Posts by bennyk

15

Female presenter on JW Video

by Listener in

there is a video on jw org titled "what happens at a kingdom hall?

" i wouldn't suggest that you watch it as it's pretty sickly, as usual they are praying on emotions in order to encourage people to attend their halls.. the video is presented by a female but does show her face.

it just seems weird that they have allowed a woman to star in this very prominant role.

bennyk

Don't worry. The "sister" was wearing a head-covering...

5

Charles Russell Quote Request - Only Called Christian?

by Koskoskos in

i so clearly remember reading a quote from charles russell where he was asked which denomination he belonged to and replied that the only name he goes by is 'christian'.

but i can't find the quote anywhere!.

would anyone happen to know where it is located?.

bennyk

“ Ques. Please let me know by what name you people call yourselves? What denomination?

Ans. We are strictly unsectarian, and consequently recognize no sectarian name, believing with Paul, (read 1 Cor. 3:1-4) that where one saith I am of Paul, and I of Apollos, or I am a Baptist, or I a Methodist, etc., it is an evidence of carnality, and consequently in opposition to the Spirit of Christ. Did Paul or Apollos die for us? If so, let us call ourselves theirs. Were we baptized into the Methodist, Presbyterian, Baptist, or other denominational churches? If so, we are members of it, and should be properly recognized by those names. But if we were baptized into the one body or church of which Jesus is the one and only Head, then we are members in particular of his body, and the only name appropriate would be his; Scripturally called the "Church of Christ," "Christians," "Church of the first born," and such like general names. Again we would remark that ours is the only Scriptural basis of Christian union, viz.: We have no creed (fence) to bind us together or to keep others out of our company. The Bible is our only standard, and its teachings our only creed, and recognizing the progressive character of the unfolding of Scriptural truths, we are ready and prepared to add to or modify our creed (faith--belief) as we get increase of light from our Standard.

We are in fellowship with all Christians in whom we can recognize the Spirit of Christ, and especially with those who recognize the Bible as the only standard. We do not require, therefore, that all shall see, just as we do in order to be called Christians; realizing that growth in both grace and knowledge is a gradual process. Nor do we see reason to expect that any but the watchmen of Zion will "see eye to eye" (Isa. 52:8) until that which is perfect is come, when that which is in part shall be done away. (1 Cor. 13:10.)

If all Christians were to thus free themselves of prescribed creeds, and study the Word of God without denominational bias, truth and knowledge and real Christian fellowship and unity, would result. The Spirit of the Head would pervade the unfettered members of the body, and sectarian pride would vanish. Thus we believe, thus we practice, and thus we teach. It becomes our duty to denounce sectarianism and the God-dishonoring creeds of men which, while contradicting each other, unite in misrepresenting God's Word and character.”

(Zion's Watch Tower April 1882 [WTR p.344])

45

Lying about Shunning! jw.org conceals the "truth"

by Skinnedsheep in

jw
friends

http://www.jw.org/en/jehovahs-witnesses/faq/shunning/ .

"those who were baptized as jehovahs witnesses but no longer preach to others, perhaps even drifting away from association with fellow believers, are not shunned.

in fact, we reach out to them and try to rekindle their spiritual interest.".

bennyk

"[We] might be tempted to mention only selected details, editing them to color the facts. Hence, what we say might technically be true yet give a totally different impression. While this may not be flagrant lying, such as is common in the world today, is it really 'speaking truth each one with his neighbor,' or brother? (Ephesians 4:15,25; 1 Timothy 2:1,2) When a Christian phrases things in such a way that he inwardly knows is leading brothers to a wrong conclusion, to believe something that is really not true, not accurate, how do you think God feels?" (Live With Jehovah's Day In Mind, p.115)

Hypocrites!

22

Quick, answer this question: What was the meaning behind: MILLIONS NOW LIVING WILL NEVER DIE?

by Terry in

pay attention to what you are told, and how it is presented.. what is the actual message being communicated?

what is the intention behind it?.

this 128-page book millions now living will never die, was placed with the people on a contribution of 25c a copy.. .

bennyk

Sorry to hijack, but where /when did Rutherford say he'd made an ass out of himself, and is it a source you could quote to another witness without coming over all apostate!?

"...Rutherford quit predicting dates. In fact, referring to that prophetic failure he later admitted, 'I made an ass of myself.'" (The Watchtower, 01. October 1984, p. 24)

40

I got asked THE QUESTION !!

by Tech49 in

a little experience that happened very recently:.

another brother, an elder, and i were talking, i was explaining to him and giving him several examples of how a couple of the elders in our congregation were blatantly trying to run their own show, parading themselves around as "representatives" of the body, when the other brothers didnt know what the hell they were talking about.

they are using their "elder powers" to bully and push people around, causing a bit of angst and hurt feelings.

bennyk

Ah... The QUESTION.

Eight years ago two Elders met with me because they were "concerned" about the fact that I had entirely (and abruptly) ceased meeting attendance. Using Watch Tower literature, I had just discussed with them a number of discrepancies [read: "lies"] in the Society's historical claims. I asked how these things could be so -- how the Society could publish such things...

They asked: "But you still believe that the [Watch Tower] Society is God's Organisation, right?"

I answered: "I can not unequivocally state that it is. That is the significance of my concerns regarding the Society's claims. It devolves on you Brothers to provide me with a reasonable answer."

As of today, they have not given an answer (reasonable or otherwise). They also have not announced me as DF'd/DA'd. Your milage may vary.

11

Why did the WT writers switch the people in the GENERATION from the general population to ' The Anointed?

by prologos in

what is your theory on the reason that prompted that?

the intend?

the hoped-for outcome?.

bennyk

Two problems, Joe.

The Watch Tower Society taught that the End Times began in 1799 until 1929.

More importantly: What of Luke 21:28? "As these things start to occur, raise yorselves erect and lift YOUR heads up, because YOUR deliverance is getting near." Are there any Witnesses alive who saw 'these things' start to occur? Could anyone honestly claim that the deliverance of anyone alive in 1914 proved to be near?

It really doesn't matter what the Watch Tower Society's interpretation of the word "generation" is -- 1914 could not mark the start of 'these things', because the deliverance did not prove to be near.

31

JW teachings that have remained the same

by Splash in

teachings that have remained the samewhen you highlight the continual ebb and flow of changing teachings, a jw may refer you to the long held teachings which have never changed.

core doctrines such as the importance of using gods name, and the trinity, hellfire and immortality of the soul all being false.

but even here things are not as simple as they could be:.

bennyk

Actually, even the Watch Tower society's "core teachings" regarding soul sleep and the trinity have been significantly altered, in that said beliefs were once considered non-essential. Behold the following Watch Tower article from 01. August 1913 (Watch Tower Reprints p. 5284):

DOCTRINES MORE OR LESS IMPORTANT

THERE are certain features of the doctrine of Christ which are fundamental and indispensable, and without which none would be recognized of the Lord as one of His followers. There are other features which would seem to be useful, helpful, blessed, but not fundamental--not essential to membership in the Body of Christ. The fundamentals have been enjoyed by good, saintlyones from the Day of Pentecost until now.

We, the same class now, have the same fundamentals, and are permitted to have other privileges, truths, "meat in due season," for our strengthening. These latter are not necessarily essential to our membership in the Body of Christ; otherwise our forefathers who did not have themwould not have been members of Christ, and there would have been no Christ Body for centuries.

The fundamental theory of the Atonement is as follows:

(1) All men--all of Adam's children--are sinners.

(2) None can be reconciled to God without a Redeemer's sacrifice.

(3) Jesus came into the world to be that Sacrifice-- and later to apply that Ransom-price for the sins of the world.

(4) On the basis of faith in the Redeemer's work, the believer may consecrate himself to the Divine service, in acceptance of the Divine invitation, "Present your bodies a living sacrifice."

(5) So doing, the believer may--up to the time of the completion of the Elect number--exercise full assurance of faith that his sacrifice will be accepted of the Father; and that he will receive a share of the anointing of the Holy Spirit--the begetting.

(6) Such as meet these conditions are to be accepted as brethren in the highest sense of the term. This much would seem to have been always necessary, and more than this we believe is not necessary today. But if by reason of our favorable day we have more knowledge, we may also have corresponding trials, which our greater knowledge will offset.

Our advice to the Lord's dear people everywhere is that they put no yoke upon each other, beyond the fundamentals specified above--that otherwise they stand free, and leave each other free, and fellowship and agree as much as they can with each other.

53

GOVERNING BODY PATTERNS OF DECEPTION

by Terry in

jw
friends

pattern of excuses.

" zion's watch tower 1894 jul 15 p.226.

(compare isaiah 8:11-13.

bennyk

Example #9

BLAME GOD

"Stirring up increasing interest in them, Jehovah caused to be preached from 1918 onward the startling public message 'Millions Now Living Will Never Die,' and in 1923 he provided the interpretation of 'the parable of the sheep and the goats' " (Watchtower, Nov. 15, 1955, p. 698 § 36)

22 As Jehovah revealed his truths by means of the first-century Christian congregation so he does today by means of the present-day Christian congregation. Through this agency he is having carried out prophesying on an intensified and unparalleled scale. All this activity is not an accident. Jehovah is the one behind all of it. The abundance of spiritual food and the amazing details of Jehovah’s purposes that have been revealed to Jehovah’s anointed witnesses are clear evidence that they are the ones mentioned by Jesus when he foretold a “faithful and discreet slave” class that would be used to dispense God’s progressive revelations in these last days. Of this class Jesus said: “Truly I say to you, He will appoint him over all his belongings.”-Matt. 24:47. (Watchtower, 15. June 1964 p. 365 § 22)

30

Would JWs Really Drink The Kool Aid?

by minimus in

jw
friends

if push came to shove and it was a showdown for loyalty to the organization or not following whatever decrees coming heir way, what percentage would remain loyal to the organization?

.

bennyk

[old post 13.05.2010]

It is not a likely scenario. However, purely as idle musing...

What is published in The Watchtower is viewed by many Witnesses as the very words of Almighty God. The directives of the Governing Body are viewed as "Law" by many/most Elders. The Society has been very adroitly conditioning its followers to accept its interpretations unhesitatingly. Those who are viewed as "strong" Witnesses are those who question nothing.

The Society would first need to prune the Witness ranks of people who would vocalize their doubts regarding the Society's teachings and directives. The silly interpretation of the "Generation" would be followed by other such nonsense designed to remove independent thinkers. The Society would also need to pare the number of "weak" (nominal) Witnesses who could derail the scheme by their reluctance to follow the Society's every command.

The remaining Witnesses would be conditioned over a period of time to accept the idea that faithful death is preferable to life in "Satan's System of Things." Watchtower articles would revisit such scriptures as Psalms 116:15 ("Precious in the eyes of Jehovah is the death of his loyal ones.") and Luke 9:24 ("For whoever wants to save his soul will lose it; but whoever loses his soul for my sake is the one who will save it.")

Then, when extreme world conditions warrant it (war, pestilence, famine), an announcement would be made that all Witnesses (and only Witnesses -- the Faithful--) would be meeting on a specific day for a most special declaration of New Light from the Governing Body.

On that day, the CoBE would read an official letter from the Society stating that 'the Faithful Slave now understands that the Great Crowd's coming out of the Great Tribulation (Rev. 7:14) will occur today!!! The New Light given by Jehovah is that the "New Heavens and New Earth" of Revelation 21:1 are literal and already existing, and that Jehovah's people will be spared the evil coming upon the entire inhabited earth by being "transferred" as was Enoch. "And Enoch was no more, for God took him."!!! (Gen. 6:24).

Game over.

My speculation (based solely on my relatives and the people in the congregation I last attended): 20% of current Witnesses would drink...

64

Speculation: Female Ministerial Servants coming soon

by Londo111 in

ive no source for this, just personal speculation.. * there is a good case to be made that there were female deacons (ministerial servants) in the bible.. * there is a lack of qualified brothers for basic assignments such as microphones, accounts, literature.

in some cases, elders have had to do double duty because of a lack of ministerial servants or qualified brothers.. * women outnumber men in the organization.. * there is supposedly a surprising change coming "down the pipe".. perhaps the only difference between male and female ministerial servants is that women will still not be allowed to teach..

bennyk

"I commend to YOU Phoebe our sister, who is a minister of the congregation in Cenchreae..." (Romans 16:1 NWT)