Posts by JWdaughter

50

What were the calculations used to arrive at the 1874 date of Christ's return?

by Zoos in

we all know the calculations used by the wt to arrive at 1914. fall of babylon in 607 (false year), gentile times, no zero year, ta-da, 1914.. what did they use before that?

i know it wasn't russell who came up with it - he just adopted it.

i'm just curious what they had to explain away when they made the transition.. .

JWdaughter

I see where Scooby was coming from. Russell WAS speculating, but out of a sincerity, perhaps. Rutherford was just about running the show and manipulating everyone to get what he wanted, from what I have observed of his writings, his actions and reports of his character.

So, it is worse than speculation-even of making dubious(delusional?) claims to be being led by God. Rutherford was not just speculating and his sins in the org were not based in delusion or even really bad math! He was just playing people. Speculation wrongs are the least of his wrongs against JWs (bible students!).

22

Series Of Tragedies Continues Among Jehovah's Witnesses In Washington State

by qua in

do these things including the sending of convicted pedophiles door-to-door upset you too?

then why not make contribution checks payable to silentlambs at silentlambs, po box 311, calvert city, ky 42029.

imagine, for every revealing article that hits the paper there may be ninety-nine that stay untold.

JWdaughter

That Curtis Thompson, so nicely attending meetings in 2003 then went out and raped and killed a few women in 2004.

Being a JW is not a cure for any ills. He was originally released in part to the support of the JW community who vouched for his change. Nice, huh? An article about the trial to premanently keephimoff the streets at a sex offender prison in WA state explained that they did not commit him to the place after "church members begged the jury to give him a chance to prove he had turned his life around."

57

Couple questions....like if JW's not the right way then what is?

by world in

jw
friends

new member here so don't attack :d here is a couple questions i have been contemplating lately.. .

if jw isn't the right religion, then which one is?

or is it basically believe in god, the bible and you'll be fine?.

JWdaughter

Welcome. As to what is right and wrong. If you trust in God and recognize that the WTS is corrupted as much as any other organization, then I would suggest you fade into inactivity and separate your inner self from the org. I recognize that with family that it is not that simple, but hear me out.

If you were in a pig pen, filthy, would you need to decide what to wear before you showered off the manure and mud and slop from yourself? Do you not rather think you'd be better off for a bit clothed in nothing more than a clean dry towel (or NOTHING) than to have the manure dripping in your eyes, nose, mouth and ears?

Get out of the muck and then rethink. You don't need a corrupt organization to worship God. Or even a good one. First remove yourself fromwhat you know is wrong and then you will have a better view of what is right.

It is better to be free of the org completely before you make some commitment to another church or religion. Then it becomes (to everyone) as if you were seduced away by the "Baptists, Muslims, Jews", but what is worse is that you will second guess yourself and end up (likely) church/faith hopping while you question yourself and your own motivations. Definitely you will go to others, but don't commit yourself. Don't be trapped by the idea that it is all or nothing. If you are going to have faith in God, develop it independent of group think or peer pressure. You don't have to be RIGHT about what you think all the time. If you actually put your confidence in God as a merciful creator, then you don't need to be proving theological points all the time. Your church doctrine is a little bit important,but the spirit of the place is what shows who they are and what they believe.

Get to know the Jesus of the Bible and other works that offer insight. If you want to be like him and you want to be with people like him, don't worry if they are perfect, see if they are trying to actually emulate him, not that they are interpreting him all the time. What he said and did is clear and filled with love. Find people that want to spread that kind of stuff around-not people who are really busy proving theat their doctrinal stance is better than anyone elses.

I think that people who really serve God or who love Jesus have no resemblance to JWs-who claim that charity is wasted time and effort. Passing out literature and giving canned speaches is NOT what early christianity was about.

I am a Muslim and I saw christians who were after Gods' heart. A couple of them are JWs. Most were not. Some don't go to church or even claim to be Christians. There are people who truly are after the heart of God and they are not doing so because they are in an organization.

You could just be a really nice agnostic until you figure out what you actually believe vs what you were told to believe all these years.

All the best to you and yours.

I have a question for an actual JW. Are you allowed to drink or eat the seasonal offerings at Starbucks? You know the chestnut and peppermint and cranberry stuff? Or is their very consumption pushing some border of JW behavior? Would ordering a peppermint latte and cranberry bliss bar get you any spiritual counseling or just high blood sugars? My starbucks email keeps going on about the 12 days of coffee so it made me wonder. . .

50

What were the calculations used to arrive at the 1874 date of Christ's return?

by Zoos in

we all know the calculations used by the wt to arrive at 1914. fall of babylon in 607 (false year), gentile times, no zero year, ta-da, 1914.. what did they use before that?

i know it wasn't russell who came up with it - he just adopted it.

i'm just curious what they had to explain away when they made the transition.. .

JWdaughter

I did not even know about that 2 year speculation (regarding how long it took to sin). I guess once I figured out the basic BS of that one, I moved on without reading about more details. Thanks. It actually demonstrates how much they were "wildly speculating"

88

Why JW marriage is a huge problem for the organization.

by kneehighmiah in

jw
friends

the difficulty of finding a marriage mate is well known for sisters.

but i would say it's hard for brothers also.

i was talking to a jw last night.

JWdaughter

Beauty IS in the eye of the beholder, and the reason why all the JWs that are single seem unattractive is that their JW essense is to you, (or whoever) just unattractive! Not about looks, but about whether a whole person 'attracts' another person. It is easy to see the "pretty" in a person who is unavailable. Most of us can observe the pretty face and move on, dismissing them. When a person meets a prospective mate, 'attractive'is about a lot more than looks.

JWs don't like JWs. They don't want to be married to one. They may not even like themselves. They probably think they are unworthy of anyone as good as they want in anycase. If the brothers you know are not seeeing any attractive single sisters, it is because they simply don't want to be married to a JW. Objectively, there are a lot of pretty single JW women. And men. And froggy ones, too. But what sane person wants to marry into that mess?

A pretty,yet pious JW is kind of like a frosted turd. And while we often make wrong decisions with marriage mates, most have SOME instincts for survival. Being a JW destroys the sense of self and destroys our trust and faith in others to have anything good in them, either. It is the guilty folks that suspect others of dishonesty the most. Same principle applies. NOt about actual guilt, but the sense that we are just unworthy and undeserving of anything good. You get told that enough, you believe it.

21

DEMONS: the torment I suffered

by Terry in

jw
friends

when i was in my teens i wanted a room of my own, but i lived with my grandparents whose house was very small.. my uncle had been living in a little one room bed-sitter way out in the backyard.

he married and moved away and i moved in.. it was quite isolated and the ceiling was six feet from the floor.

unfortunately, the top of my head was four inches higher than that!

JWdaughter

I'm so glad of my natural pragmatism. Never had monster under the bed or in the closet or any demons tormenting me. That didn't seem logical to me-ever.

The BAD part of that is that I am naturally skeptical of anyone having a bad intention. Why would they? I'm a nice person and would never do things for a mean purpose! This has skewed my judgement and caused me not to be very strategic when it would serve me well to be a little skeptical.

40

Here we go again. The next hate letter from our 2nd Son.

by Still Totally ADD in

jw
friends

yes it happen again with our youngest son.

this last monday we got a letter from him telling us how unloving we are because we are no longer jw.

cult and not had kids.

JWdaughter

I liked Quandry's advice. As a parent, I have found that taking a loving stance that is unconditionally loving is the best route. Then your door is always open for the day their eyes are opened. My best to you all. He may never get totally out, but he might well come to his senses remembering that you are not bad and that you always love them

7

"Christmas is all they have to live for"

by stillin in

jw
friends

this is on of my wife's many-times-repeated expressions about the hilidays, especially when she has an audience that includes non-believers.

i find it offensive even though i still don't celebrate christmas.

here's another one, "and it's all based on lies!".

JWdaughter

JWs can be real downers. They are proud of it. I met a woman who is Muslim who is a former Christian who is as obnoxious about Xmas as any JW and I just counseled her to calm it down. She was offending everyone in her path and she knows that Christmas does not come from an evil intent! She tells her kids the same crap our JW parents told her. I told her a little about my background. She has actually gotten a lot of charity from non Muslims(Christians and others) and Muslims as she has really turned her life around in the last years. I heard her trying to evil up christmas to her kids, telling them they could get gifts any time of the year, blah blah blah. I pointed out that her kids being self righteous about it is a turn off to the world (reminding her of the JWs of her childhood-she got it, immediately!). Pointed out that anyone doing kindnesses for others were being a blessing to them. That people celebrate with lights all over the world-it brightens up dark nites (homes of brides are lit up all over the middle east and in Egypt, there is a holiday that involves a lot of beatifll lights and lanterns.) Most of Christmas is secular, bt those who do bring the "reason"into the season are earnest and doing good things with that.

I encouraged her to allow her children to participate in the winter activities that were not Jesus centric because most are community centric and that is an important thing for her and her children to have. We do not live in insular religious communities. Being self righteous is not a good look for any kind of faith. Mostly, she was alienating her children from others in a way that was not necessary for them to learn and practice their faith. And they could look to that season as a time to help others because there were a lot of things to help with and a lot of needs were being made known. She had been helped by many and they didn't worry if they helped her during her own holiday time or not. They helped becase they saw a need and their help was not to honor Eid or in spite of it, it was because they were expressing their faith with love any time of the year that it was needed. So she didn't need to shut down her kids inclinations to kindness in case they were misconstrued as loving a holiday.

I don't live for Christmas at all (Muslim) bt I love the lights and cranberry bliss bars. Last year when they were taking down all the holiday things at my local store I was kind of sad because it is just a cosy time of the year that I enjoy. Even in Houston where it hasn't rained in weeks even.

The worse thing about christmas is that a lot of niceness is concentrated in that time. We should spread the nice out all year long. I am sure that Kermit said something nice about that in "A Christmas Carol" but I forget the song right now:)

65

Did you AWAKEN from the JWs by yourself?

by cultBgone in

jw
friends

i was thinking about how so many posters here on jwn are frustrated and frantic to help their loved ones get away from the brainwashing of jws, and how much advice is given about how to help family members and loved ones.

i considered my own leaving and that it was internal turmoil based on the teachings getting weirder and child abuse issues, to name just a few, and it made me wonder:.

did you self-awaken or were you assisted by the gentle proddings of a friend or family member?

JWdaughter

I recognized that there were things that didn't make sense, didn't add up and in some cases (charity) just offended me. I read the bible and saw lots of conflicts with what they taught and what it said. I had a complete library of WT stuff from near the beginning and had seen enough of that to think there was some nuttiness going on. I started reading the bible for what it said. I went to libraries and tried to learn more. I went to a christian bookstore and started to see some real "dirt". I was 10 or so when 1975 didn't happen, so I remember quite a lot about all that. Right before I wiped my hands of the entire thing,the article in 80 or 81 came out and then an elder told us of his experience during our Sat night youth meeting. Then our youth meetins on Sat was cancelled (we always had elders or MS chaperoning),the elder was removed.. . well, it was probably the final straw. I knew I was going to go but all that was so ugly I couldn't stay any longer. I told my mom, she made me tell my 'book study' pioneer who couldn't answer my questions. I was sent to elders. I told them all that I thought was messed up (I had a notebook). I said I wasnt going around telling others, Ijust didn't plan to go any further as a JW and I wasn't baptised so I am done. I was DA'd with no further ado. I was 15 and not baptised. I thought that was kind of dramatic for a kid who was not immoral, drinking or using drugs. I mean-itwas the 80's and my sin was disagreeing. So, suddenly no JWs would speak to me. I later found out that they had all been saying I had a baby. They thought that the little girl I brought to the homecoming parade in my senior year was mine (no, I double booked and coudn't get out of my babysitting that night and parents thought she would have fun in the parade).

I woke up on my own, but I eventually got other input that helped me vocalize my issues.

I still find it weird that they felt I was so dangerous to the cong that they DA'd me immediately. I wasn't disrespectful or rude. No tattoos or immodesty. Never talked about any of it to anyone but my mom and study lady. I only used the bible and WT publications.

46

Illegal immigrants in the organization?

by silent in

jw
friends

i had a thought today that might prove interesting.

i'm wondering if there are any illegal immigrants who are witnesses?

surely it would be a great position to be in as an illegal immigrant because you could play up your plight and prey on the sympathies of others within the congregation.

JWdaughter

I thought it interesting that they spent so much time discussing the risks involved in being an illegal immigrant but didn't begin to touch on the fact tht they were BREAKING THE LAW other than they could be sent back. If you don't mind prostituting your women and risking their lives with criminal gangs. . . or being dishonest to the WORLDLY authorities, then I guess its all good.

For most things, I certainly would not think that the WT is obligated to play policeman and I wouldn't in this situation either, but I do find it disconcerting that known lawbreakers would be considered good associations. They will expel you from the congregation for doing legal things, but can be totally accepted while living as an outlaw.

What about nice American girls marrying illegal immigrants to give them status? Are there many green card marriages in Texas KH's?