I would venture to guess it has something to do with the fact that the memorial is today.
The last upsurge I noticed was during Christmas.
Welcome all newbies!!!
Check_Your_Premises
JoinedPosts by Check_Your_Premises
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I am noticing an upsurge in newbies: Welcome ALL!!!
by Check_Your_Premises in.
i would venture to guess it has something to do with the fact that the memorial is today.. the last upsurge i noticed was during christmas.. welcome all newbies!!
!.
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Something I want to tell you apostates part II
by LeftBehind into those that remember me i came here to tell you something.what i want to tell you is that you guys were right.
i have been researching the wt since i briefly posted on this board and i have come to the conclusion that the wt is nothing but a man made organization.
i have been researching the wt non stop since december.
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Check_Your_Premises
Congratulations. You chose freedom and truth! Not as easy as it sounds.
Now if you want to help your family, I would recommend being very patient (not easy since you are about to explode), and learn about cults.
There are a couple of books by Steven Hassan, Releasing the Bonds, and Combatting Cult Mind Control. They will help you to understand what happened to you and get rid of any latent cult thinking, guilt, and fear. They will also help you understand how best to help your family.
Until you understand mind control, the truth of the org won't matter to your family.
If you are patient you will get to keep both your sanity and your family!!!
CYP
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Help - I'm in love with a JW!
by LookingIn inand i am not a jw.
from what i gather reading this site that makes me "worldly".
anyway, i am embarrassed to say we are both married and have children.
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Check_Your_Premises
Your comments inspired me to encourage her to do this and tell her I would be happy for her if she is able to reconnect with him, despite my selfish desires.
That is good to hear lookin. That means you actually love her (care about her best interests). Some folks mistake a very strong desire to be with someone as love; that is called being horny.
I am so glad to hear you are considering long term ramifications as well.
I never judged you, and I was a little disappointed in myself that I did not get that acknowledgement from you. I will have to try harder to not sound judgemental.
I always knew this was a VERY complicated situation. It always is. The tough things about REALLY complicated situations is you lose perspective. That is why you always keep just a few rules, that are just written in stone, that you never break. That way no matter upside down your world gets, you always have that point of reference.
Rule written in stone with letters a thousand feet deep: Always look out for the children's best interest!!!
Take care.
CYP
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PLEASE HELP ME!
by UNCLEAR inmy husband and i for the first time had an honest discussion regarding jw doctrines, he believes in the flawlessness of the society, so he is not easy to talk to.
he did agree however that if 607 is not correct that the society has it all wrong.
well to say the least that was an interesting turn of events.
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Check_Your_Premises
Unclear,
I know you do... next time you feel that way, just remember that I am somewhere experiencing the exact same sensation. But this game takes patience.
There was a guy named here as amazing1914. He helped his family leave. He put his story on freeminds.org.
http://www.freeminds.org/psych/exithelp.htm
It is really tough, and takes alot of patience. But the reward is keeping your sanity AND your family intact. Another couple who would be good for you to talk to is Ithinkisee and his wife freedomlover. He is kind of a hero around here. He carefully maneuvered his wife out of the org, and we were here rivited and cheering him every step of the way. Now they are both free, and she is making headway with her family as well!
I know you are about to explode.
patience.
CYP
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Help - I'm in love with a JW!
by LookingIn inand i am not a jw.
from what i gather reading this site that makes me "worldly".
anyway, i am embarrassed to say we are both married and have children.
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Check_Your_Premises
sometimes you can't help who you love
True but irrelevant. Marriage isn't about love. It is a legal contract. The purpose of legal contracts is to protect the interests of all parties.
Despite the wisdom of popular culture, the most important thing in life is not to find romantic love. The most important thing in life is not to "experience all it has to offer". The most important thing in life is honor, doing what is right (unto others), and living for a purpose higher than yourself.
"Those who seek truth may find comfort. Those who seek comfort will find neither comfort nor truth."
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Help - I'm in love with a JW!
by LookingIn inand i am not a jw.
from what i gather reading this site that makes me "worldly".
anyway, i am embarrassed to say we are both married and have children.
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Check_Your_Premises
There is an upside Gregor... this guy won't have to deal with Christmas's and Birthdays and stuff. I swear that stuff ages my divorced folks like nothing else!
But you still end up dealing with your ex-spouse for the rest of your days. When you have kids, there is just no way around that.
CYP
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Help - I'm in love with a JW!
by LookingIn inand i am not a jw.
from what i gather reading this site that makes me "worldly".
anyway, i am embarrassed to say we are both married and have children.
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Check_Your_Premises
Ok, fair enough Look... now that I have said my peace about the kids... however you choose to rationalize it.
Now on to the other reasons this is a very bad idea.
What you need to understand about her faith is that it is VERY difficult to be involved with someone who is a member. Do you plan to have children with her? That will complicate things more than you can possible imagine.
The reason why is because a jw carries with them the myth of certainty. They are right! Theirs is the right way! I am sure you can see why this is a very toxic attitude. It taints all interactions with others. You simply are not respected because you are so obviously wrong. There is no compromise with a jw.
Now you or her will likely say "shouldn't a person be absolutely certain in their faith?" No. Because "doubts complete faith, and keep it from becoming fanaticism". The best you can say is your faith has always withstood scrutiny and the light of new facts. But all people are equally capable of being delusional. No matter how smart. No matter how knowledgeable. When a JW clings to their myth of absolute certainty, they are denying this aspect of their humanity. They are saying only you can be delusional. As you can imagine, it makes for a very obnoxious and disrespectful person.
Next you need to understand that the jw is an abusive religion. I don't care or have any problem with what they or anybody else believes. I have a problem with how this religion behaves. Anytime you have people trying to control other people, you are VERY likely going to have an abusive situation. Abuse means that their behavior works to undermine a person's confidence in themselves and their ability to control their own life. They do this so that the group can have more control. The jw is a HIGHLY controlling religion. If all you hope for comes true, your entire life will be wrapped up in someone who is controlled by other people. You will always be second fiddle. Things will be easier in your marriage if you join as well... if that is your bag.
Sorry, you aren't happy in your current marriage. This woman is probably not the answer. If her being a jw was the ONLY thing I would still recommend that you run. I know that isn't what you want to hear. I am married to one and it totally sucks. You can see I am not a bigot, or bitter, or suffering from misplaced anger. I have very legitimate reasons for saying the things I do.
But you asked about the children's spirituality didn't you. Well spirituality in the jw religion is tied inextricably to the religion itself. What I mean to say is they think they are the only right religion. There is no salvation or relationship with God without the religion. The religion is the "way, the truth, and the life, no man comes to the Father but by" them. Frankly, if something helps them to not tie their relationship with God and salvation to imperfect men I would say it is a good thing. A conversation might be preferable method over destroying their family, but that is just my opinion.
Take care Look. I hope you make some good decisions. I hope you see I am not here to give you a bunch of crap. I love you and your family as well as the family of your jw sweety. I just want was is in all of your (but mostly the kid's) best interests. I hope all your choices are consistent with those interests.
CYP
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Help - I'm in love with a JW!
by LookingIn inand i am not a jw.
from what i gather reading this site that makes me "worldly".
anyway, i am embarrassed to say we are both married and have children.
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Check_Your_Premises
I have no idea what is going on in your marriage or your personal life.
Yup Serendipity, that is why I started with the above.
But I gave it to this guy hard on what exactly it will mean to his kids.
I am not judging. Hell, I let my family get caught up in a cult!!! Who am I to judge? I am just imparting information.
About the hardest thing you can ever do is figure out a marriage from the outside. Hell, it is pretty tough to figure out on the inside!!!
But all I care about is what is best for the kids. Adults always come second.
CYP
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Help - I'm in love with a JW!
by LookingIn inand i am not a jw.
from what i gather reading this site that makes me "worldly".
anyway, i am embarrassed to say we are both married and have children.
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Check_Your_Premises
Ok first of all, I am the son of a man who had an affair and divorced my mother when I was five, my sister was 8, and my brother was 12. So you will get the advantage of knowing how it will effect all of those age brackets.
He moved out on my fifth birthday.
So think of me, as your kids and her kids about 25 years from now. I am the person they will become.
I have no idea what is going on in your marriage or your personal life. But your and her children did not have anything to do with the situation you are both in. They did not ask to be born. They deserve to grow up in an intact home.
Your sons will likely grow up without the full influence that they need from their father to be a man. I wonder how much time you are spending with them now, since you are obviously very caught up in your own extra-marital love life. However much time you do spend with them, you will be spending less. Sons who grow up without dads have a very hard time. They just have a hole in them that never gets filled, and they don't even know why. They just can't seem to compete with all the other boys whose dad stuck around to teach them how to be a man instead of leaving their mom for some other woman. They don't realize why, and just seem to think there is somethign wrong with them. They usually end up expressing their manhood in the only ways they can think of, by being violent and promiscuous. It takes a long time to learn, if ever, that being a man means taking responsibility for your family. Luckily I learned it on my own. I love my dad. In alot of ways I am proud of him. But in other ways I am very ashamed of him. I had to forgive him all over again when I had my own kids. Now that I am a MAN and I take care of my family like a MAN, I had to accept and forgive him to the extent that he wasn't.
Now let's talk about daughters without fathers. They, like sons, will have less time than they already have with their very pre-occupied father. Girls are funny, in that they NEED affection from daddy. They need that love like they need air. If they don't get it, they will seek it out elsewhere. Unfortunately that will be in the arms of some young, hormonal boy. Also, since she won't think alot of herself, which is because she will figure she wasn't worth your love, she will tend to pick guys who don't love her either. IT will be her mission in life to fix her relationship with you via finding some bastard and trying to get him to love her. He never will. She moves on from bastard to bastard. She gets screwed over again and again. All cuz daddy didn't love her.
Now let's talk about who your spouse ends up with. Their new step dad is going to be raising your kids part time, and unfortunately these fellas are often pedophiles!!! Pedophiles LOVE to marry women with kids. Obviously dad is to preoccupied to make sure the kids are safe, and mom is so wigged and traumatized over her husband leaving her, she often goes into denial and turns a blind eye to her own children's torment.
Now that is just your children and her children. The problem is that with all the fun little pathologies you and your little jw squeeze have given them cuz you were in love, they will have their children under less than ideal circumstances. They will pass on all this fun to their children. So keep in mind. You aren't just messing with the lives of your children. You are messing with their children. You are likely relegating entire branches of your family tree to the trailer park or worse.
Now let's talk about you, since I fear that is who you are most concerned with. You are going to lose at least half your stuff. You will be paying ALOT of money for support every month. I know guys who pay 40% of their takehome for two kids! Moral of the story... it's cheaper to keep her.
Isn't this fun! Isn't your little love affair worth all this!!!
Sorry dude. I don't mean to sound judgemental. And I actually am not. I have my own problems and I have made my own mistakes. But please think about what you are doing. When you become a father, you become second fiddle. Your children become the most important thing. They deserve no less. I just don't want you to put your kids through what I went through. I gave it to you hard and fast, because I know the little head is doing all the thinking. It is the only thing that might work, and I know that won't be enough.
But please. Quit banging this jw lady, go home, and try to make things work there.
If you don't beleive me, ask my old man! He is a lonely old guy, who spends all his time wishing he could go back. He constantly begs my forgiveness. He has it. But not my respect. It sure has been a tough road. I sure wish he had just whacked off or something.
CYP
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PLEASE HELP ME!
by UNCLEAR inmy husband and i for the first time had an honest discussion regarding jw doctrines, he believes in the flawlessness of the society, so he is not easy to talk to.
he did agree however that if 607 is not correct that the society has it all wrong.
well to say the least that was an interesting turn of events.
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Check_Your_Premises
Unclear,
It sounds like your become less unclear. It seems like you have had a very strong moment of clarity regarding the jw. I have seen many jws' show up on this board with doubts and go through a "rapid decompression".
Naturally you want your spouse to join you. You of all people understand how difficult it can be for a jw married to a non-jw. You have seen those relationships at work many times I am sure.
It is also natural to assume that the best way to help your spouse exit is to simply point out what is wrong with the JW teachings.
Makes logical sense.
The only problem is that logic has nothing to do with it. It is likely that you will make the problem worse, by causing your husband to lose trust in you!!!
Despite you recent awakenings, what you might not understand, realize, or appreciate is the power of mind control. That is what you were under. That is why you had doubts and contrary thoughts for years, but were only now able to accept them.
If I was you I would first try to understand CULTS. Try to understand mind control. Learn about how to talk to someone under the influence of mind control
I would recommend Combatting Cult Mind Control and/or Releasing the Bonds by Steven Hassan. These books will show you how to go about helping someone who is under the influence of mind control.
my 2 cents.
CYP