Scully.
Is there also a toll-free number for those of us who want to tell them to get bent?
Yes of course 800scully.rescue
Prins.
a lurker for 6 years......... Welcome and i look forward to reading your posts.
feel free to pm anytime.
Cas
caspian
JoinedPosts by caspian
-
26
It is that time of year again.....
by caspian inyes my good friends it is september, elders all around the world are having their loving elders meetings, where they discuss coming to see you all to encourage you back to the fold.... hurrah!
returning to jehovah.
7 but may the elders themselves take any initiative in approaching a disfellowshipped person?
-
-
caspian
-
16
A Little Bit O' Nostalgia
by Englishman inthis is a pic of a large oil painting that hangs on our front room chimneybreast.
it's my pride and joy.
the boy in the painting is me, aged 11. the lady was my grandmother.
-
-
caspian
Here is another picture of EMan as a little boy doing his first door to door presentation.
Cas
-
20
Jehovah's Witnesses reorganize printing operations
by Dogpatch infor immediate release.
september 1, 2003
printable version
-
-
caspian
Ozzie
For example, the cessation of food service at conventions was heralded by the WTS as "simplification" with all its accompanying virtues. The real reason, as is well known now even by the R&F, was TAX. The governors of the borg have a loathing for paying it and will do anything to avoid it. (Hey, isn't that what "worldly" people do???!!).
Good point.
Here is a picture of Walkill Construction
Caspian
-
26
It is that time of year again.....
by caspian inyes my good friends it is september, elders all around the world are having their loving elders meetings, where they discuss coming to see you all to encourage you back to the fold.... hurrah!
returning to jehovah.
7 but may the elders themselves take any initiative in approaching a disfellowshipped person?
-
-
caspian
Yes my good friends it is September, elders all around the world are having their loving elders meetings, where they discuss coming to see you all to encourage you back to the fold.... Hurrah!
Returning to Jehovah7
But may the elders themselves take any initiative in approaching a disfellowshipped person? Yes. The Bible shows that mercy is expressed not simply by a negative holding back of punishment but often by positive acts. We have Jehovah’s example. Before he sent his unfaithful people into exile, he prophetically held out the prospect of their returning: "Remember these things, O Jacob, and you, O Israel, because you are my servant. . . . I will wipe out your transgressions just as with a cloud, and your sins just as with a cloud mass. Do return to me, for I will repurchase you."—Isaiah 44:21, 22.
8
Then, during the exile, Jehovah took further steps, acting in a positive way. He sent prophets, his representatives, to invite Israel to ‘seek him and find him.’ (Jeremiah 29:1, 10-14) At Ezekiel 34:16, he likened himself to a shepherd and the people of the nation of Israel to lost sheep: "The lost one I shall search for, and the dispersed one I shall bring back." At Jeremiah 31:10, Jehovah also used the imagery of his being a shepherd of the Israelites. No, he did not depict himself as a shepherd at the sheepfold waiting for the lost one to come back; rather, he showed himself as a shepherd searching for the lost ones. Note that even while the people in general were unrepentant and exiled, God initiated efforts to seek their return. And in line with Malachi 3:6, God would not change his way of dealing in the Christian arrangement.
9
Does this not suggest that there could be a reason for initiating steps toward some who are disfellowshipped and who may now be repentant? Remember that the apostle Paul gave direction to remove the wicked man from the Corinthian congregation. Later he exhorted the congregation to confirm their love toward the man because of his repentance, leading to his subsequent reinstatement in the congregation.—1 Corinthians 5:9-13; 2 Corinthians 2:5-11.
10
The encyclopedia quoted earlier said: ‘The basic rationale for excommunication was to protect the standards of the group: "a little leaven leavens the whole lump" (1 Cor. 5:6). This motive is clear in most biblical and extracanonical passages, but concern for the individual, even after expulsion, was the basis of Paul’s plea in 2 Cor. 2:7-10.’ (Italics ours.) Hence, concern of this kind should logically be shown today by the shepherds of the flock. (Acts 20:28; 1 Peter 5:2) Former friends and relatives might hope that a disfellowshipped one would return; yet out of respect for the command at 1 Corinthians 5:11, they do not associate with an expelled person. They leave it to the appointed shepherds to take the initiative to see if such a one is interested in returning.
11
It would not be fitting even for elders to take the initiative toward certain expelled ones, such as apostates, who ‘speak twisted things to draw away the disciples after themselves.’ These are ‘false teachers who are trying to bring in destructive sects and to exploit the congregation with counterfeit words.’ (Acts 20:30; 2 Peter 2:1, 3) The Bible also does not provide any basis for searching out disfellowshipped ones who are belligerent or who actively encourage wrongdoing.—2 Thessalonians 2:3; 1 Timothy 4:1; 2 John 9-11; Jude 4, 11.
12
However, many expelled ones are not like that. One may have ceased the serious wrongdoing for which he was disfellowshipped. Another may have been using tobacco, or he may in the past have been overdrinking, but he is not now trying to lead others into wrongdoing. Recall that even before exiled Israel turned to God, he sent representatives urging them to come back. Whether Paul or the elders in the Corinth congregation took some initiative to check on the disfellowshipped man, the Bible does not say. When that man had repented and ended his immorality, Paul directed the congregation to reinstate him.
13
In recent times there have been cases in which an elder happened to meet a disfellowshipped person. Where appropriate, the shepherd briefly outlined the steps to be taken for reinstatement. Some persons like this repented and were reinstated. Such joyful outcomes indicate that there may be disfellowshipped or disassociated ones who would respond to a merciful approach made by the shepherds. But how might the elders handle this matter? Once a year at most, the body of elders should consider whether there are such persons living in their territory. The elders would focus on those who have been expelled for over a year. According to the circumstances, if it is appropriate, they would assign two elders (hopefully ones familiar with the situation) to visit such an individual. No visit would be made on any who evidence a critical, dangerous attitude or who have made it known that they want no help.—Romans 16:17, 18; 1 Timothy 1:20; 2 Timothy 2:16-18.
14
The two shepherds could telephone to ask about making a brief visit, or they could stop by at a suitable time. During the visit, they need not be stern or even cool but should warmly reflect their merciful concern. Instead of reviewing the past case, they could discuss Bible texts such as Isaiah 1:18 and 55:6, 7 and James 5:20. If the person is interested in returning to God’s flock, they could kindly explain what steps he should take, such as reading the Bible and publications of the Watch Tower Society and attending meetings at the Kingdom Hall.
15
These elders will need wisdom and discernment to determine whether there is indication of repentance and whether a follow-up visit would be advisable. They should bear in mind, of course, that some disfellowshipped persons will never be ‘revived to repentance.’ (Hebrews 6:4-6; 2 Peter 2:20-22) After the visit, the two would give a brief oral report to the Congregation Service Committee. They, in turn, would inform the body of elders at their next meeting. The elders’ merciful initiative will have reflected God’s view: "‘Return to me, and I will return to you,’ Jehovah of armies has said."—Malachi 3:7.
Other
Merciful Help16
What of those of us who are not overseers and will not be taking such initiatives toward disfellowshipped persons? What can we do consistent with this arrangement and in imitation of Jehovah?
17
As long as someone is disfellowshipped or disassociated, we need to follow the instruction: "Quit mixing in company with anyone called a brother that is a fornicator or a greedy person or an idolater or a reviler or a drunkard or an extortioner, not even eating with such a man." (1 Corinthians 5:11) But this Biblical directive should not affect our view of Christian family members who live with the disfellowshipped person. Ancient Jews reacted so strongly to tax collectors that their hatred was extended even to the family of the tax collector. Jesus did not endorse that. He said that a sinner who refused help was to be treated "just as a man of the nations and as a tax collector"; he did not say that Christian family members were to be so treated.—Matthew 18:17.
18
We ought to be especially supportive of the family members who are faithful Christians. They may already face pain and obstacles because of living at home with an expelled person who may actually discourage their spiritual pursuits. He may prefer not to have Christians visit the home; or if they do come to see the loyal family members, he may not have the courtesy to keep away from the visitors. He may also impede the family’s efforts to go to all Christian meetings and assemblies. (Compare Matthew 23:13.) Christians thus disadvantaged truly deserve our mercy.—2 Corinthians 1:3, 4.
19
One way we can show tender mercy is by ‘speaking consolingly’ and having encouraging conversations with such faithful ones in the household. (1 Thessalonians 5:14) There are also fine opportunities to give support before and after meetings, while in field service, or when together at other times. We need not mention disfellowshipping but can discuss many upbuilding things. (Proverbs 25:11; Colossians 1:2-4) While the elders will continue to shepherd the Christians in the family, we might find that we too can visit without having dealings with the expelled person. If the disfellowshipped one happens to answer when we visit or telephone, we can simply ask for the Christian relative that we are seeking. Sometimes the Christian family members may be able to accept an invitation to our home for association. The point is: They—young and old—are our fellow servants, beloved members of God’s congregation, not to be isolated.—Psalm 10:14.
20
Another area for showing mercy opens when an expelled one is reinstated. Jesus’ illustrations highlight the joy in heaven when ‘one sinner repents.’ (Luke 15:7, 10) Paul wrote to the Corinthians regarding the man that had been disfellowshipped: "You should kindly forgive and comfort him, that somehow such a man may not be swallowed up by his being overly sad. Therefore I exhort you to confirm your love for him." (2 Corinthians 2:7, 8) Let us apply that advice soberly and lovingly in the days and weeks after a person is reinstated.
21
Jesus’ illustration of the prodigal son brings up a danger that we need to avoid. The older brother did not rejoice at the prodigal’s return but was resentful. May we not be like that, harboring ill will over a past wrong or begrudging a person’s being reinstated. Rather, our goal is to be like the father, who illustrated Jehovah’s response. The father was happy that his son, who was lost and seemed as good as dead, was found, or came to life. (Luke 15:25-32) Accordingly, we will freely speak to the reinstated brother and otherwise encourage him. Yes, we should make it evident that we are showing mercy, as our forgiving and merciful heavenly Father does.—Matthew 5:7.
22
There is no question that if we want to imitate our God, we must show mercy in harmony with his commands and his justice. The psalmist describes him this way: "Jehovah is gracious and merciful, slow to anger and great in loving-kindness. Jehovah is good to all, and his mercies are over all his works." (Psalm 145:8, 9) What a loving pattern for Christians to copy!
[Footnotes]
"Tax collectors were especially despised by the Jewish population of Palestine for several reasons: (1) they collected money for the foreign power that occupied the land of Israel, thus indirectly giving support to this outrage; (2) they were notoriously unscrupulous, growing wealthy at the expense of others of their own people; and (3) their work involved them in regular contact with Gentiles, rendering them ritually unclean. Contempt for tax collectors is found both in the N[ew] T[estament] and the rabbinic literature . . . According to the latter, hatred was to be extended even to the family of the tax collector."—The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia.
If in a Christian’s household there is a disfellowshipped relative, that one would still be part of the normal, day-to-day household dealings and activities. This could include being present when spiritual material is considered as a family.—See The Watchtower of November 15, 1988, pages 19-20.
See 1991 Yearbook of Jehovah’s Witnesses, pages 53-4.
If any Witness, in the house-to-house preaching or in another way, learns of a disfellowshipped person living in the territory, he should give that information to the elders
I thought that this reminder of the good news about the forgiveness of our loving elders will brighten up your little days.
Cas
p.s there is a toll free number for those of you who can't wait
Tel 800elder.rescue
-
127
Picture of where you live
by RAYZORBLADE infor some of us on this forum, we're so far away from one another.
out of curiosity, do any of you have any photos of where you are from, or the communities that you live in?
here's one of toronto.
-
-
caspian
This is where I am going to live with my tame lion and pet cobra.
Cas
-
127
Picture of where you live
by RAYZORBLADE infor some of us on this forum, we're so far away from one another.
out of curiosity, do any of you have any photos of where you are from, or the communities that you live in?
here's one of toronto.
-
-
caspian
plm.
I have never seen an oics before
Cas
-
127
Picture of where you live
by RAYZORBLADE infor some of us on this forum, we're so far away from one another.
out of curiosity, do any of you have any photos of where you are from, or the communities that you live in?
here's one of toronto.
-
-
-
-
-
caspian
Welcome from Caspian
-
51
Hi, my introduction.....finally.
by MonkeyPrincess ini have been reading posts for a while, but everytime i try and post my intro, i dont know what to say, so i suppose i will just write what comes to me.
lets see, i was born and raised in the "truth", i have never known anything else my whole life, so this is weird for me to think differently.
i was df'd about 4 years ago when i met my "worldly" husband, i have tried for the past 2 years to be reinstated, but i guess that i have not tried hard enough, according to the elders (who btw have not been very nice or loving toward me).
-
-
caspian
Welcome. Monkey.
Cas
-
21
Bro gives talk by laptop...lol
by caspian indespite my hangover, i reluctantly went to the meeting yesterday (the gaps are getting bigger each week).
i know that my eyes were a bit out of focus, but this is true, the young elder (age 27ish) gave the talk from his laptop.
his audience contact was crap as his eyes kept scrolling down the screen, mind you it was the worst talk i had heard for years, one of those 30 scriptures in 45 minutes events what we used to call read and run with no explanation.. .
-
-
caspian
Despite my hangover, I reluctantly went to the meeting yesterday (the gaps are getting bigger each week)
I know that my eyes were a bit out of focus, but this is true, the young elder (age 27ish) gave the talk from his laptop. His audience contact was crap as his eyes kept scrolling down the screen, mind you it was the worst talk I had heard for years, one of those 30 scriptures in 45 minutes events what we used to call read and run with no explanation.
it was the talk Jehovah the grand creator.
Any way 2 questions
Has anyone else heard of a laptop being used for a talk or is this a world first.......
and secondly if you were a really good speaker who had memorised most of his talk, what would you be looking at on your laptop whilst giving the talk
Caspian..
