Posts by just2sheep

45

Raymond Franz is a good man

by slimboyfat in

jw
friends

i have come across some old threads that make various accusations against rayfranz, but i think on the whole he seems a kind and thoughtful person.

he didn't do everything right, and he is no saint as some make out: his expulsion is a bit flatteringly called a "crisis of conscience", but he came to terms with the disorienting situation well and did a service to all involved with the witnesses by giving us a look behind the curtain.

some of the things that people hold against him it seems:.

just2sheep

"...he should not be judged"

in the real world, out side the borg and borg think, we are all judged. i never read his books because by the time i came along all his information was available on the www. if you did and it helped you, i think it is great. and i'm sure that those who have met him are telling the truth about what a nice guy he is. however, that doesn't mean much to me because i haven't, and probably never will, meet him. and i think he should absolutely be judged for his contributions to the WTB&TS. it didn't become the religion we love to hate by itself. it became the religion we love to hate through the contributions of men like ray franz who went along to get along until they couldn't get along anymore. if the present governing body is to be judged as harshly as it is on jwd, and believe me i think they should be judged harshly. then in all fairness ray franz should be counted as the gb member he would still be if they had not gotten rid of him. scripture says...judge not lest ye be judged. in the manner you have judged you will be judged. just2sheep says...i have been judged, and i have been judged harshly. and now it is my turn... whining and crying won't help you because they didn't help me.

just something to think about while making out your "individuals and groups who should not be judged because (fill in the blank).

j2s

35

THE REAL REASON FAMILY MEMBERS SHUN.........................

by vitty in

jw
friends

i think the real reason family members shun their "loved ones" is not because they love you and think it will bring you back, or that they are being obedient to god, but that you have totally embarrassed them, brought the family name into disrepute and it now brings into question how spiritual they are.. if they shun you, in their minds, they think the elders, and dubs will not think less of them.

its all about what the "neighbours " think not what the bible teaches.. its about pride not love.. what do you think?.

oh and it gives them brownie points to be used at armageddon.......................just in case.. .

just2sheep

garybus,

if we all have one thing in common here it is wishing we could do it over. i know it doesn't seem like it but i grieve for every man, woman and child who has been taken advantage of by this religion. even the ones that really upset me have in their own way been hurt just as much as i have. sometimes i have to remind myself of that.

j2s

mary that is what i thought you meant.

35

THE REAL REASON FAMILY MEMBERS SHUN.........................

by vitty in

jw
friends

i think the real reason family members shun their "loved ones" is not because they love you and think it will bring you back, or that they are being obedient to god, but that you have totally embarrassed them, brought the family name into disrepute and it now brings into question how spiritual they are.. if they shun you, in their minds, they think the elders, and dubs will not think less of them.

its all about what the "neighbours " think not what the bible teaches.. its about pride not love.. what do you think?.

oh and it gives them brownie points to be used at armageddon.......................just in case.. .

just2sheep

bigtex,

you characterize my description of your late father-in-law as cruel. are you aware that this description is word for word the description you gave in one of your early threads? i didn't know him, you did. you described him. my comment was based on your description. if my online personality bothers you, don't read my posts. i can guarantee that you, and others like you, won't like what i have to say. except for personal attacks on me, that i must defend against, you don't have much to say i am interested in. unlike the kh i have a limited method of defending myself here on jwd through replies like this and i intend to do that.

mary,

in answer to my question did you really mean that no one had done this or did you mean that no one in your family has done this? you can certainly answer for your family and i know other families who feel the same, which really is beside the point i was trying to make. but, to say that no one has done(is doing) this isn't realistic.

j2s

35

THE REAL REASON FAMILY MEMBERS SHUN.........................

by vitty in

jw
friends

i think the real reason family members shun their "loved ones" is not because they love you and think it will bring you back, or that they are being obedient to god, but that you have totally embarrassed them, brought the family name into disrepute and it now brings into question how spiritual they are.. if they shun you, in their minds, they think the elders, and dubs will not think less of them.

its all about what the "neighbours " think not what the bible teaches.. its about pride not love.. what do you think?.

oh and it gives them brownie points to be used at armageddon.......................just in case.. .

just2sheep

tex,

you didn't mention that when this occured you had been out for 14 years and didn't care what the rule was because it didn't apply to you. as i said you reap what you sow, if you teach your child to fear being disfellowshipped, hated and murdered by jehovah at armegeddon and shunned themselves or allow others to teach them this then don't whine when they shun you. after all it isn't a suprise is it? it may be a shock. it might make you miserable. but it isn't a suprise. your father-in-law's story is a sad one, but was anyone really suprised that someone you described as going from being a mild mannered and wise elder to being a drunken, loud and obnoxious 78 year old sailor who wanted to bed anything in a skirt was dfd? how much misery did he dance on in his 50 years of annointed eldership? how many people did he shun? did your wife shun people outside her family? or was she taught that the rules only apply to families who don't have an annointed elder as the father? every family is different, every family handles these things in their own way. only hypocrites want the rules changed when it is their turn in the barrel. i don't dance on other peoples misery, but hypocrisy is another matter.

j2s

35

THE REAL REASON FAMILY MEMBERS SHUN.........................

by vitty in

jw
friends

i think the real reason family members shun their "loved ones" is not because they love you and think it will bring you back, or that they are being obedient to god, but that you have totally embarrassed them, brought the family name into disrepute and it now brings into question how spiritual they are.. if they shun you, in their minds, they think the elders, and dubs will not think less of them.

its all about what the "neighbours " think not what the bible teaches.. its about pride not love.. what do you think?.

oh and it gives them brownie points to be used at armageddon.......................just in case.. .

just2sheep

for those of you who are shunned by your children,

if i were your child and you spent 20 to 40 years of my life indoctrinating me into what you consider the truth, and then you try to insist that your new light is that it was all a lie and i should now accept that; i would shun you too. how many of you spent your lives shunning others as an example to your children and then when it's your turn to be shunned cry and whine about it? the borg didn't come and get your children. you took your children and sacrificed them to the borg. you reap what you sow. it is hypocritical to think that the children you taught to shun others would now not shun you.

j2s

36

Big Announcementitis - JWs and 'Postates

by slimboyfat in

jw
friends

what is it with jehovah's witnesses and apostates and "big announcements" - they are as bad as each other.

witnesses are always on about big announcements in the pipeline - just to end up being disappointed.

like the time they reduced the pioneers hours - big wow.

just2sheep

anyone interested in the 'postate physchology of this subject should read the thread, from december, 05 "the news is bigger than dateline, bbc, cbc, etc.", which begat "get real people", which begat "the reaction to the big news at work today", which begat "can barbara anderson be trusted", which begat "can anyone be trusted", which begat "another piece of thought about the big news", which begat "the 'jerry springer' crowd", which begat "can simon be trusted". 1,304 posts in 6 days with the occasional whatever happened to post since then, all for something imho wasn't that big and wasn't that new. i hadn't been lurking very long when this occured and i was amazed at the frenzy that developed. somethings never change. i'm still amazed.

j2s

34

JW official website promoting Jesus?

by agapa37 in

i have heard from many people when i would go out in the ministry that "we" witness do not believe in jesus.

when my mother first heard about me becoming interested in the witness that is what she said.

ive seen some make that same statement here.

just2sheep

agapa,

the jehovah's witnesses are the only religion i have ever heard of that celebrate jesus' ransom by having a meeting once a year so that everyone in the room can refuse the emblems. when jesus said keep doing this, he was talking about partaking, he was not talking about rejecting the emblems. i was not raised in a religious family and have never partaken, so i didn't think too much about it as a witness. however someone on this board mentioned this last memorial season and it made sense. when i went to memorial this past year i proved for myself, by observing and listening, that the ceromony had nothing to do, or little to do, with jesus and a lot to do with reminding us that we were not to partake because we were not anointed and therefore not covered by his ransom. except in an indirect way which other posters have already pointed out. jesus did not initiate any such practice nor is this bible based, except in a very bastardized way. to paraphrase: " i know not what others may do, but the next time someone hands me a glass of wine i'm going to drink it." in order to not cause a scene and avoid embarassing others by doing this i don't intend to go to anymore memorials. i don't think it shows jesus the respect he deserves.

j2s

1380

The Gentiles Times Reconsidered--Again but this Time By Using the Bible

by thirdwitness in

think about this: if seven times mean only 7 years then daniel could have simply said 7 years.

why does daniel specifically use the word 'times' rather than years?

as we have already shown daniel used the word for 7 times instead of 7 years.

just2sheep

alanf,

your continuing habit of calling people, who dissagree with you, derogatory names is getting to be a bore. perhaps you should read the guidelines. even if you aren't bound by them they could still be of help to you. and it would help those of us who are bound by them. it has been pointed out to me more than once that not following the posting guidelines is not on, so to keep up the appearance of equality under jwd guidelines please stick to the point. your arguments are strong enough to not have to resort to name calling.

j2s

60

The softer side of the Bible

by agapa37 in

to many times the bible is fired upon and put in negative light due to the contents of it.

however i would like to post some encouraging scriptures from that book.. 1) for those experiencing trials because of illness.

revelations 21:4-5.

just2sheep

agapa37,

thanks for your attempt to find the positive, but as you can see you anything positive upsets the usual suspects here at jwd and it is their world you are dealing with. and they will turn around and tear you apart while claiming to agree with you. just like they did at the kingdom hall. "smiling faces, smiling faces sometimes-they don't tell the truth..."

j2s

156

Thirdwitness -- An Agent of the Governing Body?

by AlanF in

thirdwitness -- an agent of the governing body?

this evening i was talking with an old friend about recent postings on this forum by jw defenders.

we concluded that something unusual is going on.

just2sheep

could, would, should, maybe, perhaps, might be, seems to be, sounds like, appears to be, must be...don't you just love conspiracy theories?