Posts by AudeSapere

i have seen several posts like the following, and never thought i would have to write one myself, but here we go: my dear mom is forcing me to make a move... one that i have been really avoiding as much as possible.

she wrote me an email today, and here i am giving you an idea of its contents.

AudeSapere

Sorry to hear about this letter. It is heart-breaking to get and even worse when you get that in writing.

I think she is referring to JR Brown in Bethel. There are some YouTube videos and in particular is a recording from a former JWN poster. What he says in the interview completely contradicts many things that active JWs are taught.

It might be interesting for you to listen to that audio and/or read the transcript. Put the ball back in your mom's court.

-Aude.

40

Letter to Governing Body .Recorded conversations with Elders

by Watchtower-Free in

i found this on youtube...very good example of twisted reasoning by elders.. .

recorded conversations with elders by a former pioneer....a series.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pw8amuphqis.

AudeSapere

marked.

36

Ex-Jehovah's Witnesses Wisconsin and Midwest

by Watchtower-Free in

so who's from wisconsin and the midwest usa.

AudeSapere

There used to be a whole BUNCH of JWNers from the Wisconsin area. One by one they seem to have drifted off. I hope they drifted into real life.

Those from Wisconsin also used to have some pretty regular Apostafests, it seemed.

-Aude. (From SoCal, not Wisconsin)

10

Advice, TTATT or Bible

by Crazyguy in

i really starting to see the problems with the bible and it being influenced by other cultures, religions and also the fact that many of the books or letter were written after the fact or so called prophecy.

so i am wondering would it work better to try to wake my children to ttatt about the jw cult or work on destroying the bible and its credibility?

which do you think would work better??

AudeSapere

Personally, I would stick with the un-christianness of the WTS. And the inconsistencies that lead to The Truth About the Truth.

Full-frontal confrontation to shake someone's faith just puts them on the defensive. JWs go into cult-mode. Other christians go into pious mode and highlight all the good they do/have done.

Until someone personally feels the effects of the WTS, they will find a way to explain away the apparent discrepancies.

I consider myself agnostic and do not put much creadance in the Bible anymore. However, I believe there is some literary significance to it. And for some people it is their rock. It feels unfair to attack that rock at this stage. Better to go with highlighting the unchristian-ness of the crazy men with their crazy religion and how they are wholly unqualified to dictate how 7+million people should live their lives.

Disfellowshipping - Jesus would not do it. His disciples would not do it.

Blood - Is the symbol of life more important than life itself? Why is it OK to accept fractions made from donated blood but not OK to donate blood to help someone else? Could the reason for the bible's admonishment to abstain be due to the fact that in bible times that the available blood was due to the fact that someone had been killed or injured and therefore the *donor's* life was being disrespected??? In modern times, blood is donated by healthy people whose lives are not threatened; the donated blood is an altruistic *gift* from a healthy person with respect for the life of the infirm person.

Mexico/Malawi - All the persecution of the black brothers in Malawi was read to us as teenagers in the mid-70's. Why did the WTS push the agenda that resulted in horrific persecution of these brothers and sisters but in Mexico, accomodations were made for those brothers to comply with the government and avoid similar persecution? Why couldn't the same consideration be made for the tortured Malawis?

United Nations NGO - It's old news, but, seriously?? The wild beast and the harlot? Who's kidding who?? A library card? Right. Sure. F*cking hypocrites.

587/607 - Which was it? If 587, as confirmed by secular history, then 1914 is a fluky, contrived coincidence and Rutherford and his cronies are frauds.

The three things that were most important to me in breaking free from my mental and emotional attachment to JW were: Mexico/Malawi; UN NGO; and 587/607. It's been about 20 years since I up and walked out of the Kingdom Hall in the middle of a public talk so I'm a little bit out of touch with teachings that people have been hearing in that time. I suspect that most cannot explain the significance of 607 and how it relates to the 'godlike authority' of the current governing body. And younger people and newbies probably don't feel the same connection to the Malawi brothers. And since the 90's the society has been oh! so much softer on the UN. That old Babylon Great book probably has not been studied for decades. So these 3 'deal breakers' may not work on the current rank-and-file.

The new elder instructional video dramatizing the JC where the young man was threatened with disfellowshipping for dating - and possibly impregnating - a worldly girl. Telling him to breakoff all contact immediately. It's unconscionable.

The organization is all about isolation and legalities with different standards for the upper eschelon than the lowly rank-and-file. Right is right and wrong is wrong regardless of your status.

There is no outlet to speak any dissenting thoughts or ideas in the org. Be the outlet for honest thoughts - especially if they are original and personal. Encourage the exchange of freespeech and be patient. By allowing the expression of thought, you children and friends will be planting their own seeds.

Also find fun, clean, non-religious activities to do with the kids (and other friends) on a regular basis. Help them find enjoyment in interacting with moral, worldly people. Give them continuous options of going to boring meetings or fun, life-affirming activities. If they really want the meetings, it might mean you need to let them enjoy that. Just be sure to take pics of yourself and others having fun outdoors at the same time.

Best of luck to you helping them to wake up.

-Aude.

63

Elders Will Be Notified & WILL FIND YOU in the Hospital

by Aude_Sapere in

don't wait.

update your advance medical directives before you find yourself in my situation.... .

my left arm was feeling 'odd' last friday morning as i was getting dressed for work.

AudeSapere

Thanks for the added comments.

@disposable hero - Thank you. My current bike is a Honda Shadow 650. I have outgrown it, but can still have lots of fun on that bike...! and btw - Welcome to JWN. Nice to have you join us!

@sparrowdown - Another newbie! Welcome~! and thanks for adding your story about visiting elders. I understand the possibility of 'lapsed judgement' and delay in processing updates to medical records. It's why I thought to bump this thread - as a reminder to fading and xjws to be aware of this unplanned opportunity to get back on JW radar.

@Phizzy - Thanks for highlighting the need to update of 'Next of Kin' or 'Healthcare Agent'. It will override the family as your advocate in the event that you are not able to make decisions for yourself. That 'No Blood' bullshit just adds a layer of drama that busy doctors and nurses don't want or need. They may (or may not) try to cooperate with the desire for No Blood, but if they have to have *that* conversation, I'm sure they would prefer to have a logical, scientific discussion rather then have their hands completely tied with illogical, hypocritical, out-of-date info from a publishing company disguising itself as a religion. Glad you recovered nicely, too.

@jookbeard - Thanks. All is good now.

@LisaRose - Too true. But to be fair, as I recall, the man (JW 'brother') that showed up to visit me did not seem that pushy or initially intent to force an inquisition. His initial demeanor was reserved but friendly. But my own resistance kicked in right away and he seemed to just fall into the 'loyalty' questions. The dynamics were 'off' for both of us so, in hindsight, I give him the benefit of the doubt. Maybe I'm being too generous. It's been almost 9 years since this incident. The fact that there was *ZERO* follow-up makes me think that he was not that serious in his questioning. Maybe just a kneejerk reaction to my defensiveness. IDK. But I do agree with you... Whether in the hospital, church, and life in general, other religions generally look to console, encourage, support, respect, enrich the lives of their members. JW's look to isolate those that are most in need of kindness, encouragement and support. At a person's lowest point, JW's find it necessary to unload that person and punish any who attempt to help them.

@joe134cd - It's quite possible. Could be that immediately on admitting me, my name was passed on to JW clergy visitation list. The local elders must have been busy with life or something else for the 6 days I was there. [But I'm not complaining - at all!] It could also have been my sister who notified the local elders and asked for a visit. I still don't know for sure. But I hope that my experience helps make others aware of how quickly their fade can be jeopardized.

This experience was upsetting at the time. And it might still be upsetting now if it happened again. More just the idea of violation of my privacy - especially in such a sensitive setting - that would anger me. Happily, there seems to be no trace of my JW history on my current medical records. But if the question ever comes up again, I will take more aggressive stance at the very beginning of the admissions process.

To be forewarned is to be forearmed.

-Aude Sapere (meaning: Dare to Know; Dare to Have Wisdom/Understanding; Dare to Think for Yourself.)

45

My Mom is in the hospital

by JeffT in

jw
friends

my mother broke her hip last week.

she had an emergency partial replacement surgery friday night.

we don't know how she did it as we have caregivers with her at all times, she may have fallen while in the bathroom for a few minutes.

AudeSapere

From the little I have read here about your mom, she has lived a very full life and has been generous and gracious in her legacy. Sorry to hear she is not well. I hope she is comforted by having her children near.

-Aude.

16

Great to see you all!

by KW13 in

jw
friends

it's heartwarming to see so many new faces (and some older ones) playing their part in this thriving community.

so many more free minds!

.

AudeSapere

Wow! I was thinking about you, KW13 about a week ago and then missed this thread until today. Good to hear from you. Really glad to hear that things seems to be going well.

'Little' Noah is almost 7??? OMG! Where have the years gone???

Other than busy, how is your life? Do you still have contact with your JW family? Have others left since you did?

-Aude.

148

Any seniors looking for association?

by cultBgone in

life is tough when you've spent your best years in the borg...how do you reconnect when kids are grown and you're close to retirement age?.

AudeSapere

What general area do you live in. It might help to spark some specific ideas.

-Aude.