Hebrew and writing certain key verses down in the same languages. It helped my build my vocabulary in those languages as I started studiying them. I would comment on what I found, as long as it was reasonably close to the party line. It really freaked people out to see those and other notes I made from extraneous amterial. I was asked more than once why I bothered studying the languages. The elders knew better than to tell me to stop.
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Never invite a wordly relative or friend to a witness gathering!
by gumby incan you just imagine what could happen if your worldly father was invited to a witness picnic?
oh my god!
perhaps an orgy would follow.
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Forscher
That's right kiddies! We don't want you getting close enough to folks on the outside. That way you want have anybody to turn to when you piss us off and we decide to Disfellowship you!
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38
Am I a JW or not? Year of Baptisim and year of falling away.
by truth about the last days ini put this page on just to know how many jws there are on this site.
i am sure that we all will be intrested to know as to who stands where.
i am only requesting if we are a jw or not, the year we got baptized and the year that we decided to leave.
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Forscher
Baptised in 1974. Decided to start fading in 2002. Haven't been to a meeting since 2004. Call me whatever you want, I'm a big boy!
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Is the Watchtower behind this "unbiased" website?
by SeymourButts ini just happened to stumble across this website while doing some research.
although it claims to not be biased toward any religous denomination, it has a decidedly watchtower slant to all of its bible translations and subject commentaries.
it completely supports 607bc and even claims that only 144,000 will be going to heaven.
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Forscher
I didn't have a chance to check out his methodology Leo. But I did note some of his unique renderings, as I posted earlier. I will probably look at some more later.
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HELP! 'FREELOADER' PIONNER SIS. WANTS TO USE MY LAPTOP! HELP!!
by stillAwitness inthe "freeloader" pioneer sister who lives with us asked me this morning if she could "look" up something real quick on my laptop.
i was not prepared for this and quickly told her the system was down and i would let her use it later.
how do i get rid of all the recent sites box that you can scroll down to.
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Forscher
Under Windows XP, create a "Guest" user as mentioned earlier and then password protect your own identity. That way the "guest" cannot access any of the information associated with your identity. The browser in the guest Identity will have have none of your bookmarks in it. For better security, make sure that the guest Identity is not classed as an administrator. That way you'll be able to check where she has been, but she can't check on yours.
That's the best advice I can give. Its not 100% fullproof, but should do if the sister is not real computer sophisticated.
Forscher