LivingInReality

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Posts by LivingInReality

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  37

  help! family mbr reading my 3 yr old My Book of Bible Stories

  by limbogirl in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my soon to be three year old son asked me yesterday if i was dying.

  i was shocked that he knew the word 'dying' and asked where he heard it.

  he proceeded to tell me that his aunt (a jw) read him a story about jesus twiste (christ) and jesus was dying.

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  LivingInReality

  touchy subject.... but if i may share my feelings as a mother of a 3 year old myself....i respect the feelings of others that you could just counter the effect of your JW ex-relatives by empowering your child with the ability to reason for himself but there is something more important to take into consideration....

  your child is only 3... when he sees pictures in the "My Book of Bible Stories" of people on a rock as the flood waters are just about to swallow them up with faces of pure fear, or Lot's wife turned into a pillar of salt, or Jezebel getting thrown out a window for the dogs to eat her....(need I go on?)... this is not the shit you want your 3 year old to have to ponder over. These images are a brilliant strategy on the part of the society to begin their mind control through fear of our little ones.

  Reason with your child all you want, but those are images and stories that a 3 year old will be affected by. As parents we don't let our kids watch blood and gutts movies, or see pictures of mutilated dead people etc. etc. Why would we allow pictures depicting a "loving" god killing people who didn't listen to him? No matter what you say to "undo" what he might see.... they are going to KEEP showing him the book, keep telling him stories, and keep trying to instill a fear in him.....

  My vote is to put your foot down with the family.... this is YOUR child. It is YOUR responsibility to keep your little one free of all of the fear that those sick mind controlling cult members dish out to a child. I agree with all the others who said to get a restraining order and do whatever it is to make sure that they don't see your child again unless they stop. Give them the choice...if they don't listen, you gave them fair warning.

  Remember something else here..... if they don't listen to you about leaving religion out of your child's life, they are disrespecting your right to raise your child.... and that sets a precedent for the rest of your child's life... do you want your child to eventually see that they have no respect for your role as the parent?? At first they don't listen to you about this....next it will be something else, and then something else... Put your foot down now and let them know that when you make a choice about the way your child will be raised, it's your choice to make and if they can't respect and abide by your rules...then there is no place for them in your child's life.

  Good luck....

  shannon
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  71

  I found this VERY offensive. What about you?

  by Gill in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  watchtower, may 15th 2006.

  (back page).

  the value of 'a weaker vessel'.

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  LivingInReality

  uh-oh, it seems the Watchtower is backing themselves into a corner.... remember the talks we would have about "Masculinity and Feminity" especially at the assemblies? They talked about Jesus "giving way to tears" when he heard that his close friend Lazarus had died? ....Well now, doesn't crying denote some "emotional limitation" on Jesus' part.... either they need to do some damage control to assure everyone that Jesus wasn't gay... or that women being the emotional ones, hence having "emotional limitiations" is not as demeaning as it sounds.... oh the tangled webs they weave when they practice to deceive....
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  "Joined-As-Adult" JW's: What need did the WT fulfill for you?

  by Check_Your_Premises in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  .

  were you able to fulfill or remove that need in some way?

  did fulfilling that need make it possible or easier for you to exit the wt?

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  LivingInReality

  I was raised a Witness too.... but my dad came in as an adult, fresh out of serving in Viet Nam...and brought my mom in with him. My now ex-husband, came in at 20...after leading a life going nowhere through drugs and alcohol. It seems to me that people who are searching for "answers" about life are prime pickings for the organization. It's easier for people in a weakened state to have someone tell them everyday "this is what music you can listen to... these are the clothes you can wear, this is the way you need to lead your life...." and it takes the stresses out of their lives for having to make decisions for themselves.... eventually when they grow a bit stronger as individuals, it's too late...their enslaved.

  Face it, isn't it easier for people to do for you , then to have to struggle with doing for yourself.... i think that's one of the greatest snare tactics for the Witnesses.... remember they always preach to "find the meek" what they are really saying is "find the WEAK"... they prey on people who are in vulnerable emotional times... don't you ever notice how much attention is given to new inductees... the constant invites to gatherings, people coming over with meals, car rides given if needed.... quite a picture of "family" love... which dries up over time when their real nature takes precedent of becoming a policing agency trying to "turn people in" and get others in trouble. It's like the Salem Witch trials of the 2000s.
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  26

  shouldn't we wait till we're 30+ to be baptized?

  by annalice in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i believe we were taught that jesus was around thirty years old when he was baptized.

  now i was always told that the bible mentioned specific things like times and dates for a reason .as a guide for us to follow.

  so by telling us his age this would seem to be very important for us .

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  LivingInReality

  Let's see.... You can't date until you're of the age of marraige.... you can't get married (in the organization or a KH) until you're baptized.... if we waited until we were 30 to get baptized and then subsequently could get married... what brother would wait for sex AND not masturbate until he was 30..and what sister would wait for sex AND not masturbate until she was 30....?? SEE !! It's all about sex. (kidding, well just a little)

  I completely agree....they should allow the kids to go through those most crucial hormonal teenage years then enter young adult hood, before letting them get baptized.

  Have any of you seen the documentary that they did on the Amish? When the Amish children reach a certain age (I think its 16 or 17) they allow them one year to go and get wild...sex, drugs, electricity....and then after they have gotten their fare share of sinful behavior, they have to make a decision, Am I going to come back to the life of the Amish or Do I like reality better? If they choose to go out into the world, they are shunned (disfellowshipped in our terminology) for the rest of their lives.

  I think Witnesses should let everyone do that.... for one year, before they are planning to get baptized, let them go all out... get those f'n tatoos, oral sex (OOOO, how bad!!) cigarettes, booze, drugs....and the list goes on, get it out of their system, then they can make a choice. I forgot the biggest sin of all......education. Let them even think for themselves !!! Under those circumstances, they could weed out the ones who will eventually contaminate the flock and the real controlable ones will stay....
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  4

  Those wonderful, insightful, platform talks.......

  by LivingInReality in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  ...so annalice and i were discussing this topic the other day and now i pose it to you.

  remember all those talks from the platform where the brothers encouraged the congregation that as far as putting in hours in the field ministry that we must remember that if brother a can only put in 5 hours a month and he puts that 5 hours a month in, then he is doing all that he can (applause, applause) and if brother b can put in 50 hours a month and he does, there is no difference between brother a and brother b, because they are both doing all they can in jehovah's work.. well then, why is it that if brother a faithfully puts in that 5 hours a week, he can't carry microphones, he can't lead the congregation in prayer and he can't hold any priveleges, because he doesn't put in hours that match the national average??

  isn't that making brother a feel like shit and that he is unworthy?

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  LivingInReality

  ...so annalice and I were discussing this topic the other day and now I pose it to you.

  Remember all those talks from the platform where the brothers encouraged the congregation that as far as putting in hours in the field ministry that we must remember that if Brother A can only put in 5 hours a month and he puts that 5 hours a month in, then he is doing all that he can (applause, applause) and if Brother B can put in 50 hours a month and he does, there is no difference between Brother A and Brother B, because they are both doing ALL they can in Jehovah's work.

  Well then, why is it that if Brother A faithfully puts in that 5 hours a week, he can't carry microphones, he can't lead the congregation in prayer and he can't hold any priveleges, because he doesn't put in hours that match the national average?? Isn't that making Brother A feel like shit and that he is unworthy? I thought his 5 hours are the same as someone else's 50? How do people accept this crap?

  And here is another question: If it's called a "Watchtower Discussion" why can't anyone ever ask questions that make the elders squirm and have to answer in front of the congregation.... if anything, I would think that it would be the best way to start planting some seeds of doubt. If I wasn't disfellowshipped I'd go back just to do that. Oh that's right.... I would be disruptive and asked not to come back or I'll be trespassing, right??

  take care you guys.
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  8

  Still going to meetings??....

  by LivingInReality in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  good day..... i am very interested in hearing from anyone who is on this board that is still going to meetings.

  i was wondering.... .

  since you find yourself on this board with countless people who have left and are telling their personal stories, not to mention exposing that organization for the brainwashing cult that it truly is.... is this helping you to leave and make the final departure?.

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  LivingInReality

  Good Day....

  I am very interested in hearing from anyone who is on this board that is still going to meetings. I was wondering....

  Since you find yourself on this board with countless people who have left and are telling their personal stories, not to mention exposing that organization for the brainwashing cult that it truly is.... is this helping you to leave and make the final departure?

  Speaking from experience, I think I always knew that I didn't want to be a Witness, but it was going to be a harder journey to leave and you find yourself staying out of convenience, not to mention all of the feellings of doubt, guilt and straightforward fear....but if I may be so bold....why do you keep going? I only ask because I'm really interested...I think it will help me understand why it took so long for me to walk away when ultimately I knew I was going to. But I always wonder why I kept subjecting myself to everything, especially judicial committees. And are you here to find the strength to leave.... or do you think you never will be able to because you feel you have to much to lose?

  Can you imagine? We think that 3 men have the right to take us into a room privately and interrogate us? And we still answer !!!!!! I finally got in trouble because of "sexual misconduct." To this day I will always believe that they ask as many questions as they do so they can go home and whack off to the fantasies that they wish they could be participating in. And how uncomfortable to put women in that position to tell three men what they are doing in bed, or how many times etc. etc. Yes, all questions I was asked...."Gee brothers, I'm up to about 4 times a day..." as if doing it 4 times a day is worse than doing it once...it's still sex isn't it? Perverts!!!! They probably go home and say, "C'mon honey, Sister so-and-so is doing it everyday, why can't you?" ha.

  In the real world, if our employers called us into a room and asked the same kind of questions they would be stuck with one hell of a law suit for sexual harrassment, but yet we still think these guys can behave in the same manner and we have to abide by their "laws" of disclosure. I salute all of you that had your wits about you to tell them to go to hell and not answer to them.

  Anyhow, I think my main point, before I began to talk all of your ears off, was wondering why some of you who seem so convinced that it's not the place to be, still go..... and I only ask out of love, friendship and curiousity...not judgment.

  have a good days everyone.

  <<shannon>>
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  27

  Newbie on board....

  by LivingInReality in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi gang,.

  i'm new to the board and i wanted to say hello.

  my name is shannon, i'm from upstate new york.

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  LivingInReality

  (surreptitious): Honey!! Is that you??? Yes, the beer is on the way, and when you're ready I'll go lay in bed on my back to give you your "just do"...and don't forget after you go potty give me a call so I can wipe your ass too. I love being your posession!!! Oh, is my skirt too short??

  Man...you had that down.

  The shame of it is, we were best friends and he was my adventure buddy...we grew up together. But with every passing year they gained more control over his head and he lost who he really was and became a "Borg" as I've heard others say (love that analogy).....I feel bad for the 'brothers' there is so much pressure on them to have priveleges and strive to be servants or elders and if there house isn't running like a Nazi home, they suffer feelings of inadequacies, that is a way to control a man, emasculate him...this organization is truthfully sick and evil.
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  14

  was it gossip? or just exposing the truth?

  by LivingInReality in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  remember all the talks from the platform that dealt with gossip or mumuring??

  in my old congregation....in just one year....one couple who was close to another couple and had been spending lots of quality time together decided to expand their horizons and partner swap !!!

  one spouse in each couple was an elder's kid !!!

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  LivingInReality

  misspeaches--- just like Eagle-1 I was one of the few who people trusted to come and bear there souls to, I sometimes think it is because they saw me as the one person who was "real" I was constantly being criticized for my manner of dress (I had a gothic flare), my choice of music, my choice of recreation (I enjoyed anything that made me happy, Lollapalooza or the Orchestra, an art gallery or gasp! an R rated film)....and I never kept what I did a secret or felt ashamed when I was questioned. Remember most people DON'T do those things because they think that they will suffer major ramifications....when really the elders can't do a damn thing, because it is not a hard core rule...it is only suggested that we don't do certain things....we just lived in so much fear it wasn't worth the chance. But we also saw what would happen to the people who chose to push the envelope, they were blacklisted, just like me...fine with me...I found most Witnesses to be so boring they were afraid to even engage in stimulating conversation for fear Jehovah's lightning bolt nailed them in the middle of the coffee house. It was like, "Okay..I get it, we don't vote, but we can still talk about current events and what is going on in the current administration..what do you think?"....and all you got were blank stares, you could sometimes see the blood rush from some people's faces as if they were waiting to see the skin melt off of my skull like some scene out of Indiana Jones. But amazing how behind the scenes....those same people would call me up secretly or get together with me at lunch and tell me everything.... they always wound up pulling me into judicial meetings as the "second witness" to what I knew, which I would refuse to partake in... I didn't want to be a kindergarten tattletale. God, they are so immature. To be truthful, in the almost 30 years of being a Witness, as an adult with all of the friends that I had, I doubt I could honestly say that a single one of them is truly happy....they just don't know anything else and are too afraid to leave the only world they know.
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  14

  was it gossip? or just exposing the truth?

  by LivingInReality in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  remember all the talks from the platform that dealt with gossip or mumuring??

  in my old congregation....in just one year....one couple who was close to another couple and had been spending lots of quality time together decided to expand their horizons and partner swap !!!

  one spouse in each couple was an elder's kid !!!

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  LivingInReality

  Remember all the talks from the platform that dealt with gossip or mumuring??

  In my old congregation....in just one year....one couple who was close to another couple and had been spending lots of quality time together decided to expand their horizons and partner swap !!! One spouse in each couple was an elder's kid !!! The ministerial servant's son was found to be dealing drugs....to other kids in the hall. One servant was having an affair with his sister-in-law. A pioneer was caught, by the FBI no less, for committing identity theft by using the identities of others in the congregation to get credit cards and cell phones, and was using the Kingdom Halls address to receive her mail and the elder she was having an affair with was retrieving the mail for her..... do you guys want me to go on....because I have some other doozies !!!!

  Now.....we were told.....NO GOSSIPING, NO MURMURING!! I realize why now..... if everyone in the hall knew what was going on...realized how corrupt and horny the elders really are wouldn't they start to lose the control over everyone's mindset that as Jehovah's people we are set apart from all the filthy practices that are out there in the world? Last estimates were...40,000 a year disfellowshipped on grounds of sexual immorality....hmmmmm. Do Kingdom Halls breed these repressed desires only for them to become the epitome of what we were supposed to condemn? I dare say yes. And my favorite part...we were all supposed to be like the gestapo and turn in people, becoming a policing agency to put our fellow brothers and sisters before the firing squad of the judicial committees. Out of paranoia it seems everyone wants to get everyone else caught to keep the eyes off of their own wrongdoing. Hey...they should give you 3 extra field service hours on your time card for every successful capture of an inappropriate blow job between pioneers. Now I know why they took so many coffee breaks!! Wow... the light does get brighter every year doesn't it?? LOL.

  Your thoughts..... and I would LOVE to hear other stories of your own experiences of our spirit appointed leaders' angelic behavior. Remember, they were are shining examples.
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  27

  Newbie on board....

  by LivingInReality in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi gang,.

  i'm new to the board and i wanted to say hello.

  my name is shannon, i'm from upstate new york.

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  LivingInReality

  Hi Gang,

  I'm new to the board and I wanted to say hello. My name is Shannon, I'm from Upstate New York. I was raised a Witness....was a late disciple (baptized at 19...oh what a bad girl) and married at 20 to a man who's greatest goal in life was to be an elder...(he never got past ministerial servant). I was always the black sheep, which should have told me from the get go to get the hell out, but brainwashing is pretty powerful isn't it? No matter what congregation I belonged to...the elders never liked me, because I loved to think, question, analyze and worst of all, I loved education. What a rebel, huh? My lightbulb moment? I was discussing this with annalice, who is another member of this board (thanks for telling me about it), and have known and loved her as one of my dearest friends for over 15 years..... there are long durations of time that the little things add up, gearing you towards your final departure, but there is always that one moment when the timing is just right and you finally hit the wall..... mine? well, after living in a marraige where I played the dutiful Christian "capable" wife, working hard, knowing my place in Jehovah's marital arrangement (definition: subservient second-rate citizen)...I decided that I wanted to get the college education that I was deprived of and start taking classes. The law was laid down by the lord of the house (definition:you have a penis, you are the king) "Why oh why would you go to college and waste your time that would be more suitably spent studying for meetings, going out in field service or having bible studies, and why go to college to get a degree in a world that is going to end shortly anyway??" To which I replied, "Well gee honey, you and the other brothers get together a few times a week playing in your 'Witness Band' spending money on musical instruments, and your time could be spent doing the same things.....WTF???" The answer was "I am the head of this household and the foremost authority on its spiritual needs and my answer is NO".... Well... that was my moment. I told my husband....we're done. I deserve to be happy, and this organization has stripped me of any happiness I could have ever had in life, from what I lost throughout my childhood, to what I lost in a marraige that was based more on how "Jehovah" told him he could love me (I'll post more later on the sexual aspect of that thought, won't that be a fun thread?) rather than what his heart told him. And here I am !!!!!! I was disfellowshipped at the age of 29, which was 4 years ago..... and the saying Born Again has never taken on a greater meaning.. I felt like a newborn in a big, big, big world. And I'm glad that all of you are a part of it, because I would never wish that organization on even my worst of enemies, and for all of you to find the strength to leave, it speaks volumes on your characters without me knowing any of you....but we all share one common bond, and that is being survivors of that cult. I used to think that being a part of a board such as this, or still fuming over the organization, could only be destructive, it gives too much time and attention to them even after the fact.... but I've come to realize that unless people have experienced what we have, no one will ever know, or appreciate what we've gone through, and still go through. And whether or not we have been out for one year or twenty years, those moments still happen where we can't help but be reminded of our horrible experiences, feelings of loss, feelings of guilt or regret, and if it means turning to a network of friends who can be a listening ear to remind us....it will be okay, that's not our life anymore, we are truly free....then one, ten or twenty years later...we can be thankful for one thing that the organization gave us......each other. I only wish we could save the rest of them, the families and friends that are still captive to their lies and manipulations...but you can't win them all.

  Hello to you all, and I'm looking forward to getting to know you. Oh, and by the way, I'm happy to announce, that college education I was forbidden to pursue...well a 4.0 GPA and Dean's list isn't too shabby, now is it? Guess women do have brains and can handle more than just the dishes. Jehovah needs to move out of the Dark Ages.

  Have a good one.

  << Shannon >>