Posts by Layla33

25

Do we have a need for conflict?

by wings in

jw
friends

seems like the more contentious discussions on the board just go around and around the same tree.

those who have faith in god are delusional, simple minded, or even mentally ill...?.

those who don't believe in god are narrow minded, 2 dimensional, and are missing out on something great...?.

Layla33

I am a conflict theorist, I believe conflict brings about virtue. I first studied Erik Erikson many years ago when he discussed the conflict theory in regards to personality formation and development and I tend to look at the entire process of life and thought processes as conflicts.

You believe one thing, then there is a conflict within yourself or a conflict that someone has brought to you. The two ideas battle with each other until you resolve it and find a virtue.

I think conflict is an important and necessary part of life, all great thinkers, all revolutionaries were conflict thinkers. They challenged the status quo and changed the course of humanity in the process.

In life, with people with different ideas, different backgrounds, different beliefs, we "crash", there is bound to be "conflict" and that is why even with those that I totally disagreed with, I have learned something even if it is just about myself. I value it.

30

How do I get over my Family treating me Like an Outcast

by moonpie in

hello, i've been disfellowshipped for almost six years and it's still hard not being able to communicate with them.

i talk to my mom once a week, but my dad won't pick up the phone to talk to me.

i have 3 brothers and 6 sisters.

Layla33

Moonpie,

You are absolutely not a bad person for feeling like you do. Something normal, such as a love and communication of your family has been disrupted, and it takes time to come to terms with it. I don't think it will ever truly make sense, but you can make peace with it. There are so many people here that even though intellectually they understand the terms of KH and WTS, it is heartbreaking when their own parents and siblings will not acknowledge them.

I was DFd 18 years ago. For the most part, I didn't truly suffer the loss of my family's involvement. I did however lose privileges of family dinners, anniversaries and such. When both my grandparents had huge 50th Wedding Anniversaries, I was not invited, it slightly hurt because of course everyone talked about it for years.

But through meditation and realization of my life, I made peace with the facets of imperfection that exist, things I can not change, I have accepted and the truth is I haven't been happier. I could beat myself up over it, or I could learn to deal with the life I was given, in all its imperfections.

I think going through the process is good, there are people that have wrote letters and mailed them, as a way to deal with it, and then moved on. Sometimes even writing a letter that you may never send, but just to get out your pain and hurt may help, having a good cry and then being with friends that truly love and support you helps. I think this board is a wonderful place to share such things and make peace with it in the process.

73

Bottom Line: What Does This New Meeting Arrangement Really Mean?

by minimus in

jw
friends

Layla33

Honestly, I really don't know and it doesn't affect me personally. I just like to read it because as this whole fear/guilt apocalypse theme reaches a pinnacle, I want to be prepared/informed if anyone in my family starts discussing it with me.

63

Could religious belief be considered a sign of mental illness?

by nicolaou in

religious believers clearly have tendencies to make-up "facts" and "evidence" rather than accept true research and admit even the simplest of belief failures.

they have strange ceremonies that are virtually pointless but are said to have special significance or power.. we all know certain 'christians' alive today who are fully prepared to argue that they might never die!

couldn't it be argued that such a reversion into childlike fantasy is a telltale sign of mental illness?

Layla33

Each man's creates his own reality.

Someone tells us that this person is color-blind because they call red blue and blue red and we believe it. Maybe we are the ones that are color blind.

Someone told us what is rational and real, we grab a hold of it and went with it.

People that can think existentially, can understand that there are variations of beliefs, some based on tangible things, some things not.

There are things that scientists study that are not seen to the mind's eye, but based on expressed associations, they can name it, and watch its behaviors.

There are no black and whites here, there are opinons and variations of such.

Being too of anything can be a sign of OCD, can be a sign of letting someone control your thoughts. I was just watching this great video of a guy that got out of Scientology, and he was talking about the Tom Cruise video and how to people inside Scientology it was perfectly normal, to people outside Scientology, it was bordering insane. Does that mean that Tom Cruise is isane or just a victim of an untrue and harmful cult mentality? There needs to be a very clear distinction here.

63

Could religious belief be considered a sign of mental illness?

by nicolaou in

religious believers clearly have tendencies to make-up "facts" and "evidence" rather than accept true research and admit even the simplest of belief failures.

they have strange ceremonies that are virtually pointless but are said to have special significance or power.. we all know certain 'christians' alive today who are fully prepared to argue that they might never die!

couldn't it be argued that such a reversion into childlike fantasy is a telltale sign of mental illness?

Layla33

Belief is an admission there are no facts of proof.

I am going to disagree with this statement. Faith is an admission there are no facts of proof.

You can have a belief, which is an idea about a certain things whether it is substantiated or unsubstantiated. I carry a belief that when the sky is gray and I hear thunder it will most likely rain. I have a belief that if you put your hand in a flame, you will get burned. (Substantiated)

I have faith that while I can't see something, I think believe/think it exists. (Unsubstantiated)

Since I consider myself an amateur philosopher, I found this interesting:

The relationship between belief and knowledge is subtle. Believers in a claim typically say that they know that claim. For instance, those who believe that the Sun is a god will report that they know that the Sun is a god. However, the terms belief and knowledge are used differently by philosophers.

Epistemology is the philosophical study of knowledge and belief. A primary problem for epistemology is exactly what is needed in order for us to have knowledge. In a notion derived from Plato's dialogue Theaetetus, philosophy has traditionally defined knowledge as justified true belief. The relationship between belief and knowledge is that a belief is knowledge if the belief is true, and if the believer has a justification (reasonable and necessarily plausible assertions/evidence/guidance) for believing it is true.

A false belief is not considered to be knowledge, even if it is sincere. A sincere believer in the flat earth theory does not know that the Earth is flat. Similarly, a truth that nobody believes is not knowledge, because in order to be knowledge, there must be some person who knows it.

Later epistemologists have questioned the "justified true belief" definition, and some philosophers have questioned whether "belief" is a useful notion at all.

Jason Beghe discuss his experience with Scientology

by Layla33 in

jw
friends

http://xenutv.wordpress.com/2008/04/21/jason-beghe-interview/.

i am finding this interview fantastic and it just a very interesting watch and read.. i see us as ex jws getting around, entertainer and not, discussing this in a group setting and passing it on..

Layla33

http://xenutv.wordpress.com/2008/04/21/jason-beghe-interview/

I am finding this interview fantastic and it just a very interesting watch and read.

I see us as ex JWs getting around, entertainer and not, discussing this in a group setting and passing it on.

21

OK, so I revised the letter mostly becasue of Scottsman... please read

by dawg in

jw
friends

dad, .

since our time on this planet is short, i wanted to take a moment and tell you that you were the person that i loved more than any other person in the world.

nothing has made me sadder than the events that have surrounded this last year; events that were years in the making yet in my mind were unavoidable.

Layla33

Dawg, it's a good letter (if you can describe something this sad as good). But if it's returned without being opened as others have been, I'd still suggest that you send the postcard saying "i love you" as it's very clear from both your letters that despite how hurt you are, you love him. My dad died before I left the JWs and I know he would have behaved just like yours has and I'm kind of relieved that I was spared it.
All the best at finding closure.

I agree with this statement above ^^^^. You wrote it, you poured your heart into it, you said what needed to be said, whether he responds or not, let it be part of your path, make peace with the reality of your life, find closure in this situation - no matter how long it may take, and know you have done the right thing.

One thing I have learned in this life is that we can't walk the path of enlightenment for other people and they can't walk it for us, we just have to "walk it". Find peace within yourself and enjoy this life you have. I wish you well.

63

Could religious belief be considered a sign of mental illness?

by nicolaou in

religious believers clearly have tendencies to make-up "facts" and "evidence" rather than accept true research and admit even the simplest of belief failures.

they have strange ceremonies that are virtually pointless but are said to have special significance or power.. we all know certain 'christians' alive today who are fully prepared to argue that they might never die!

couldn't it be argued that such a reversion into childlike fantasy is a telltale sign of mental illness?

Layla33

Mentall illness is a huge umbrella of terms. Have you been depressed? Well that's a mental illness. Have you had a cold? Well that's a physical illness.

There are levels, extremes, long term, short term, etc...to take on such a huge subject matter, there needs to be qualifications, because qualifying your statements so they are not misunderstood is important.

Does anyone remember some years ago when there was a group of people who believed they were a part of some cult that were to meet a mother ship of some kind (forgive me, I don't have the full record, in front of me), who got rid of their sexual parts, and then took poison based on the alert of some star around the sun?

There is something called mass hysteria, mass delusions, group dynamic studies show how people can be molded by distorted ideas and ideology and lead to irrational ideas about oneself and others.

In religion, it is very likely that people can be influenced to think irrationally based on unfounded and unqualified things which can lead to distorted behavior and distorted views. It is not an absolute, one has to learn to separate the levels of mental illness and underestand exactly what someone is saying.

I fear that whenever people discuss mental illness they relie solely on extremes such a schizoprenia, severe paranoia, etc when in actually people may have a bout of mental illness, get treatement and move on. I would continue but I am in the middle of something, but I wanted to contribute to this topic.

31

The Whining on this Site

by easyreader1970 in

this is sort of a response to lex talonis' message but i thought it warranted a separate topic.

i am both offended and encouraged by his suggestion that most of us here are just whiners.

i think it is encouraging that he wants the watchtower society's mentally damaging message stopped.

Layla33

Oh I don't know, I think people are entitled to speak their minds on a situation that has caused them angst. Venting and whining, is very subjective and up to the person reading. If it doesn't suite me to read it, I just scroll past it, it's not that big a deal to me.

You would hope that at some point, instead of being bogged down with the disappointments of this religion, that one moves past it to other facets of life, but who are we to walk someone's path? I think exchanges, sharing opinions and dialoguing is part of that process...

25

you can never have too much toilet paper

by wings in

jw
friends

that is if you have 8 females in the house.

recently i had a wonderful experience.

my step daughter and granddaughter (3 yrs old) flew in to see me from hawaii.

Layla33

What a wonderful happy family picture. I love to see families happy. Very sweet.