You guys obviously had far too much to drink ! LOL
Thanks,
steve
stevenyc
JoinedPosts by stevenyc
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4
SteveNYC!
by Sparkplug inok, we had a fest and steve nyc showed up.
i just have to say he was about the neatest and most real person i have run into in a long time.
my kids were very impressed and that takes a lot especially how critical they are of us wacko's from the ex-jw world!
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stevenyc
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Polytheism, Monotheism, Atheism: a logical sequence?
by Narkissos inthe current heated "(monotheist) believers vs. atheists" threads tends to overlook, imo, this rather commonplace but relevant issue: how modern atheism continues (and thus is tributary to) a line of religious, philosophical and scientific thought which runs from ancient polytheism through monotheism, both in greek and jewish traditions (which are the two main sources of western culture).. in the greek-speaking world, homeric-like polytheism went out of fashion, and although political authorities stood for the conservation of popular worship of the gods (atheism being a capital offence, ask socrates), an intellectual monotheism came to the fore, especially in platonic tradition, along with more or less "underground" forms of early atheism (democritus, epicurus).. in judea, for mainly political reasons ("one god, one temple, one priesthood, one king") the "deuteronomistic reform" of the 7th century bc promoted the active rejection (1) of all other gods than yhwh, and (2) of any representation of yhwh himself, henceforth branded as "idolatry".
it also (3) reinterpreted most "natural" features in older israelite religion (linking yhwh, just as baal, with the cycle of seasons, especially the rain and dry seasons, vegetal and animal fertility) into historical (or pseudo-historical) celebrations: the feast of spring became the celebration of the national foundation in the exodus from egypt, etc.
(4) the development of a doctrine of creation, increasingly construed as creatio ex nihilo -- mere "fabrication" of the world out of nothing instead of the older theomachy (struggle between the gods) wrestling for order out of chaos contributed to emptying "nature" of its numinous, sacred or divine presences: the sun, the moon, the stars, vegetables, animals and humans became mere "objects," vessels designed and made by a master craftsman, but devoid of intrinsic divinity.
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stevenyc
Narkissos: Did you mean deism perhaps? A pantheistic "God" would be its own "rules" and "creation," making the latter notions ultimately meaningless.
I wouldn't necessarily say deism, as, in my understanding of deism: by knowing nature we can know / discover God. And, implies the existence of a separate deity.
However, my understanding of pantheism is: the sum of the laws of nature and the universe is God. The same God of Einstein, Feynman, and Hawkin.
I would say that this definition does make those latter notions meaningless, however, I have found that this tack seams to be the closest to any 'common ground' in debate.
steve -
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stevenyc
Vinny, as you say, EVERYTHING has to have a creator, everything has a beginning. So, WHO created God. You can't simply say the universe must have been created, but God couldn't have been created. You are contradicting yourself.
Who created God?
steve -
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Aviator pictures and usernames- Where and why did you choose yours?
by winnie injust curious.
are some of them a personal photo?
ones that are not, why did you choose them?.
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stevenyc
Mine is a picture of me, beside Russell's memorial pyramid, wearing a tee-shirt which says: "I'm with stupid". I'm giving him the finger.
This was taken during my "angry" phase of coming to turns with the after effects of leaving the cult. My purpose there was to piss on his grave. Note: a highly recommended exercise.
I had difficulty finding Rutherford's grave, which was a shame because at the time I had a different 'package' to deliver to him.
My username is stevenyc because my name is steve and I live in NYC.
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Polytheism, Monotheism, Atheism: a logical sequence?
by Narkissos inthe current heated "(monotheist) believers vs. atheists" threads tends to overlook, imo, this rather commonplace but relevant issue: how modern atheism continues (and thus is tributary to) a line of religious, philosophical and scientific thought which runs from ancient polytheism through monotheism, both in greek and jewish traditions (which are the two main sources of western culture).. in the greek-speaking world, homeric-like polytheism went out of fashion, and although political authorities stood for the conservation of popular worship of the gods (atheism being a capital offence, ask socrates), an intellectual monotheism came to the fore, especially in platonic tradition, along with more or less "underground" forms of early atheism (democritus, epicurus).. in judea, for mainly political reasons ("one god, one temple, one priesthood, one king") the "deuteronomistic reform" of the 7th century bc promoted the active rejection (1) of all other gods than yhwh, and (2) of any representation of yhwh himself, henceforth branded as "idolatry".
it also (3) reinterpreted most "natural" features in older israelite religion (linking yhwh, just as baal, with the cycle of seasons, especially the rain and dry seasons, vegetal and animal fertility) into historical (or pseudo-historical) celebrations: the feast of spring became the celebration of the national foundation in the exodus from egypt, etc.
(4) the development of a doctrine of creation, increasingly construed as creatio ex nihilo -- mere "fabrication" of the world out of nothing instead of the older theomachy (struggle between the gods) wrestling for order out of chaos contributed to emptying "nature" of its numinous, sacred or divine presences: the sun, the moon, the stars, vegetables, animals and humans became mere "objects," vessels designed and made by a master craftsman, but devoid of intrinsic divinity.
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stevenyc
Wonderful thread Narkissos,
A noticeable confusion among recent theist / atheist posts is a common misunderstanding of pantheism. If fact, one could say that pantheism can be theistic in many respects; one God who sets the rules and created everything we see, and atheistic; God Jehovah or God Zeus are human constructs and confuse the understanding of nature.
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Atheists, Why the Anger?
by XJW4EVR inok, so you deny the existence of a god, or you lack belief in a god.
my question why do you get so angry over a mythical being?
no one gets as upset over the tooth fairy, santa claus or the easter bunny, as i have seen some of the atheists on this board get over the slightest mention of god.
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stevenyc
Tophat, thanks for your reply.
If it's so easy for you to understand the concept that God wasn't created, how come it's so hard for you to understand that the Universe wasn't created?
steve -
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Quantum Universe
by undercover inan acquaintance was telling me about how there have been some new discoveries in quantum mechanics and that "everything we know is going to change", his words.
he said that these top scientists and physicists have already met with the world's top religious leaders and explained to them what they have discovered and how it will change everyone's perception about reality.. i'm not all that informed on quantum mechanics and all that scientific mumbo-jumbo other than to know that some people believe that there are parallel universes and that it might be possible(?
) that we exist in different universes at the same time.. from what this guy was telling me, i gathered (i think) that reality and our perception of reality is based on nothing tangible except information.
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stevenyc
My guess would be your friend is referring to this: http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v446/n7138/abs/nature05677.html
A recent submission to Nature on how "reality" only exists as a product of observation.
Although this sounds wrong and kooky, I would recommend the wiki on the "two slit experiment" as an example of how quantum mechanics experiments yield unexpected results.
steve -
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Quantum Universe
by undercover inan acquaintance was telling me about how there have been some new discoveries in quantum mechanics and that "everything we know is going to change", his words.
he said that these top scientists and physicists have already met with the world's top religious leaders and explained to them what they have discovered and how it will change everyone's perception about reality.. i'm not all that informed on quantum mechanics and all that scientific mumbo-jumbo other than to know that some people believe that there are parallel universes and that it might be possible(?
) that we exist in different universes at the same time.. from what this guy was telling me, i gathered (i think) that reality and our perception of reality is based on nothing tangible except information.
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stevenyc
What a great thread. I've started studying Calculus again, as I have an interest in Quantum Physics, but, at some point, you need the math.
One of the greatest physicists so far, Richard Feynman, put it this way: "If anyone says they understand quantum physics, they don't understand quantum physics."
I wound recommend anyone with an interest in quantum theory to read his lectures. He had an amazing ability to explain the most complex things to the layman. QED is a good place to start. Also, you can find his lecture for QED at the university of Auckland, NZ, site.
steve -
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Atheists, Why the Anger?
by XJW4EVR inok, so you deny the existence of a god, or you lack belief in a god.
my question why do you get so angry over a mythical being?
no one gets as upset over the tooth fairy, santa claus or the easter bunny, as i have seen some of the atheists on this board get over the slightest mention of god.
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stevenyc
Vinny, a simple question for you:
Who created God ?
steve -
147
Atheists, Why the Anger?
by XJW4EVR inok, so you deny the existence of a god, or you lack belief in a god.
my question why do you get so angry over a mythical being?
no one gets as upset over the tooth fairy, santa claus or the easter bunny, as i have seen some of the atheists on this board get over the slightest mention of god.
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stevenyc
For the sake of clarification, "the fool" mentioned at Psalm 14:1 is not the fool denoted in this discussion.
Footnotes:
1. Psalm 14:1 The Hebrew words rendered fool in Psalms denote one who is morally deficient.
steve