Posts by yaddayadda

25

Hard line stance taken-results are in!

by dawg in

i recently wrote a letter to every family member i could find an address to which exposed the wt org as the group of fools they actually are!

interesting thing is that not one letter was sent to my home congregation by anyone and the letter circulated to almost every family member i have; so instead of turning me in as i suspected they would do, they are talking about it openly and distributing it to all family members-even ones i couldn't find an address to.

i'm winning this war!

yaddayadda

"if we all stnad firm now-remain loyal to our own "organization" of apostates"

Congrats but I'll pass on remaining loyal to any 'organisation'. Had enough of that for one lifetime thanks.

9

Are you excited!!

by cultswatter in

there is much blow on the joes coming in the near future.

1. the memorial partakers - up or down?

- will they publish the number?.

yaddayadda

Yeah its kinda interesting times for the Borg. Something is in the air.

Don't forget this year's unusually themed District Conventions coming up shortly.

8

The Secret Message

by Nazarene in

of jesus, the title of a book written by one brian mclaren, inspired me to tread into a possibly divisive issue with all you all geniuses.

in it the author espouses his opinions that jesus' walk had been a mainly poltical example of how to contned with roman domination.

isreal had been occupied for centuries but at least they could still worship yahweh.

yaddayadda

On the contrary. NT scholars are beginning to realise that the hope of excavating some kind of genuinely historical Jesus underneath the so-called layers of redactions and myth is a forlorn hope. This whole paradigm has been hopelessly flawed. The gospels are not an archaeological dig.

It's been tried for about 150 years and all thats emerged are piles of theories and postulations about who Jesus supposedly really was, most of them all contradicting each other and largely the product of scholastic imagination than anything else. Many useful insights have been made but ultimately it's got us nowhere.

The scholarly consensus is towards the painful realisation that the Jesus of history and the Jesus of faith can't be separated. There is growing body of compelling evidence that the synoptic gospels are collections of real, eyewitness testimony and that they are a form of ancient biography. They utilised certain literary methods and conventions of the times, but that hardly makes them 'pro-Roman' or simply fictional literature, like a novel. These theories have been discarded.

You either choose to believe what is in the NT or you don't. If you are completely faithless than you must choose the latter and give up the vain hope that the 'real' Jesus will one day be discovered.

40

Glaring contradiction between 1995 new light and Society's authority as FDS

by yaddayadda in

in the 15 october 1995 watchtower the society brought out 'new light' that although christ sat down as king in 1914, but he did not sit down on his 'glorious throne' mentioned at matt 25: 31 in that year.

i cant understand why the society bothered to make this change in 1995?

this change was in some ways more damaging to them than the generation change, because the society essentially sawed off the branch they were sitting on by announcing this 1995 new light.

yaddayadda

Thanks Gary.

Heres a quote from the 1995 article. Notice the absolutely insane logic at the beginning of para 22. The entire article is refuting that Jesus 'sat down on his glorious throne' (verse 31) in 1914 yet in the next breath they say that because he is called 'king' in verse 34 the 'parable logically finds application since Jesus became King in 1914' So what they are saying is that verse 31 (throne) applies to the future yet verse 34 (King) applies to 1914! How utterly foolish can you get. This kind of deliberately false reasoning borders on purposeful lying.

The Watchtower Society shows its true colours here. They show they are quite prepared to twist Jesus words to the most absurd limits rather than admit that the root cause of the problem is that Jesus never became King in 1914. In their foolish attempts to subordinate everything to their 1914 teaching they have made a mockery of Christs words and fools of JW's.

*** w95 10/15 22 How Will You Stand Before the Judgment Seat? ***

21 How, though, will people in those nations fare when the Son of man arrives in his glory? Let us find out from the parable of the sheep and the goats, which begins with the words: “When the Son of man arrives in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit down on his glorious throne. And all the nations will be gathered before him.”—Matthew 25:31, 32.

22 Does this parable apply when Jesus sat down in kingly power in 1914, as we have long understood? Well, Matthew 25:34 does speak of him as King, so the parable logically finds application since Jesus became King in 1914. But what judging did he do soon thereafter? It was not a judging of “all the nations.” Rather, he turned his attention to those claiming to make up “the house of God.” (1 Peter 4:17) In line with Malachi 3:1-3, Jesus, as Jehovah’s messenger, judicially inspected the anointed Christians remaining on earth. It was also time for judicial sentence on Christendom, who falsely claimed to be “the house of God.” (Revelation 17:1, 2; 18:4-8) Yet nothing indicates that at that time, or for that matter since, Jesus sat to judge people of all the nations finally as sheep or goats.

40

Glaring contradiction between 1995 new light and Society's authority as FDS

by yaddayadda in

in the 15 october 1995 watchtower the society brought out 'new light' that although christ sat down as king in 1914, but he did not sit down on his 'glorious throne' mentioned at matt 25: 31 in that year.

i cant understand why the society bothered to make this change in 1995?

this change was in some ways more damaging to them than the generation change, because the society essentially sawed off the branch they were sitting on by announcing this 1995 new light.

yaddayadda

Here is a quote from a 1989 Watchtower that clearly states Jesus came to do a judgement in 1918. In 1995 the Society revealed 'new light' that the throne in Matthew 25: 31 is a judgment throne (only) but Jesus has not yet sat on it (to separate the sheep from the goats). Yet the Society would have us believe that in 1914 Jesus was 'enthroned' as King and in 1918 judged his earthly spiritual temple in order to refine it (Malachi 3:1)! Judgment starts with the house of God (1 Pet 4:17) and the Society say that very judgment happened in 1918. (It would be interesting to see if there are any post-1995 quotes where they repeat the claim that Jesus judged his people in 1919):

*** w89 4/15 7 The Infamous Harlot-Her Fall ***

9 As we have just noted, Jehovah’s people entered a period of severe testing in 1918. The prophet’s further words at Malachi 3:1-3 explain what was happening: “And suddenly there will come to His temple the true Lord [Jehovah], whom you people are seeking, and the messenger of the [Abrahamic] covenant”—Jesus. Yes, Jehovah came with his Christ for judgment. Jehovah then asks: “Who will be putting up with the day of his coming, and who will be the one standing when he appears? For he will be like the fire of a refiner and like the lye of laundrymen.” According to 1 Peter 4:17, judgment would start with those professing to be of “the house of God.” Thus, true Christians were refined and cleansed for Jehovah’s service.

8

The Secret Message

by Nazarene in

of jesus, the title of a book written by one brian mclaren, inspired me to tread into a possibly divisive issue with all you all geniuses.

in it the author espouses his opinions that jesus' walk had been a mainly poltical example of how to contned with roman domination.

isreal had been occupied for centuries but at least they could still worship yahweh.

yaddayadda

I hate seeing newbies get totally ignored so just saying hello Nazarene. Sorry that I have nothing to say about the subject at hand.

94

Why 6 Billion People Deserve to Die in Armageddon

by Leolaia in

jehovah is such a righteous, merciful, loving god -- slow to anger, overflowing with loving kindness and blessing.

yet it somehow bothers many of you that he will shortly execute his judgment on mankind and wipe out 99.9% of the world's population, as if that somehow is supposed to conflict with his loving qualities.

personally, i have no idea why many of you feel this way.

yaddayadda

(deleted - double post. Damn 'puter)

94

Why 6 Billion People Deserve to Die in Armageddon

by Leolaia in

jehovah is such a righteous, merciful, loving god -- slow to anger, overflowing with loving kindness and blessing.

yet it somehow bothers many of you that he will shortly execute his judgment on mankind and wipe out 99.9% of the world's population, as if that somehow is supposed to conflict with his loving qualities.

personally, i have no idea why many of you feel this way.

yaddayadda

At least Charles Rutherford had the sense to realise that the idea of destroying billions of ignorant persons for ALL ETERNITY at Armageddon is completely incompatible with Jehovah being a God of love and justice. Hence Russell came up with the idea that all those killed at Armageddon must of necessity be resurrected during the millennial reign, for the same reasons that all those dead in their graves before Armageddon strikes will be resurrected. They all alike get another chance, because Satan blinded them all. They never had a fair chance.

So why bother killing much of humankind at Armageddon in the first place? Because they must still pay the price of death for their inherited Adamic sin. Only those redeemed by Christ when Armageddon strikes will pass straight through into a new earth without dying first. So said Pastor Russell (I think).

Seems to make more sense than the Society's version of events. At least to me anyway.

40

Glaring contradiction between 1995 new light and Society's authority as FDS

by yaddayadda in

in the 15 october 1995 watchtower the society brought out 'new light' that although christ sat down as king in 1914, but he did not sit down on his 'glorious throne' mentioned at matt 25: 31 in that year.

i cant understand why the society bothered to make this change in 1995?

this change was in some ways more damaging to them than the generation change, because the society essentially sawed off the branch they were sitting on by announcing this 1995 new light.

yaddayadda

{deleted - double post}

40

Glaring contradiction between 1995 new light and Society's authority as FDS

by yaddayadda in

in the 15 october 1995 watchtower the society brought out 'new light' that although christ sat down as king in 1914, but he did not sit down on his 'glorious throne' mentioned at matt 25: 31 in that year.

i cant understand why the society bothered to make this change in 1995?

this change was in some ways more damaging to them than the generation change, because the society essentially sawed off the branch they were sitting on by announcing this 1995 new light.

yaddayadda

Apocalypse said: "Yet, when you carefully examine the verse, right from the NWT reference edition, there is an asterisk on the word "arriving*" which takes you to the bottom of the page. The reference says "46* Lit., "having come." Gr., el-thon'. In other words, the Literal translation from the Greek is "having come" which puts the fulfilment of verse 46 squarely in the future."

Very interesting! However, ‘having come’ indicates a past tense, so technically it could still apply to a past event, such as 1914. My NIV version says ‘..when he returns’ rather than ‘arrives’. I wonder how this Greek word 'el-thon' is used in other scriptures? What do authorities say about it?

Nevertheless, ‘having come’ in Matt 24:46 must surely mean that Jesus does not appoint the faith and discreet slave(s) until his second COMING, which the WTS says did NOT occur in 1914 (as Apocalypse implied! The Watchtower Society insists that even though Jesus has been ‘present’ since 1914 his 'coming' is still in the future. And that despite all that Jesus still 'arrived' in 1914 and appointed them as his 'faithful and discreet slave' class in 1919! Go figure!!!

Furthermore, if Jesus did not sit on any 'judgment' throne in 1914 then what on earth was he doing when he chose the Watchtower Society ahead of all other Christians? If that isn't judging then what is?

As for Jesus being 'present' since 1914 only through having 'turned his attention' to the earth, where does Matthew 28: 20 fit in? According to that scripture Jesus has 'been with' (ie, had his 'attention' on) his true followers on earth for the last two thousands years!

The Society's inconsistent treatment of 'coming' and 'arriving' in Matthew 24 and 25 is capricious and thoroughly unscholarly. It is just layers upon layers of twisting and contradictions that do all sorts of abuse to Jesus words. So much for letting the bible interpret itself.

It is almost impossible to believe that at least some of the GB did not notice all these contradictions when they considered this 'new light' in 1995. Some of them, perhaps all of them, must surely know that these interpretations are a nonsense. This is what puzzles me about why they bothered to bring in this new light at all. What was the point? All it did was make their 1914-19 teaching look even more ridiculous than it already was.