Posts by TheListener

56

BirthdaysSimple Deconstruction of the JW Rationale

by AuldSoul in

to deconstruct the jw rationale surrounding birthdays, a few simple guidelines should be followed.. (1): don't waste any energy trying to convince a jw that birthdays are not pagan, if they suggest that, readily agree.

whether or not the celebrations are pagan turns out to be a non-issue that distracts from the main point.. (2): stay focused on the fact that jws disfellowship people for celebrating birthdays.. (3): stress the point that there should always be clear scriptural reason for disfellowshipping someone.

ask them often throughout the discussion whether this is the case, get them to reinforce this need to themselves.. (4): remember, the first goal is deconstructing their rationale, not giving them a new rationale, not convincing them that celebrating birthdays is a good thing.. once you have these well in mind, the deconstruction can begin.. jw rationale, in brief:.

TheListener

erandir,

My response isn't scriptural but more of a common sense type of thing.

I posted this earlier in the thread:

at a wedding anniversary party or between a couple - who gets the gifts and praise. Who gets lauded with memories from the past and questions about how they made it all those years together. who is called a great example for all to follow. THE COUPLE!! not god. final question: who gets the gifts?

the same thing is true of baby showers. who gets the gifts. who sits in front of everyone opening the gifts and passing them around and thanking them for their generosity. THE COUPLE!! not god. final question: who gets the gifts?

Of course, others will probably have a more logical or scriptural discussion but that is my 2 cents.

59

WT + Awake Update - restrictions

by stillajwexelder in

study edition of the wt will be restricted - it will be as per km

TheListener

2 things:

1. This will make it easier to eventually roll the witness only WT into the KM thus creating money savings.

2. They're slowly headed toward focusing on tractwork and special campaigns in the field ministry.

17

My long story at least Part 1

by pmouse in

specifically christmas appears to be the one holiday to which all others compare.

we either joyfully or sadly recall past christmas holidays.

as i recall, they were controversial in our family even before i was born.. im going to go back a couple of generations in my story to give you a bit of background.

TheListener

I have children. Thank you for sharing. The feelings you've shared will help many of us heal.

I will definitely keep your deep fear of dying at Armageddon for doing something wrong in the forefront of my mind and help me keep my children from developing that fear (due to their mother being a witness).

23

Underground Lurker....Coming up for air.....

by Bourne in

jw
friends

i have been a lurker for the last year...finally got the courage to post.

i guess you could say that i have successfully completed a "fade", although that was not my initial intent.

due to my being in an "unscriptural" separation for a number of months, (that, combined with my paranoia, hence, the alias) i have been forced to go underground.

TheListener

Hi Bourne. I am glad you stopped lurking and started posting.

I liked your first post. You have insight and you are articulate.

It's tough to understand all the feelings and emotions a marital separation (eventual divorce?) may bring but I remember someone telling me that many major changes in life start with one event. Perhaps your marital problems, regardless of how they end, will be the start of many many good things for you.

Good luck.

25

JWDWhy is it important to keep doing this?

by AuldSoul in

jw
friends

we've had many jh and minimus threads that start with questions.

we've had loads of "why do you keep doing this?

" and "get a life!

TheListener

This forum has the power to change a persons life. That is important.

When I found this forum I was scared to death. I read a lot and knew, just knew for sure, that I would never ever never ever post. I read for about 2 years.

I followed the story of Winston Smith and his exit from the Witnesses. This story moved me beyond words. I owe him a debt of gratitude that it would be impossible to repay.

Then I followed the story of IthinkIsee. Again, I owe him a debt of gratitude that is impossible to repay.

I am here, I am free and I am hopeful that what little information I post on my personal situation will help someone the way I've been helped.

Auld Soul, it is great to see you back. I have missed our lengthy telephone calls.

56

BirthdaysSimple Deconstruction of the JW Rationale

by AuldSoul in

to deconstruct the jw rationale surrounding birthdays, a few simple guidelines should be followed.. (1): don't waste any energy trying to convince a jw that birthdays are not pagan, if they suggest that, readily agree.

whether or not the celebrations are pagan turns out to be a non-issue that distracts from the main point.. (2): stay focused on the fact that jws disfellowship people for celebrating birthdays.. (3): stress the point that there should always be clear scriptural reason for disfellowshipping someone.

ask them often throughout the discussion whether this is the case, get them to reinforce this need to themselves.. (4): remember, the first goal is deconstructing their rationale, not giving them a new rationale, not convincing them that celebrating birthdays is a good thing.. once you have these well in mind, the deconstruction can begin.. jw rationale, in brief:.

TheListener

Welcome back AuldSoul. yipeee!

Now, here is what I have said to many people who asked me what was different between birthdays and anniversaries:

"an anniversary celebration is a celebration of the marriage arrangement. Birthdays are a celebration of the individual - as if he/she accomplished something. It is inappropriate to bring honor to an individual for something God accomplished - his birth."

-ok that answer is crap but no one ever challenged me on it. That's because they didn't really want to discuss the matter with me. I sounded crazy and cult-like and they just wanted to get away. Little did I know that one day I'd be here on the other side of the fence.

My simple question now is:

At an anniversary party - who gets the gifts? the couple or God?

At a baby shower - who gets the gifts? the couple/baby or God?

70

Most Ex-JWs R Not Active in the Anti-JW Community. Maybe 1%? Any thoughts?

by Seeker4 in

yesterday i called a family on the west coast that were in my congregation 18 years ago.

between parents, kids and marriage partners, there were six of them who had been witnesses.

they have all faded, and have had nothing to do with the witnesses for at least 15 year or more.. yet, none of them is in any way active even in looking at the ex-jw sites online.

TheListener

I know many individuals who are no longer active. One of them held rather responsible positions in the org. and would have a lot to share with this "community". However, he has no interest in discussing the dubs or his personal thoughts on the matter.

We are all different. I remain active here because I am hopeful my wife will eventually see the light. Until then I want to remain up to date on dub news and goings on. I get no information from my wife. I am always looking to arm myself with theocratic knowledge to weaken the WTBTS hold on my family.

I, and I'm sure many others like me, can only be as active as our fade permits.

37

A Bible Question, please comment

by restrangled in

there will have to be assumptions involved here.....that god exists, the bible is the word of god and creation is as stated in genesis, etc.

etc.. in the old testament, god seemed pretty straight forward, let certain people know (and not by osmosis) his intent.

backed certain kings, and showed power through physical occurrences over and over again.. along comes his son, who died for the entire race as a ransom for adam's sin.

TheListener

I hear your question loud and clear. I have been thinking about the fact that I don't understand why Jesus didn't just speak plainly. Yes, he spoke in parables so the common man would understand - didn't God know that we wouldn't understand? Why wasn't the Bible written like the book "life's little instruction book"?

There should simply be no room for misunderstanding or interpreting things in a different way. We shouldn't be able to fight over the translation of specific words or their tense. It gets ridiculous at times.

The law code was cumbersome and just too plain much but it did provide God's specific instructions for everyday situations.

My conclusion, to myself of course, is that since God didn't make the NT as clear as the law code; he intended it that way. I won't let anyone's interpretation of the Bible come between me and loving Christ. I will love Christ and strive to be a morally upright person (what is that you say? Hmmm...I guess it means not doing anything that will get me thrown into jail or divorced - hahahahahaha).

One day I hope it will all come clear - if not, I'll die a satisfied person anyway.

17

Mom is fed up, about to leave Dad......

by R.F. in

my mom is fed up now and wants to leave my dad now.

the interesting thing is i was planning on moving out in a few months, but mom seems to be planning on leaving way before then.

so im going to just move with her to help her with bills for a little while.

TheListener

ROFLMAO at Dawg's post.

R.F. - sounds like you've thought it through for quite some time. Help your mom and be a good son. That's cool. Just don't become too involved in her life. Make sure to keep your separate identity (psychologically speaking).

112

30 Minute Public Talk-CONFIRMED

by stillajwexelder in

i can confirm (as there seems to be some doubt) at the service meeting last night during the item about the new watchtower, a letter was read by the po.

the public talk is to be 30 minutes long.

this is to allow for more association and ministry.. lengthy negative introductions about the state of the system of things/deep last days etc are to be heavily curtailed.

TheListener

Maybe allowing birthdays is next. You know, for the kids.